A Conservetarian Credo (updated 17dec16)

March 2014
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A Conservetarian Credo (updated 17dec16)

17 March 2014

George Rebane

From time to time readers ask me questions about my ideology concerning this issue or that. I believe I have answered almost all of those questions either in the 2,000+ posts on RR and/or marbled in the 42K+ comments that this forum has garnered. However, since this is a place that attempts to dissect some pretty hairy issues, and we do try to hold each other’s feet to the fire when it comes to being consistent, if not coherent, during our debates, therefore it may be convenient if your host’s socio-political ideology, or structured belief system, or simply credo were to be found in one place.

I have perused my writings and a lengthier personal credo to assemble a first rough cut at what I call a ‘conservetarian credo’. I know of no other commentator who has presented such a structured and explicit compendium of their ideology. You can download the pdf here – https://rebanesruminations.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/03/a-conservetarian-credo_250921.pdf. As witnessed by its version date, this will be a living document added to and amended as new data becomes available, as I learn more, and as the error of my ways are made apparent to me. I have maintained a written credo for some considerable time now (with more categories than socio-political), and have been very interested to see how it has evolved with the years. I believe it to be a profitable undertaking and recommend it to others.

Also over the years, and specifically during the life of RR, I have made the strong statement that collectivists (especially our American collectivists) of whatever stripe always shun invitations to openly publish a document outlining their comprehensive socio-political beliefs. I base this conclusion on experience and the simple reason that such collectivist tenets will inevitably be drawn from embarrassingly banal ‘motherhood and apple pie’ platitudes, or alternatively that their specificity will prematurely expose things better left unsaid until a time when most collectivist goals are fait accompli. In any event, my invitation to publish the credo of any of our left-leaning readers stands, and more strongly I remain forever intrigued with what a self-proclaimed middle-roader might fill such pages now that 40% of country claims to be so situated.

A Conservetarian Credo_250921 Download

Posted in Critical Thinking & Numeracy, My Story

73 responses to “A Conservetarian Credo (updated 17dec16)”

Al

17 March 2014

Reb Bane – You writings always give a received radar reflection to two favored books ” Earth Abides” by George R. Stewart and “Ecotopia” by Ernest Callenbach.
May you continue to be a constructive force of nature.

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fish

18 March 2014

See Paul…property owners do have a few remaining rights!
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2014/mar/18/sc-pub-sparks-outrage-sign-calling-gun-owners-lose/

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Walt

18 March 2014

Fish.. I went to Texas a while back. There are signs posted on every business
if a weapon is allowed or not. I don’t recall see many ” no guns allowed”.
Even the hotel we stayed at was “gun friendly”.
But LIBs sure got brave going after small children who made the mistake of
just pointing a finger. Or eating their pop tart into the shape of a hand gun
just as the jack booted teacher walked by.

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fish

18 March 2014

If I recall correctly Paul was concerned that the right to carry would trump the right of a property owner to disallow weapons on their property. In the end common sense prevailed…..

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Walt

18 March 2014

Can’t argue with that.. If a shop owner doesn’t want patrons to “pack”, I do believe that’s his/her right, and most would honor that without gripe. ( there is always some that would complain)
It’s the thugs and goons that are out to rob the joint business owners need to worry about. A lot of good a sign would do.

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fish

18 March 2014

Hell Walt in a civilized world you oughta be able to check a firearm like checking a hat! Unfortunately though, a suggestion like this would undoubtedly lead to undies wedging ever so tightly in ass cracks among some of our societies more delicate and sensitive members!

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Walt

18 March 2014

Funny you mention ” checking it at the door”.
Grand Dad did that all the time when living in Mariposa Co.
Going to town hall meetings, or large public events. They DID have
a weapon depository at times. Back then there was no question if you had one or not,
Even Grandma packed a “lady’s” Colt. ( what I would give to have that gun in family custody.)
Nope,, I don’t think that would work today, Like you said, someone would have “kittens”..
There are SO many “maybes”,” ifs” “could” “might” “possibly” that happen.
Not that they ever would. Those reasons alone justify ” NO! ”
( Kinda like allowing mining.)

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Joe Koyote

18 March 2014

In a civilized world, a person wouldn’t need to pack a firearm in the first place. Our world is technologically advanced but hardly civilized.

