Rebane's Ruminations
March 2022
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George Rebane

Allowing Russia to exercise asymmetric control of Ukraine’s airspace during its unwarranted, illegal, and rapacious invasion of the country is a big mistake.  At every turn in this war and the lead-up to it, the west, led from behind by Biden, has been visibly and overly concerned about how Putin may respond to this or that initiative designed to dissuade or delay the conquest of Ukraine.  Even politicians ignorant of history have now seen how such behavior does nothing to stay the hand of the tyrant.  Does no one on our side counsel that we too should demonstrate our strength against tyranny by actions that would concern Putin as to how we may react to his next atrocities?  At what point do we say ‘Enough!’?  No dictator with territorial ambitions has ever stopped on his own; they have all had to be stopped by nations allied with a common purpose to restore a humanitarian and peaceful world order.

My own strong opinion is that were we to populate Ukrainian skies with F-22s and F-35s (inviting other NATO nations to join), thousands of lives would be saved and the war would soon be over.  As Joe Lieberman also argues (here), in doing so we would be implementing “responsibility to protect”, the international norm that was unanimously adopted by the United Nations World Summit in 2005.  As I argued in the 12mar22 Scattershots (here), there is no natural stopping point for Putin before he controls the Eurasian continent.  And the more of his successes we continue to tolerate, the bigger will be the resulting war required to put an end to such conquests both in Europe and Asia.  If we don’t start Putin worrying about his own survival now, then when will there come a better time to re-establish the Westphalian world order?

[Addendum]  A longtime reader (@502pm below) contested the wisdom of NATO allies imposing a no-fly zone over Ukraine with the now widely accepted prognostication that such a tactic would immediately cause Putin to escalate his invasion into a cross-borders nuclear war – in short, WW3.  It was offered as the most probable response and ensuing scenario.  In my 547pm I rejected that as the only possible contingency, and offered the much more likely alternative contingency were we to continue Biden’s strategy of a limited defense that in effect is no defense.  This is corroborated hourly by Putin’s rapid expansion of the scope of his invasion, now expanding it into western Ukraine with attacks on multiple targets with scores of cruise missiles.

The west’s current response that lets Russia maintain air superiority to support his overwhelming numbers of mechanized infantry, armor, massed artillery, and amphibious assault will result in the inevitable ‘rubbling’ of Ukraine, no matter how ineptly the Russians execute their land attack.  To date, the west led by Biden, has made it clear that saving Ukraine is not our top priority; minimally irritating Putin is.  Given our feckless support and promise not to do more, President Zelensky will soon come to the decision to either surrender sooner and save Ukrainian lives or surrender later, leave Ukraine in a pile of rubble, and sacrifice tens of thousands of lives to no avail.  As he continues to shame NATO, Zelensky will do the right thing and save lives if the west is not willing to up the game and also start giving Putin worries as to what we will do.

And the latest surrender of Ukraine will cement Putin’s list of conquests – Georgia, Chechnya, Donbas, Crimea – as the proper strategy to continue expanding Russia.  We will inevitably then fight in Poland and the Baltics.  It will also affirm Xi Jinping’s assessment (repeating that of Hitler, Stalin, and Tojo) that America is now a weakened and fearful paper tiger, willing to surrender all in order to assure peace in our times.  Appeasement will most certainly bring about a drastic change to an Orwellian-structured world order.  My counter contingency of today’s ongoing appeasement has a long history of being practiced along with the mass suffering by all concerned.  And this contingency has a demonstrated high probability of coming to pass.  Putin pulling the nuclear trigger and thereby assuring his place in history as humanity’s ultimate pariah, eclipsing Mao, Stalin, and Hitler, is to me a reach and a low probability event.

So that’s the debate.  It’s all a matter of probabilities that the opposing sides assign to their contingencies going forward.  I’ll take my stand with history and Putin’s desire to live to fight another day.

[16mar22 update]  Brookings Institute leftwing maven William Galston is a nationally known regular contributor of progressive perspectives in the WSJ.  In the paper’s 16mar22 edition (here) he concludes “We shouldn’t risk nuclear war, but there’s still a lot more we could do” while arguing that we have a “moral obligation to help Ukraine against Russia”.  In supporting his argument he uses profoundly misguided and inappropriate examples of America’s reticence to intervene in the Rwandan slaughter of Tutsis and the 1964 stabbing of Kitty Genovese while bystanders watched and did nothing.

