Sandbox – 17jun15

June 2015
S	M	T	W	T	F	S
	1	2	3	4	5	6
7	8	9	10	11	12	13
14	15	16	17	18	19	20
21	22	23	24	25	26	27
28	29	30

OUR LINKS

YubaNet
White House Blog
Watts Up With That?
The Union
Sierra Thread
RL “Bob” Crabb
Barry Pruett Blog

Sandbox – 17jun15

17 June 2015

[Apologies for getting a little pissed in the 'Agnosticism vs Atheism' comment stream. Here's a new sandbox, the old one was getting more than full. gjr]

Posted in Comment Sandbox

390 responses to “Sandbox – 17jun15”

fish

20 June 2015

This went pretty much exactly as I expected Jon.
Well of course it did….nothing escapes ~~The Spanish Inquisit~~ the cool, detached and penetrating gaze of Steven Frisch.
I got pulled over here by Fish, posting just one portion of a quote (with Greg following with another truncated version) where I said in essence that a 21 year old does not become a neo-nazi mass murderer on his own. He is taught by someone to be that, and rather than just own up to the fact that we have a problem in our society with endemic and institutional racism, the apologists here took every opportunity to deny that fact.
Yes….yes…institutional racism…the kind that normal people can’t perceive and only highly trained “codebreakers” like you can decipher and translate for the rabble. Thank god for you.
“A 21 year old does not learn about Rhodesia, apartheid, ZOG, and the “Jewish Worldwide Conspiracy” by going to the ice cream parlor. Someone taught this kid that owning and using a gun was OK. His friends and family knew he was a crack pot and that he owned a gun. He told his friends he was going to shoot up a college. He had an on-line presence that people knew about where he espoused his racist ideas.
There is a network of right wing, Nazi, Klan, White Supremacist, violent anti-governmen activists that teach young men crap like this. The Nazi web site Storefront has more than 300,000 followers in the United States, there are more than 700 active hate groups in the United States many with a strong on-line presence promoting their philosophy, there are hundreds of racially motivated hate crime a year, and these people have killed, maimed and destroyed the lives of more Americans that all of the ‘home grown’ islamic terrorists and groups combined, several times over.”
With the internet a reasonably functional 21 year old kid can find all manner of filth online….from beastiality to xenophobia! What is shameful but not particularly surprising is both your and jeffys…..err….. “jons” attempt to link the tragedy in South Carolina to your political opposition here.
“There is an industry of promoting Posse Comitatus, Ruby Ridge, Waco, Oklahoma City, and now Bundy Ranch and the Sovereign Citizen movement. The same industry promotes the Constitutional Sheriffs, Defend Rural America, the John Birch Society, the Promise Keepers (who have become quite radical) and the anti-Agenda 21 crackpots who have appeared in our community.
There are direct ties between many of the groups and people that have been invited in to speak at officially sponsored community forums in Nevada County (many by groups seeking to appear main stream like the Tea Party, CABPRO< the Republican Women) and more radical anti-government and racist hate groups”.
Probably not surprising that racist groups and those who don’t care for you overweening government would have common interests here. It’s revealing that in this racism takes a back seat to those who doubt government solutions. They are your real opposition.
Funny, the police Charleston, the South Carolina’s government, and just about every community leader from Charleston did not seem to have a problem admitting that there is systemic racism, and a legacy of racial violence, that still persists in their midst. They owned up to it pretty damn fast.
It’s not particularly surprising, they know who their audience is and (much like you) they know who writes the checks. Say the wrong things publicly and see your career disappear. “Public Servants” bark like trained seals at events like these. They’re just hoping they can tamp down the impetus to riot like in Ferguson until some other shiny object comes along to distract a slack jawed and largely slow witted audience.
But our own home grown ersatz version of the White Citizens Council seems to have a hard time coming to grips with it’s existence in our own midst. They come up with every conceivable excuse, as I chronicled above, for why their racism is ‘different’ than Charleston’s. They even promote the haters on a regular basis, post photos of the gatherings, and promote the ideology that those groups have embraced, under the guise of Constitutionalist or “Conservatarian” principles.
Again…it’s good to see your true enemy. Claims of racism is just your convenient hammer.
Steve while I think you are the least ridiculous poster from those on the left who frequents RR when race comes into it reason deserts you.
You can’t help it! Everybody has their weak points.