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Walt

18 March 2014

Good try Joe, good try. “man” has kept the peace WITH arms. That goes back to the days of throwing rocks. History has also shown that the ” pacifists” of those vary same times were enslaved or killed.
So conceder yourself lucky in today’s age of being un civilized.
No unicorn utopia is ever going to exist. Time to face the facts.
And “O” has done SO well with that pesky Russian problem. WOW! a select few of Ruskys get their money frozen as “sanctions”.. YA!,, That’ll show’m!
So what does Putin do just for fun? ” Right back at ya’ Comrade…ha ha….”
Putin “sanctions” Warren Buffet, George Soros, Gates, Clintons, and a more!
All “O” and LIB “big money” and “big politics”.
Putin has “O” by the short and curlys, and kicking the U.S. around and making us look like fools to the world. And where does “O” go? Golfing, and the big Mooch is off on vacation abroad again, and on our buck. ( China is it?)

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fish

19 March 2014

In a civilized world, a person wouldn’t need to pack a firearm in the first place. Our world is technologically advanced but hardly civilized.
Perhaps your side could pass some more legislation requiring everything “to be just dandy”.

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Todd Juvinall

19 March 2014

JoeK, Ukraine unilaterally disarmed back during the dissolution of the USSR. In exchange they were guaranteed sovereignty and non aggression by the Russian Federation. They also demilitarized their country and gave up their arms (including their nukes) in exchange for non aggression. Do you think that was a wise move now that Russia has annexed their province of Crimea?

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Joe Koyote

19 March 2014

Just what exactly is “my side”? Once again you are politicizing a politically neutral statement. Given the war, violence, and greed on the front pages everyday, how can anyone claim earthlings are civilized? That people say they are arming themselves for protection seems to tell the whole story. Why would a person need protection in a civilized society?

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fish

19 March 2014

Just what exactly is “my side”? Once again you are politicizing a politically neutral statement. Given the war, violence, and greed on the front pages everyday, how can anyone claim earthlings are civilized? That people say they are arming themselves for protection seems to tell the whole story. Why would a person need protection in a civilized society?
Mea Culpa Joe…..I seem to be reading more into your statements then is actually there again.

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Todd Juvinall

19 March 2014

OK JoeK, just checking. Could you give us all a definition of a civilized society and tell us if there are any people’s or countries you believe are “civilized”?

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Walt

19 March 2014

Joe.. Take stock in UFOs? They must be more advanced in civility too… Right?
What’s a human or two getting probed now and then..? Up for the examination?
Speaking of getting probed,, see the word out of the EPA? ( and Joe’s hero)
A know nothing gov. employee wrote many an EPA reg.,, and followed “the end justifies the means” philosophy.
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2014/03/19/author-epa-playbook-report-claims-notorious-fraudster-was-behind-costly-epa/
Funny.. it’s the same guy who passed himself off as an undercover CIA guy.
Yup,, good ol’ Beale is the hero of all ECO nutjobs. Just like the fake scientist our own CARB hired because he “played ball” in the Lefty’s favor.
Bogus laws written by fraudsters to push an agenda. Facts be damned when the end justifies the means. Right Joe??

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Joe Koyote

19 March 2014

Todd– Do you think we live in a civilized world? If so, please name a civilized country or people.

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Scott Obermuller

19 March 2014

We certainly don’t have a ‘civilized’ fed govt.
http://fox5sandiego.com/2014/03/17/feds-raid-gun-parts-stores-despite-court-order/#ixzz2wPQ98hGv
How does a govt expect us to obey a court order when they obviously won’t?
Not the first time, either. Most citizens don’t seem to care, though.
In line with George’s theme for this post, perhaps Joe the K can enlighten us as to how we become ‘civilized’? My first thought is that we honor and obey our country’s supreme law – the Constitution.

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Todd Juvinall

19 March 2014

JoeK, answer mine first. I will answer your points not your question of a question. Is it that you cannot answer because you have no answer? Come on JoeK, it should be easy for you since you are so adamant about the point.

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Walt

19 March 2014

Scott points out one more “right” LIBS decided to resend.
The ” right” to build a weapon out of pieces.
Here we go again with the Liberal backed law “enforcers” breaking the law.
Another case of “we deem it illegal”. How does that fit in with your “civilized society” Joe?