In these citations Galston misses two major points that characterize the Ukrainian war.  First, the assailants in both cases were weak, and not able to overwhelm the proximal agents able to aid the victims.  And second, neither attacker was prepared or capable of continuing his murderous rampage beyond committing their initial atrocities.  This is not the case with Russia invading Ukraine.  To the world Putin has made it clear that his intentions have been and will continue to be more than simply the return of a compliant Ukraine into the resurging Russian empire.

And echoing Biden’s peremptorily cowering announcement (joined by many Republicans), that the US will do nothing to risk nuclear war with Russia, seals an extremely dangerous future for all, while not reducing the eventual risk of nuclear war one whit.  For the decades during the cold war it was the prospect of MAD (mutually assured destruction) that reined in the USSR and kept us from a nuclear holocaust.  Had the Left’s ‘better Red than dead’ become the geo-strategic policy of the west and NATO to contain communism, we would all be fluent in Russian by now.  MAD worked only because Moscow knew we were willing to risk a nuclear war as we implemented policies (the ‘minor wars’ presaged by George Kennan) to stifle the spread of communism.  Without communicating such risk to the Politburo, MAD would have been toothless.

So, the bottom line for us today should be to counter Putin’s nuclear saber rattling with that of our own – ‘if you pull the nuclear trigger Vlad, we will incinerate you.’ – and bring back MAD. The time to stand up to a thug is early in the game before he and his star chamber become invested in the success of his previous threats – that should be our Plan A. The later we trade in our wish bone for a back bone, the more likely the thug will be willing to initiate a nuclear exchange.  Remember that Stalin blinked in 1948, Khrushchev in 1962, Brezhnev in 1981, Gorbachev in 1989.  Today again there is no endpoint in sight for retreating from such threats and conquests that does not involve eventual wholesale worldwide misery.

Anybody have a workable wishbone Plan B?

Posted in , , ,

148 responses to “Ukrainian no-fly zone (addended and updated 16mar22)”

  1. scenes Avatar
    scenes

    OK, I’ll play Putin.
    I just hit Ramstein with a nuclear Ikander-M.
    Your move.
    https://www.usni.org/magazines/proceedings/2017/february/escalate-de-escalate

    Like

  2. scenes Avatar
    scenes

    pardon. ‘Iskander’. I was looking at something else and my fingers dun slipped.

    Like

  3. George Rebane Avatar

    scenes 502pm – OK, I’ll play Biden. We let Putin take Ukraine, and motivated by that Xi invades Taiwan, and Putin advances on the Baltics. Your move.

    Like

  4. Bill Tozer Avatar
    Bill Tozer

    Dr. Rebane
    I may not like your strong feelings on a no-fly zone with maybe the Brits and a few Canadians helping out, but you just laid out the formula to win.
    I remember Trump’s Inaugural Speech when he went briefly of script at the end of the sentence and said we will no longer be involved in wars…..trail off…that we cannot win. That we cannot win…..heard it with my hears, saw it with my eyeballs, but not in the official WH text of the speech. Akin to Obama at in his early weeks in Cairo telling the Shias, “I am one of you.” Not in the official WH transcript.
    We will no longer be involved in wars we cannot win. Winning is the goal of war. We can’t win doing what we are doing. We can do the Article 5 stuff for the Baltics and protect NATO until the end of time, but that ain’t winning against Vlad the Impaler Putin.
    So, I can’t argue with your plan, strategy or passion….if we want to win. That is the question. Do we have the political will and to lead the charge? Ukraine winning is synonymous with our winning? Perhaps.
    Putin announced that civilian food aid and clothing convoys from the south and SW will be considered the same as enemy military convoys. He will strike any aid to Ukraine, be it military or humanitarian. It’s all aiding and abetting the enemy to him.
    Did you know that Nord Steam 2 is but one of four Nord Streams. Another is carrying natural gas to Germany as we speak. Never stopped.
    Looks like this is a job for the guy with the Big White Hat in Washington to lead the charge with a few deputies following close behind. Whether I like it or not, the US is still the world’s cop. France may kick it up a notch, you never know. Poland is ready to get in there and kick some ass.
    But, do we have the political will to win? Majority, per recent polls, is ready for a no-fly zone. Those bombs that detonate 150’ off the ground suck at the oxygen out of your lungs on the ground and with a slow be explosion burning the oxygen out the whole city block. War crime stuff. Putin is willing to win at all costs….are we? We are the only western nation in the world, besides Britain to a lesser extent, that has the military power to fight two wars on two fronts at the same time. Is Putin winning not an option? Putin winning is appearing to be not an option.