LikeLike
Barry Pruett

20 June 2015

Wow! Republican women are promoting racism. Steve, you are behaving like an ass now.

LikeLike
Scott Obermuller

20 June 2015

Hey Steve – there’s a certain online presence for all sorts of hate. For folks of all colors and creeds. But only certain ones bother you.
I’d say that’s racism, if I didn’t know better. I’m sure you’re not, so please explain why only some hate groups bother you.
Not holding my breath.

LikeLike
Jon

20 June 2015

I suppose these folks are crackpots and liars. You guys want volumes of documentation relating to what Steve is talking about? Its all here.
http://www.splcenter.org/

LikeLike
Todd Juvinall

20 June 2015

Steve Frisch is actually the person I would suggest is the racist. Not one person of “color” in his life. These self hating liberals are really mentally ill and need some help. I scour the Truckee yellow pages for some numbers.
The posters here other than the libs are not racist at all. We never bring up the scummy crap like “jonnie ” did.

LikeLike
Don Bessee

20 June 2015

I am sure Furth is very proud of Frisch’s dedicated recitation from their self guilt liberal handbook. I somehow have a suspicion that there are some slave owners in someone’s family tree a la Ben what’s his name (new batman)! It used to be limousine liberals, now its my green life dedication is better than yours, ‘I have the new tesla not that lame old prius, pass the chardonnay my brotha. Anyone who does not want more money for my projects is de facto Racist.’ That contrived leverage does not work on everyone. 🙂

LikeLike
Todd Juvinall

20 June 2015

The Southern Poverty Law Center is a hate organization of the worst kind. Jonnie has now shown us why we were correct he is a racist.

LikeLike
fish

20 June 2015

Posted by: Jon | 20 June 2015 at 06:36 PM
Yes! Now you’re getting it. Morris Dees came up with the most effective way to separate scared people (are we picking up on a trend ….cough…cough…Global Warming) from their money! There is a reason people refer to it as the $PLC!
But hey…if you like them!

LikeLike
Jon

20 June 2015

Yeah Todd, I’m the only person in the country talking about this, right? Maybe in your provincial circle of life, but millions are engaging this today. Even Jeb! is today hedging and waffling about the Confederate Flag in SC, even at the risk of the upcoming SC Primary. Mitt Romney came out on this issue and has had enough. Normal folks have had enough of defending the indefensible cracker heritage BS. Racism, and yes, its tied to divisions in the Republican Party.

LikeLike
fish

20 June 2015

Posted by: Jon | 20 June 2015 at 06:46 PM
OMG not the republican candidates?!?!?! OH noes!
Jesus jeffy you’re like an old woman!

LikeLike
Don Bessee

20 June 2015

SO jj (jeffy/jon) Did you finally figure out who were the fraudsters I spoke of yesterday? Union above the fold today, hard to miss. Its interesting your (willful?) lack of knowledge of that long running story of scumbags. Did you have friends at one of the companies or the defunct title co? A notary perhaps? Way too many did not go to trial much less jail. Congrats Ms. Kaput and all the Reformers!

LikeLike
Jon

20 June 2015

Its cocktail time apparently for at least a couple of the locals! Gets amuzing around this time.

LikeLike
Scott Obermuller

20 June 2015

Well – this certainly puts a few knickers in a twist.
“I hate with a passion the whole idea of the suburbs.”
Gee – who else doesn’t like suburbs? Looks like we have a whole lotta shutting down to do on the internet. That whole ‘smart growth’ deal from Portland has to go.
Just sayin’.

LikeLike
Gregory

20 June 2015

No one here has been “defending the indefensible cracker heritage BS”, “Jon”.
Perhaps “Jon” can provide something more than Frisch’s innuendo and guilt by imagined association, but I doubt it. Maybe “Annie Fox” can help you with that.

LikeLike
Jon

20 June 2015

“The Southern Poverty Law Center is a hate organization of the worst kind” Todd Juvinall 2015
Apparently there is only one man in America crazy enough to make that bizarre claim. Of course groups that track hate groups must be hate groups- how logical!