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Gregory

19 March 2014

“In a civilized world, a person wouldn’t need to pack a firearm in the first place. Our world is technologically advanced but hardly civilized.” -Koyote
Ah, yes. A world where a strapping 20-something with a rock or a blade is king, and the aged or infirm are at their mercy. In other words, for the theists out there:
“God made man, but Samuel Colt made them equal”.
Koyote might proceed by letting fly with what country they think is “civilized”.

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Walt

19 March 2014

Joe.. Seen the fine upstanding individuals of the “civilized” society in the local paper? From the “perv” in the tree up in San Juan,, to the home invaders who beat up our elders. All to feed their “needs”. Ever read the police blotter?
Naaaa… We shouldn’t have guns. One of those break-in specialists might get hurt. That’s what insurance is for… Right Joe? To replace what those “pillars of the communities” take from us. Just a little ” Robin Hood” action right?
Think they rob the same places twice? ( only if they know there is no gun on the premises.) Ya’ better hope your not next on their list.
Maybe the sign on my gate that reads ” Beware of gun totting redneck” has kept me safe all this time.
Put up a sign that states that your anti gun Joe for all to see. Let’s see who gets robbed first. Why not? I’m sure you have good insurance to cover the loss, and you got Obamacare to cover the possible beat down you may get when they come to steal your stuff. ( You know,, those civilized degenerates Lefy’s love to defend.)

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Walt

19 March 2014

How is that “civility” going to work out when water and food get rationed in the cities this summer? A good portion of our farmers won’t get water to grow crops.
( plenty of water for dope growers I hear)
That Dearly loved Delta Smelt is more important than starving children who will also go thirsty. “Critters” over children… Only in a Liberal “civilized” world. Let that fresh water flow out to sea.
Too bad S.F. didn’t tear down Hetch Hetchy when they had the chance… Just a few votes short. Remember. That was all for “pretty”. Only LIBS can dream up taking an asset, and turning it into a liability. ( the billions it would take to “restore” little Yosemite into another park.)
You sure stepped in “it” this time Joe. Your going to be busy scrapping your Birkenstocks for a while.

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Joe Koyote

19 March 2014

My my.. It doesn’t take much to set off the peanut gallery does it. All I said was that I don’t think humanity is all that civilized and you each go off on some tangent that makes absolutely no sense what-so-ever and is completely irrelevant. Good job boys. Do you feel better now that you have vented your anger?

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Brad Croul

19 March 2014

Can you freeze fish? I heard that some fish freeze in lakes during winter and then thaw out the next spring. We could just scoop up a bunch of delta smelt and put them on ice – then start pumping. After the drought is over, thaw the little critters out and we are good to go. I know, that would make too much sense for our legislators.
I really think the better idea would be to follow Amsterdam’s example and construct a giant lock under the Golden Gate Bridge. Turn the SF Bay into a freshwater lake.
Bam – problem solved!

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Todd Juvinall

19 March 2014

No anger JoeK. You make statements then dodge answering questions to back them up. Than you use the childhood track of answering questions with questions. It would appear to me you have no answers but a lot of bloviation.

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George Rebane

19 March 2014

Humanity is never a gathering of people of homogeneous attitudes and proclivities. And civilization is equally distributed across a spectrum of well to poorly behaving people. Civilization is maintained by constantly battling the hooligans in the tail of the distribution. Doing so by whatever means – including an armed citizenry – does not mean that we have foregone being civilized, but merely that we continue to value civilization and defend it against eternal assault by the forces of darkness.

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Bill Tozer

19 March 2014

Mr. Koyote: I have said a time or two before that the first male born on this orb known as Earth murdered the second man born, his brother. No, we haven’t “come a long way, baby.” Don’t think his parents had navels.
Seeing all the young people in our Urban Jungles do one of those flash mob stealing frenzies at convenience store and even Box Stores makes me wonder if civilization has become less civilized. When Hitchcock’s Dial M For Murder hit the screens people were fainting and passing out in terror in the movie houses. It might appear that the Ozzie and Harriet era was more civilized and it if was, we have become more uncivilized.
Lord of the Flies says it all. Take away authority and you have mankind returning to his primitive nature. As Dr. Rebane pointed out, society always has had scum at the bottom of the barrel. I wholeheartedly agree with you there, Mr. Koyote, “that I don’t think humanity is all that civilized.” Human nature is what it is and it hasn’t changed, just controlled by internal self discipline or external nudges by the judges. Its just one big Skinner Box with too many rats in the cage.