    Like

  5. scenes Avatar
    scenes

    ” OK, I’ll play Biden.” Pudding cups incoming.
    You didn’t do anything as Biden. You just moved the Putin and Xi pieces.

    Like

  6. Don Bessee Avatar
    Don Bessee

    The mask is slipping off sometimes especially when stressed like this lap dog –
    https://www.foxnews.com/media/washington-post-jennifer-rubin-voters-stupid-blaming-biden
    😉

    Like

  7. Don Bessee Avatar
    Don Bessee

    And another example of them really believing how stupid the voters are –
    Pelosi claims government spending is ‘reducing the national debt,’ not causing inflation
    https://www.foxnews.com/politics/pelosi-government-spending-national-debt-inflation
    😉

    Like

  8. scenes Avatar
    scenes

    Don, you’re probably in the wrong thread.
    George, I thought of a good first step as Biden, so here’s my suggestion.
    Step 1. Use Russia as a tool for political gain. It should be worth a few points in the midterms.
    https://twitter.com/ReallyAmerican1/status/1502045426333093896
    In the final analysis, it’s all about seizing and holding power after all. The rest is just a sideshow.

    Like

  9. George Rebane Avatar

    scenes 607pm – Au contraire Mr scenes, I did much more than just ‘move the pieces’. I showed fears like yours to lead us to check, mate, game on the new world order. It was ever thus.

    Like

  10. Don Bessee Avatar
    Don Bessee

    The people know that the bs about putins inflation is not going to erase the last year of disastrous decisions largely based of kissing the green luddites’ asses –
    Biden ‘does not care’ about small-town America, South Dakotans say: ‘If he did care, Keystone would be going’
    After canceling the Keystone XL Pipeline, President Biden’s slogan should be ‘butchering booming business,’ an energy CEO says
    https://www.foxnews.com/us/biden-small-town-america-south-dakota-keystone-xl-pipeline
    😉

    Like

  11. fish Avatar
    fish

    ” I did much more than just ‘move the pieces’. I showed fears like yours to lead us to check, mate, game on the new world order.”
    ????
    George….you want to take another run at this sentence….I have no idea what message you are trying to convey here?

    Like

  12. Don Bessee Avatar
    Don Bessee

    Yelling get off the lawn is not a stagey creepy grampa joe and the axis of evil owns your weak ass –
    The general’s claim of total invincibility came hours before as many as 12 missiles struck near a sprawling U.S. consulate complex in the northern Iraqi city of Irbil on Sunday, in what a U.S. defense official and an Iraqi official said was a strike launched from neighboring Iran.
    No injuries were reported in the attack, which marked a significant escalation between the U.S. and Iran. Hostility between the long time foes has often played out in Iraq, whose government is allied with both countries, as Breitbart News reported.
    https://www.breitbart.com/middle-east/2022/03/13/irans-general-salami-claims-firm-upper-hand-against-all-enemies/
    😉

    Like

  13. scenes Avatar
    scenes

    GeorgeR: “scenes 607pm – Au contraire Mr scenes, I did much more than just ‘move the pieces’”
    Nonsense.
    I gave you a move, a highly likely one. As Biden you could respond, or not. You might as well just have claimed that aliens landed and forced everyone to the peace table.
    Truth is, a no-fly zone at this point, while fun to think about, is wildly irresponsible. Insanely irresponsible and would likely cause escalation to use of theater nuclear. and then off to the races.
    Hopefully any sane US administration does the obvious thing and cuts a deal with the Russians. Having taken the ridiculous route of already shooting all of the non-military ammunition, we are left with just our good looks.

    Like

  14. scenes Avatar
    scenes

    fish: ” George….you want to take another run at this sentence….I have no idea what message you are trying to convey here?”
    Rather than a countermove, perhaps he’s proposing that if we don’t defeat the communists in South Vietnam, they’ll be on to Thailand, so we should bomb Vladivostok.
    Any plan that involves truly backing the Russians into a corner needs to include giving me a couple of weeks notice for house hunting in eastern Idaho.