LikeLike
fish

20 June 2015

HEY….how bout that spirit of scientific inquiry emanating from the Vatican?!?! Truth above all else it seems!
http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/europe/how-climate-change-doubters-lost-a-papal-fight/2015/06/20/86af3182-15ce-11e5-8457-4b431bf7ed4c_story.html
Don’t tout the party line don’t bother to attend!
Il Papa!

LikeLike
Jon

20 June 2015

hey fish, just ignore comments about the Republican primary if you don’t care about it. Almost all of your cohorts here (Gregory excepted) are hard core Repubs and care deeply about such matters as they battle the forces of evil progressive thinking! The right wing of America is following the candidate statements very carefully as they hunt for RINOs!

LikeLike
fish

20 June 2015

Posted by: Jon | 20 June 2015 at 06:56 PM
Damn straight…..crazy like the F….B….I! Goodness but you are a grasping nitwit.
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2014/mar/28/editorial-the-fbi-dumps-a-hate-group/

LikeLike
fish

20 June 2015

Posted by: Jon | 20 June 2015 at 06:59 PM
Sorry jeffy…err…”jon”…..I’ll comment when and about what I want to!

LikeLike
fish

20 June 2015

Posted by: Jon | 20 June 2015 at 06:56 PM
By THE WASHINGTON TIMES – – Friday, March 28, 2014
Something called the Southern Poverty Law Center sounds like a harmless do-good organization of idealistic young lawyers out to make life better for poor folks in the South, most of them likely black. Who wouldn’t want to make life better for poor folks?
But looks can be deceiving. The poverty law center, known by its initials SPLC, is actually a money-making scheme — some have called it a “scam” — of an Alabama lawyer who set out years ago to get rich on the backs of the poor and the duped.
The lawyer, Morris Dees, once defended Ku Klux Klansmen accused of beating up a black reporter covering the Freedom Riders, later raised money for George Wallace and then for George McGovern, and one day had an epiphany, or at least a profitable idea.
“I felt the anger of a black person for the first time,” he later said of that case, “I vowed then and there that nobody would ever again doubt where I stood.”
Where he stood was a place where he could parlay the good will of the unsuspecting into great riches. Mr. Dees and a partner, Millard Fuller, practiced law and ran a direct-marketing business. He made a good living, but he wanted to get rich.
“Morris and I … shared the overriding purpose of making a pile of money,” the partner once told Harper’s magazine. “We were not particular about how we did it. We just wanted to be independently rich.”
With his conscience in tatters, Millard Fuller sold his share of the business to Mr. Dees, gave the proceeds to charity, moved away and founded Habitat for Humanity, building houses for the poor.
Morris Dees stayed in Alabama and built a 200-acre estate with tennis courts, a swimming pool and stables for his horses, and instead of doing good, did well.
“Poverty” quickly became enormously profitable. He was soon collecting millions and paying himself a salary far in excess of those paid to the heads of such advocacy groups as the ACLU, the Children’s Defense Fund and the NAACP Legal Defense Fund.
The director of the Atlanta-based Southern Center for Human Rights, which defends poor defendants in death-penalty cases, once told Mr. Dees he was “a fraud and a con man” because of “your failure to respond to the most desperate needs of the poor and powerless despite your millions upon millions, your fundraising techniques, and the fact that you spend so much, accomplish so little, and promote yourself so shamelessly.”
Mr. Dees and his “center” continued to slander the innocent and raise money from the unsuspecting, warning in fundraising appeals of “a firestorm” of hate that would soon “engulf the land.”
The SPLC never identifies the hate groups about to engulf the land, who they are or where they are assembling their regiments of engulfers. With the Ku Klux Klan shrinking to insignificance, the SPLC, which is thought to be sitting on a treasury of a quarter of a billion dollars, has lately turned its lurid appeals to prosperous but frightened gays.
“Hate crimes” by SPLC definition now include Christian opposition to same-sex marriage.
This week it emerged that the FBI, which has included SPLC data as “a resource,” has finally severed its link with the organization and dumped SPLC from the bureau’s Hate Crime Web page.
The FBI offered no explanation of why now, but the dumping follows appeals of 15 family groups to Attorney General Eric Holder Jr. and FBI Director James B. Comey to sever the connection. We think that was a good day’s work.
Read more: http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2014/mar/28/editorial-the-fbi-dumps-a-hate-group/#ixzz3dex1Ndjv
Follow us: @washtimes on Twitter