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Michael Anderson

20 March 2014

George wrote: “(C)ivilization is equally distributed across a spectrum of well to poorly behaving people. Civilization is maintained by constantly battling the hooligans in the tail of the distribution. Doing so by whatever means – including an armed citizenry – does not mean that we have foregone being civilized, but merely that we continue to value civilization and defend it against eternal assault by the forces of darkness.”
These forces of darkness feed off of your paranoia, ennui, and your relentless search for hooligans at every turn. You are their food. The only thing you have yet to supply to them is the fork and knife. But I’m sure that is coming soon. Tis a pity…

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fish

20 March 2014

These forces of darkness feed off of your paranoia, ennui, and your relentless search for hooligans at every turn. You are their food. The only thing you have yet to supply to them is the fork and knife. But I’m sure that is coming soon. Tis a pity…
This is no way to open the busy commenting season Michael……that reads like a bad Clive Barker (and that’s saying something given the quality of his work) passage!

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Gregory

20 March 2014

“An armed society is a polite society. Manners are good when one may have to back up his acts with his life.” -Heinlein
Anderson is a force of darkness.

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Joe Koyote

20 March 2014

Todd 6:15 — To be blunt Todd, your question was stupid at best and didn’t deserve an answer. I stated that humanity was uncivilized and you asked me to name a civilized country. Duh.. there aren’t any.

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Gregory

20 March 2014

” you asked me to name a civilized country. Duh.. there aren’t any.”
Not even Switzerland?

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Walt

20 March 2014

Seen the “winners” in the paper today? Kidnapping of all things… HERE!!
Seems a certain part of society forgot how to teach their young right from wrong. ( lack of discipline at home and at school) Religion has been vilified by the Left. So much for the fear of God that kept our forbearers on the somewhat straight and narrow.
We can’t lock up those that do us harm, we installed revolving doors in our jails.
LIBS made it perfectly clear. ” Go ahead and do the crime.. WE will make sure you don’t do the time.” Great message Lefty’s. Thank the LIB judges who turn the criminals loose upon us. Prison has turned into adult “daycare”. Cable TV, Internet, ” prisoner’s bill of rights”.
Allowed to sue for any reason under the Sun.
LIBS should watch more episodes of ” COPS ” to view their handiwork.
HELL!!! We have government enforcers who disregard the rules of law, and even court orders. ( The FEDS raid gun stores for customer records even after a judge said NO!)
So our kids grow up seeing laws broken and little is done about it.
No wonder they get the idea they can go do that too and “get away with it”.
If things have become less “civilized”,, we can point the fingers at Progressive Liberalism. This is THEIR doing.

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Todd Juvinall

20 March 2014

Golly JoeK, I was always taught there were no dumb questions so I guess you are stumped about mine and had to dodge it. If I were you I would check off the planet since there is no “civilized “people left, not even you apparently.

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Joe Koyote

20 March 2014

Not even Switzerland? –You mean the country that specializes in hiding and laundering illegal money, stashing treasure the Nazis stole from the Jews and other financial misdeeds?

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Joe Koyote

20 March 2014

” If I were you I would check off the planet” Todd, are you suggesting I kill myself? Pretty uncivilized of a retort.
And yes, I am stumped at your question. Please explain what you meant and what you were looking for in a response? Was this some kind of clever word trap where if I named a country then you could attack my premise that humanity is uncivilized and if I didn’t answer then you could attack me for not answering? Either way you win.. good one Todd.

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Gregory

20 March 2014

The country of Switzerland doesn’t do that, JK (11:45), and from all accounts it’s a very pleasant and low crime place to live.
Now, is that despite all the machine guns in private hands, or is that one of the reasons for the public civility?