    Like

  15. scenes Avatar
    scenes

    …it is interesting to think about the current rules of engagement in Ukraine. These proxy wars look to evolve in the same way.
    It’s OK to ship in arms, but the handover is a sticky issue. Foreign volunteers appear to be OK. Any use of NATO personnel actually within the country has to be on the extreme down-low. Absolutely no airplanes or indirect fire allowed across a national, non-neutral boundary. Physical transfer of planes in a hay wagon or something is pushing the limit. Refugees are allowed as a form of weapon. Someone should write up the rules (probably already done in internal documents).
    My own feeling is that some US planners got exactly what they wanted, for the Russians to exhaust themselves on the backs of a neutral country. Their optimal strategy is to keep the war going as long as possible by importing the right amount of fuel. Twas ever thus.

    Like

  16. Scott O Avatar

    scenes 12:11 – Ha ha!
    Yep – Eastern Idaho.
    On the western side the prices are stupid. The house at the end of the block just went up on the market for 3 times what they paid 6 years ago.
    Right now I’d be more worried about the US dollar than the bomb. Current events just might push China to align with Russia to start the move towards the Yuan as the world’s ‘stable’ currency. As stupid as the Biden admin is about a shooting war, the current bunch of insanity in DC is worse as to a currency battle.
    “Increasing the fed budget decreases the debt.”
    and “increasing our oil production won’t lower prices.”
    Yeah – and aiming the rifle at yourself is the best way to shoot the enemy.

    Like

  17. George Rebane Avatar

    Mr scenes, thank you for engaging on this much debated tactic. My apologies for not making the 547pm response so obtuse. The likely modes of expanding the war are an important topic to consider and debate. I was hoping someone here would respond with the ‘no-fly zone equals nuclear war’ argument that is today’s widely shared wisdom. Chamberlain’s ‘peace in our time’ was also widely welcomed at his 1938 return from Munich. Only curmudgeons like Churchill (not PM at the time) called it correctly. I’ll addend a more complete response above.

    Like

  18. scenes Avatar
    scenes

    A decent article.
    “Russia’s war in Ukraine has an infinite number of scenarios, but scores of war games point to two likely paths.
    Wars sometimes start easily, but it is a tenet of strategy that they are always unpredictable and extremely hard to end. Putin’s war of choice in Ukraine is already escalating faster than most experts would have imagined just a week ago. ….”
    https://carnegieendowment.org/2022/03/03/how-does-this-end-pub-86570

    Like

  19. Bill Tozer Avatar
    Bill Tozer

    Another view: Buck Sexton
    https://fb.watch/bLeACH0IHh/

    Like

  20. George Rebane Avatar

    Of course there are more ways to counter the Russians than establishing a no-fly zone. But none of these appear to our pusillanimously intrepid strategists as being less likely to piss off Putin. And hour after hour, that continues our main concern which has got to warm the cockles of Vladimir’s heart. We have him right where he wants us.

    Like

  21. Paul Emery Avatar
    Paul Emery

    George
    Of course the big concern is that Putin will push the button so to speak if we go no fly. Can you assign odds to him doing that if we follow your strategy?

    Like

  22. Gregory Avatar
    Gregory

    Punchy, “assign odds”? Really?
    I suspect Putin has been waiting for gas prices to be filling his coffers since November 2020.

    Like

  23. show me kid Avatar
    show me kid

    A review of gas price increases show a steady rising since the end of January 2021. Yeah, I’ll agree Putin pushed them up in the last month, but they have headed up since Biden took office.

    Like

  24. Barry Pruett Avatar
    Barry Pruett

    I would give you good odds Paul.

    Like

  25. George Rebane Avatar

    PaulE 359pm – Anyone can “assign odds” on anything yet to happen. I don’t know what use such an exercise would be outside of soliciting bets. But one can also elicit a quantitative measure of belief – i.e. a probability – for such events that can be used for decision making by the subject himself or others using the subject as a ‘domain expert’. Claiming no such expertise for myself, my assessment is that the probability is at most 0.01 that Putin will escalate to WW3 subsequent to our establishing a Ukrainian no-fly zone. And my probability for Putin continuing to invade neighboring territories is 0.999, were he allowed to conquer Ukraine and make it a Russian fiefdom again. Biden’s cowering is killing Ukrainians, and will kill uncountable numbers more should Ukraine fall.