LikeLike
Don Bessee

20 June 2015

Sooooo, again the ‘jon’ ducks the issue of local criminal scumbags, did they advertise with you and donate in the approved progressive way? Come on jj, bring the hate for the Reformers and all those folks who really do something to protect victims in the real world. Sounds like some self guilt about your patterns of indulgence; Gets amuzing around this time.’ So apoplectic and frothy that spell check can not even save the rhetoric major. lol!

LikeLike
steve frisch

20 June 2015

Posted by: Barry Pruett | 20 June 2015 at 05:52 PM
Gee Barry, what I actually said, as opposed what you claim I said, is,”There are direct ties between many of the groups and people that have been invited in to speak at officially sponsored community forums in Nevada County (many by groups seeking to appear main stream like the Tea Party, CABPRO, the Republican Women) and more radical anti-government and racist hate groups”.
You are correct that I should have been more precise and said, “The Nevada County Republican Women Federated”, who hosted Sheriff Richard Mack, who is a proponent of the radical and constitutionally unsupported theory that Sheriffs are the highest law enforcement officials in the land and do not need to follow federal law; a theory first popularized by the leader of the violent terrorist group Posse Comitatus and Henry Lamont Beach, and first published the theory in his “Blue Book”.
Mack also appeared on James Edwards white supremacist radio program appropriately titled, “The Political Cesspool”, and appeared at Bundy Ranch in company with white supremacists who were pointing sniper rifles at federal agents.
http://www.thepoliticalcesspool.org
Richard Mack is quoted as saying he prayed for the day when a sheriff would be the “first one to fire the next shot around the world and arrest a couple of IRS agents.”
Richard Mack is an acolyte of conservative Mormon theologian W. Cleon Skousen. Skousen was a leading light of right-wing radicalism, a theocrat who believed the decline of America began with passage of the 14th Amendment and its guarantee of equality for the former slaves (ironic isn’t it).
Skousen’s best-selling book published in 1958, The Naked Capitalist, warned of a cabal of global elites who were scheming to create a worldwide, collectivist government — what the JBS and Patriot groups now fear as the “New World Order.”
Skousen demonized the federal regulatory agencies and wanted to abolish civil rights laws, labor unions, the minimum wage, the income and estate taxes, the direct election of U.S. senators, the wall between church and state, and many other government programs and initiatives. Richard Mack is quoted by the Arizona Daily Star after seeing Skousen speak with 240 people in the audience as saying, “I don’t know what happened to the other 239 of them, but this one was converted.”
Richard Mack wrote the forward for white supremacist Randy Weaver’s book, Vicki, Sam and America; How the Government Killed All Three.
Richard Mack was interviewed by the Christian Identity Movement magazine, The Jubilee, but unfortunately I can’t find a copy, and was also prominently featured on The Alex Jones Show.
I think the point I made is accurate–Richard Mack walks a fine line between mainstream groups like the Republican Women’s Federated, and extremist groups—and he does it intentionally, and it is evidence of the ‘direct ties’ I referenced, which the NCRWF might not have known, but they should have done better due diligence.

LikeLike
Jon

20 June 2015

Bessee, since I’m not who you think I am, I’m really sorry I cannot assist or comment on things you seem obsessed with. Best of luck to you.

LikeLike
Jon

20 June 2015

Don, I will say this however- I always get a kick out of your evening posts.

LikeLike
steve frisch

20 June 2015

Posted by: Jon | 20 June 2015 at 07:28 PM
I know Jon, the evening posts are always somewhere between a challenge to decipher……and leaving me wondering how many sheets he left on the clothesline.

LikeLike
Jon

20 June 2015

Steve,
Exactly. Its always an adventure on here during and after Happy Hour! In hindsight, I am really happy to have started the discussion on this tiny little forum about race, guns and politics in America. We have flushed out quite a trove of human psychology.