    Like

  26. Paul Emery Avatar
    Paul Emery

    Thanks George
    Do you think Trump would be following your suggestion?
    As far as our assessment on what things would be like in two weeks I believe that in a short time we will be focusing on humanitarian support for the refugee’s and those left behind. Terrible situation.

    Like

  27. scenes Avatar
    scenes

    [EMERY] “Do you think Trump would be following your suggestion?”
    lol.
    Oh for God’s sake.

    Like

  28. George Rebane Avatar

    PaulE 620pm – Would Trump dive under his desk every time Putin rattled his saber like Biden is doing? NFW! As I stated before, I don’t think the invasion would have happened had Trump been re-elected. It is remarkable how many talking heads and commentators are now calling for Biden to stop cowering so as to shorten the war and save what’s left of the world order.

    Like

  29. Bill Tozer Avatar
    Bill Tozer

    Show Me Kid @ 4:54 pm
    Prices have been rising since the day of the Nov, 2020 election. Good thing Trump filled all the strategic reservers to the “tippy top” when it rock bottom @ 9 bucks when they put the global economy to sleep (coma?) in March, 2020. Thank you President Trump. To the tippy top at that price.
    ——————
    Punchy is just looking for George’s assessment of what will happen in Ukraine. What are the odds? What are the 17 Intel Agencies best guess, their probabilities, their take a stab at it? Nothing wrong asking Dr. George’s best guess with the information he has, which are only publicly available information. Nothing wrong with that.
    But, Punch Punch Punch you could not control yourself and had to ask for the 9th time what would Trump had done if he created this killing field in Ukraine clustergluck? Solve it. Fix the mofo. “If you guys can’t fix it now, then You’re Fired.” Get out of here, knucklehead. That is what Trump would have done. In addition, he would be on the phone with Putin promising Hell Fire and Brimstone will be raining down on Vlad the Impaler’s head the kind of which the World has never seen.
    BTW, the Book of Proverbs means Book of Probabilities.
    You can boil it all down to two paths. The fork in the tree. The rest of the top 4-12 are just branches of the two scenarios. But then again, things can turn on a dime, the wildcard.

    Like

  30. Don Bessee Avatar
    Don Bessee

    The snowflakes would just melt away when faced with invasion –
    Further disheartening is that the youngest Americans, those ages 18-34 and most physically capable, were even less likely to stay and fight. Only 45% said they would remain, while 48% would flee.
    Comparatively, two-thirds of the 50-to-64-year-old cohort said they would remain. That’s not wholly surprising given that so much of the recent discontentment with America is concentrated among the youth. Equally unsurprising is that political differences also play a role in willingness to defend our nation.
    https://currently.att.yahoo.com/news/americans-fight-country-ukrainians-recent-220206902.html
    😉

    Like

  31. Paul Emery Avatar
    Paul Emery

    George
    You never have expressed why that would be so (no invasion) if Trump were still President. You only express that Trump would be unpredictable which is a weird policy for a President to have.

    Like

  32. Don Bessee Avatar
    Don Bessee

    SO the ponytail of ignorance thinks being a dottering old predictable pussy is a good thing LETS GO BRANDON!
    😉

    Like

  33. Don Bessee Avatar
    Don Bessee

    Creepy grampa joe is hurting the ones he wants to think its vlads fault but they dont –
    Inflation hitting nonwhite voters hardest, imperiling Democrats in 2022 midterms, new poll finds
    Inflation hit a 40-year high in February
    https://www.foxbusiness.com/economy/inflation-hitting-nonwhite-voters-hardest-democrats-2022-midterms-poll
    😉

    Like

  34. George Rebane Avatar

    PaulE, no president has ever played poker with his cards exposed.

    Like

  35. Paul Emery Avatar
    Paul Emery

    George
    So are saying you think Trump has the smarts to play poker with Putin and you trust him even though worldwide destruction by nuclear war is a possibility with a wrong move.

    Like

  36. Don Bessee Avatar
    Don Bessee

    Must be a statment not a question since there is no question mark @917 Quick call the fue LOL
    😉

    Like

  37. Bill Tozer Avatar
    Bill Tozer

    Well, we have an assessment of what is going on in Ukraine on the ground, then we have an assessment of how Putin will react, and now we have an assessment of what Trump would have done if he had to deal with the problems go Biden faces in the here and now.
    Ok, Punch, an assessment of Trump, Putin, and Joe Biden.
    1) Putin snatched Crimea and put troops in the two eastern Ukraine oblasts in 2014 under the Obama-Biden Administration.
    2) Putin did not invade Ukraine under Trump, Trump winning election in 2016.
    3) Putin invaded Ukraine again, early in the Biden-Harris Administration.
    Putin invades Ukraine before and after Trump’s Presidency. The common denominator is both invasions is Joe Biden, 2014, and 2022.
    So, the real question that begs to be answered is not what Trump would do if Putin invaded under his watch, put rather, what did Trump do to keep Putin from evading? What did Trump do that the Democrat Administrations of Obama-Biden and Biden-Harris did not do or have not done that Trump did?
    There is nothing in the history of the Trump Administration’s relations with Russia that suggests Vladimir Putin would have invaded Ukraine under Trump. Not a shred of evidence anywhere. We have ample. evidence that Putin chose not to invade Ukraine with Trump at the helm and even more ample evidence that Putin will invade if Joe Biden is either VP or POTUS.
    Why did Putin not invade under Trump is the question which must be answered to understand Putin, Trump, and Joe Biden. Putin feared Trump’s strength, like all bullies fear strength. Putin does not fear Biden and sees only weakness. Again, like all bullies do.
    Putin is being opportunistic now. There is absolutely no reason based on past results that could even remotely suggest Putin would act differently that he did under Trump’s first term than Putin would behave under a Trump second term.
    Joe Biden is the reason Putin acted differently before Trump and after Trump. No other explanation is plausible.
    Punch, Punch, Punch. Can’t answer, you promised.
    ————-
    Dr. Rebane, if you utter the name Punchy in a reply, Paul Emergy vowed not to respond and you would instantly be off the hook of ‘What Would Trump Do?’ Tempting, isn’t it lol.
    Or, one could simply say is not what Trump would do, it’s what Trump did.

    Like

  38. Scott O Avatar

    “You never have expressed why that would be so (no invasion) if Trump were still President.”
    Maybe…
    Just possibly…
    Trump WAS president and Putin didn’t do shit.
    As soon as Pudin’ Cup wandered in, Putin saw his chance and the invasion was on.
    We don’t have to guess or imagine what-ifs.
    All the dead and suffering Ukrainians are certainly grateful for Paul and his millions of fellow idiots for voting in Biden.
    “Yeah for sure we are suffering and our country is being ruined, but thank God for no more mean tweets!”

    Like

  39. scenes Avatar
    scenes

    In the interest of countering Paul’s inevitable shanghai of an otherwise interesting question. (remember, it’s all about Paul, not Trump. People who make a living on stage can’t stand not being the center of attention, even if it’s negative…)
    “The west’s current response that lets Russia maintain air superiority”
    oddly: https://www.nzz.ch/english/despite-advantages-russias-air-force-playing-limited-war-role-ld.1674497
    Not only is airspace in play, but it’s used less than you think. The result of poor practices on both sides? the presence of decent anti-aircraft capabilities on both sides? Russians holding back for self-protection from NATO? Russians AF essentially set up for defense rather than offense? Dunno.
    My bet is there is a lot to learn here by everyone. It’s the first time in quite a few years that you have a conflict between tolerably competent people on both sides. Planning built around blowing up tribesmen with Toyota pickups tends to fall apart.
    The capability no doubt translates to hard problems for a ‘no-fly zone’ as in the past they assume ownership of the sky. In this case, it’s really code for ‘unrestricted air war’ which inevitably leads to targeting bases (wherever they are), radar/antiaircraft facilities, the mobile type of same, etc. Escalation chances are 100%. Hilarity ensues.
    from the ‘odd corners of the conflict’ department, check these out.
    https://old.reddit.com/r/volunteersForUkraine/

    Like

  40. Bill Tozer Avatar
    Bill Tozer

    Questions:
    What ever happened to the outcry that T Rex and and Exxon Mobile and Putin would take over all the oil in Europe and the Middle East and The World!! ??????
    What ever happened to the BIG CONCERN that Trump had no foreign policy experience and Putin would play Trump like a puppet? Trump is in Putin’s back pocket, don’t you know?
    Punchy, punchy, punchy.