LikeLike
Todd Juvinall

20 June 2015

Frisch has lost his noggin. His explanation of his explanation is one from a tortured soul. It would be like me calling the SBC and front group for Communist Maoist murderers. I mean golly gee Steve Frisch, are you off the meds tonight?
Jon the SPLC is a hate group now bought off by global warming supporter money.

LikeLike
Scott Obermuller

20 June 2015

Our current pres was the proud member of a racial hate group until he ran for national office and his ‘mentor’ spilled the beans. Oops!
Time for another body under the Obama bus.
Steve Frisch advances a theory known as ‘an evil person uses flush toilets and so do you!’ I would have no trouble linking Steve to any sort of crap if Steve would just be honest and list EVERY book he’s read and ALL groups he likes. I listen to all sorts of folks and read every sort of stuff online. Just because you drink beer at the bar with a guy that turns out out to be a child molester doesn’t make you one.
You’re making cheap and small minded connections, Steve.
If you go witch hunting, you better watch your back.

LikeLike
steve frisch

20 June 2015

By the way, someone should have told the Nevada County Republican Women Federated that it was Sheriff Richard Mack who said their strategy at Bundy ranch was to put the women up front so people could see agents shooting the women first.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?t=104&v=cllweBGE3Ak

LikeLike
steve frisch

20 June 2015

Posted by: Scott Obermuller | 20 June 2015 at 07:49 PM
Yeah, well I don’t know how much closer you can get than hosting the guy that hung out pointing weapons at federal agents and promoting putting women in the front line to take the first volley if gunfire broke out.

LikeLike
Scott Obermuller

20 June 2015

Nice dodge, Frisch. “Yeah, well I don’t know how much closer you can get than hosting the guy that hung out pointing weapons at federal agents and promoting putting women in the front line to take the first volley if gunfire broke out”
So it’s just a matter of inches, now?
Kinda like – now that we know what you are, we’re just trying to determine your price.
Still waiting for you to be honest and give us the list.
Not holding my breath.
Next dodge – ?

LikeLike
Scott Obermuller

20 June 2015

And here’s Bernie! – just regular folk down at the old Brentwood hovel.
Says he won’t be controlled by a ‘handful’ of rich guys. One or two rich guys will suffice. He’s going with the rich guy that owns the railroads that transport oil and says he would have killed the pipeline. More oil will be spilled and lives endangered, but darn it, my rich guy needs his pocket filled. Just one of the volk. You were invited, no? Oh yeah, Bernie is just regular folk. You lefties just lick up the urine and grin. Bernie’s urine is green and sustainable. Slurp, slulp.
http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/bernie-sanders-wows-hollywood-progressives-804004

LikeLike
steve frisch

20 June 2015

Posted by: Scott Obermuller | 20 June 2015 at 08:13 PM
What, the list of every book I’ve very read? You are going to be waiting a very long time 🙂 I am sure the list is in the tens of thousands by now. I just looked at my kindle reader on my I-pad and I have read at least 400 books in the least 4 years.

LikeLike
Jon

20 June 2015

Well, well, well, the locals righties hosted a guy who has promoted violence against the government and advocated human shields. How sweet.
So if the local Repubs deny the association, how about a sincere apology for bringing that cretin here to Nevada County?

LikeLike
fish

20 June 2015

Posted by: Jon | 20 June 2015 at 08:27 PM
Always the “hecklers veto” with you……eh jeffy?
Sweet…..

LikeLike
fish

20 June 2015

Well retroactive “whiny hecklers ex post facto veto”.

LikeLike
Scott Obermuller

20 June 2015

Gosh – I missed this one :
“But I will state it loudly and proudly, I definitely believe that many people here are racists, and I posted similarities between the manifesto comments and comments made here over the years so readers can reflect on that.”
Names?
Facts?
Is there anyone one the left that can have an adult conversation? Is Steve the best you can come up with? Really?

LikeLike
fish

20 June 2015

C’mon Scott…..”loudly and proudly” …..that’s like having a crack research team investigating your opposition.