    Like

  41. paul emery Avatar
    paul emery

    Scott
    Thats it???
    “Just possibly…
    Trump WAS president and Putin didn’t do shit.”
    Thanks for the deep thinking

    Like

  42. Scott O Avatar

    Paul -“Thanks for the deep thinking”
    It’s called noticing reality, Paul – you should try it some time.
    Trump=peace in Ukraine.
    Biden=national and international dumpster fire.
    But you prefer the mess we’re in just so you can do your ‘ha ha, we got rid of Trump’ dance.
    Nice.

    Like

  43. paul emery Avatar
    paul emery

    Scott
    Biden got us out of Afganistan with minimal casualties something Trump, Obama and Bush didn’t or couldn’t do.
    Who is responsible for the thousands of American casualties in the 20 year disaster started by Bush and the Neo-cons.

    Like

  44. scenes Avatar
    scenes

    Scotto, you are breaking the rules.

    Now and in the future I will not respond to any question unless address it to my name. Paul Emery or just Emery will do.
    Thanks

    You have to admit it would be amazing if the Russians shut the door on these guys. How do you extricate them? Russian military transport plane? A PR stunt that could go massively wrong.
    https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/three-eu-country-leaders-take-train-kyiv-show-support-ukraine-2022-03-15/

    Like

  45. Bill Tozer Avatar
    Bill Tozer

    Punchy @ 8:21 am
    Who is responsible? Why, the Ragheads, of course. Remember 9/11? I did not think so. Man, Biden could have taken the billions of military hardware he left for the Tailban tally wackers and given it to Ukraine. But, nooo. How many Americans and civilians lost their lives on Sept 11th? Sept. 11 was the day Biden originally chose to exit Afghanistan with the bands playing and joint American and Afghan flags flying and a big televised departure of American troops from the Kabul Airport? All that pomp and ceremony went down the tubes, thus proving the deadline to withdrawal from the hellhole was arbitrary and based on conditions the Ragheads must abide to.
    Last 18 months of Trump’s superior foreign policy: 0 (zero) American military deaths.
    First 7 months of Biden Presidency: 13 US Marines killed.
    Trump told the Taliban that if one hair on an American head is touched, he would rain down Hell Fire on the Tailban leader’s home village where all his family lived and where he grew up and Trump and destroy that village and wipe it off the face of the Earth.
    The withdraw from Afghanistan was contingent on conditions and OUR timetable, not the camel jockeys and bush rats timetable.
    Punchy, punch, The Ponytail of Ignorance and his unicorn pony tales.

    Like

  46. Scott O Avatar

    from Paul – “Biden got us out of Afganistan with minimal casualties…”
    Ahem.
    The subject here is the Ukraine, Paul.
    Bringing up the disaster of what Biden did in Afghanistan hardly helps your case.
    BECAUSE of what Biden did in Afghanistan probably added to Putin’s decision to invade Ukraine.
    Weakness and timidity invite bullies and thugs to act.

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  47. Bill Tozer Avatar
    Bill Tozer

    Scenes @ 7:20 am
    ‘Russia Fired Cruise Missiles At Ukraine From Russian Airspace, Pentagon Confirms’
    Makes no-fly zone irrelevant
    https://www.dailywire.com/news/russia-fired-cruise-missiles-at-ukraine-from-russian-airspace-pentagon-confirms

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  48. George Rebane Avatar

    The liberals continue (e.g. @821am) to celebrate Biden’s deft (daft?) exit from Afghanistan – demonstrating once more that alternate realities are real.

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  49. George Rebane Avatar

    Ward Carroll (retired USN RIO) delivers a comprehensive summary of the Russian invasion to date – ‘EXPOSED! What the Ukrainian Invasion has Revealed about Russian Military Power’. (H/T to reader and correspondent)
    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=liKtIsMoPoA

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  50. paul emery Avatar
    paul emery

    George
    Why do you think Trump failed in his promise to pull us out of Afganistan? We were there for 20 years before Biden with thousands of casualties so you can’t blame that on him or can you?.

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