LikeLike
Scott Obermuller

20 June 2015

from Steve: “You are going to be waiting a very long time”
I can wait – you lefties never seem to be able to back up anything you belch out.
I’m still waiting for so many of you lefties to back up up anything you claim.
It’s always dodge and weave, isn’t it? Never a straight answer.

LikeLike
steve frisch

20 June 2015

Posted by: Scott Obermuller | 20 June 2015 at 08:46 PM
Nonsense Scott, I can’t give you a title of every book I’ve read, I started reading when I was 4 and never recorded them…it’s that simple….so you can belch all you want…it is a nonsense question.

LikeLike
Don Bessee

20 June 2015

WOW! The socialists go so nasty when confronted with the uncomfortable truths. Shall we check the FPPC big boys? How much money went to Dem candidates from the Hastert’s and Lesterts crews? How amuzing you are.

LikeLike
Michael Anderson

20 June 2015

Don Quixote’s misfortune is not his imagination, but Sancho Panza.
Franz Kafka

LikeLike
M. Andersen

20 June 2015

In the fight between you and the world, back the world.
Franz Kafka

LikeLike
Todd Juvinall

20 June 2015

ScottO, do you really want the few books? Jack and Jill, The swift brown fox? That is the extent of the smarts of the Truckee Troll. Racist pigs abound at the higher elevations.

LikeLike
Scott Obermuller

20 June 2015

It isn’t just the books – I also wanted to know what groups he associated with or admired. He won’t mention them. Instead he starts dodging with bull crap about books he read when he was 4.
Like all leftie cowards.
Won’t stand and deliver.
Dodges.
Runs.
He’s cornered by his own BS and he knows it.
Notice how the left has fallen silent about what they admire specifically?
It’s always generalities. Never actual people or groups. Now Bernie is verboten.
When George asked for folks to lay down their principles, every single leftie ran and hid. Every one.
“But I will state it loudly and proudly, I definitely believe that many people here are racists..”
You must be loud, but hardly proud.
Please name the racists.
Right – so darn proud, you just can’t back up your spittle due to your having to run your ass off getting away.
Folks that really are ‘proud’ back up everything they say and print.
If you are so darn proud, why don’t you name names and give evidence?
Steve? Steve? – just footsteps running off into the distance.

LikeLike
Jon

20 June 2015

Scott, you even write like a German. Strict. No nuance. Black and white. Nasty.
Yesterday you were reminiscing about the days when parents thrashed their kids. Hmm.
Some of us have the MO down.

LikeLike
Jon

20 June 2015

OK, back to the issue. Tired of responding to these long personal attacks on people.
Regardless of what some think, the Confederate Flag is MAJOR campaign 2016 issue. “South Carolina crackers- tear down this flag”!
http://www.nytimes.com/politics/first-draft/2015/06/20/mitt-romney-calls-for-removal-of-confederate-flag-at-south-carolina-capitol
Kudos again to Mitt Romney, no longer strapped to the inflexible, irrational base.

LikeLike
Bill Tozer

20 June 2015

Thought I smelled a sheet stain and, by golly, it leads back to the jonnie on the spot.
Totally off topic, but give the libs an old inch and they take a mile. Then, that ain’t good enough for them cause they want MORE. More. More, more.
http://www.dailyfreeman.com/opinion/20150621/letter-woodstock-town-board-was-unfairly-abused-by-smart-meter-opponents

LikeLike
Bill Tozer

20 June 2015

Oh boy. “Isn’t denying racism a form of racism?” Dunno. Me thinks it’s a pigment of your imagination.
On the brighter side, Obama in conjectuon with all the characters of good will in every liberal camp have by their actions been good for business. Berry berry good.
http://finance.yahoo.com/news/smith-wesson-nails-obama-did-115655106.html

LikeLike
Adam Floyd

20 June 2015

Gee Don, let’s talk about those uncomfortable truths….. Like the one that you moved into a mentally ill woman’s home and took out a loan to pay your taxes in the same amount she owes in child support (@$200K), and considering that you owed @$40K for the same thing I for one am not impressed with you to listen to anything that comes out of your mouth as time after time it’s consistently been BS.

LikeLike