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Walt

20 March 2014

Joe.. I can find many a LIB right here in the U.S. that fit your “description” of the Swiss. Clean up your own house before pointing fingers at others. George Soros ( a BIG Lefty) is right in the middle of that. We have state government agencies that have stashed “illegal” funds.
Hell… Who needs the Swiss when we have Ca. doing the same thing?
Then when someone finds “treasure” ( just in the news) the state and Feds demand their cut. ( if the “finder” is lucky he/she may retain 30%)
Yaa… Gripe about the Swiss. Never mind “O” and Co. and their Wall St. pals. They make the Swiss look like armatures.
BTW.. The American Nazi Party backs Democrats.

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Todd Juvinall

20 March 2014

Sorry JoeK, if you can’t figure it out I will let you drift. Amazing!

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Walt

20 March 2014

Gregory.. JoKe doesn’t realize that the Swiss mandate ownership of automatic weapons by their citizens. It is commonplace to see young adults peddling around on bikes with an M4 or like weapon on their back.
They have NEVER trusted Germany or the Russians. And that includes today.

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Michael Anderson

20 March 2014

That all ya got Greggy? You can do better than that. Come on, dredge up some of the darkest bile in your Bitter Bucket and really have at it.

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Bill Tozer

20 March 2014

Mr. Anderson, so nice of you to come back here and I must add in such fine form. So, where did you stash that Mayalsian Airplane? Inquiring minds want to know 🙂
Mr. Walt (11:26am): Concerning the revolving door of society’s misbehaved, I am beginning to realize that it is the bleeding heart judges that are the real repeat offenders.
I can be civil and even civilized at times, but my strong self discipline and extrordinary will power prevents me from becoming at slave to it.

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Bill Tozer

20 March 2014

Ok, let’s bash the Swiss. If the Swiss are so civilized, why did they need to invent the Swiss Army knife? Hmmmm.
I once picked up a girl while galavanting across Euroland back in the day who I thought was Swedish. Got all excited. Then later after I drunk myself sober, I realized she said she was Swiss not Swedish. Then it all made sense. Wound tighter than a Swiss watch.

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Gregory

20 March 2014

Mike, I’m just looking forward to your meltdown when Obamacare flames out.
You never did answer that sticky question… do you have Republican clients? If so, how do you compartmentalize that hostility of yours?

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Michael Anderson

21 March 2014

There you go again Greg, just can’t help yourself trying to bring my personal business into the blogs. But without having any of your own personal business worth mentioning, I understand why you do this.
Well, I guess my time is up once again on the most unmediated blog on planet Earth. I’ll be sure to check in every now and then to see how your echo chamber is getting along. Have a great year fellas.

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Todd Juvinall

21 March 2014

Greg, Michael was asking personal information from fish on my blog. I guess he forgot.

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Michael Anderson

21 March 2014

Todd, that was personal information from fish regarding his employment that he has previously offered to discuss many times. I doubt you missed those conversations–it’s the very reason why he is “fish” instead of using a real name.
That’s the difference: I sign my real name and have made it abundantly clear that slurring my personal affairs, unless I have offered them up for discussion myself, is off limits. It’s the same thing you guys do to Jeff Pelline over here. It’s just plain bad manners. It also makes you look like creeps.
But believe whatever you want, Todd. I realize how hard it is to keep all of this straight when you have a head full of rocks.

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fish

21 March 2014

Greg, Michael was asking personal information from fish on my blog. I guess he forgot.
Nahhh….he was just trying to score cheap indignance points because I have and will likely continue to post from work. If only he knew that those moments are the least expensive I have during my day…..pointless high dollar phone calls…..multiple useless meetings (and rest assured…we routinely stuff multiple millions worth of salary and benefits into meetings that are little more than time killing reruns) …all more onerous to the taxpayer than me dropping a blog comment while on hold for the deputy yahoo from the State Department of Blah Blah Blah!
My guess was that Michael just woke up from his winter hibernation fully loaded with a combination of Scandinavian angst and poorly directly lefty “I’ve suddenly discovered I’m a taxpayer” syndrome.
I’m sure his mood will improve once spring training is finished and the regualr season starts….I know mine will!
Speaking of paying taxes….anybody else writing a check this year instead of getting a refund with no change in financial status?

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Todd Juvinall

21 March 2014

It cracks me up that the Burning Man nut gets all upset when anyone talks about him and his proclivities but we would not know any of that if he did not tell us. I posted a very polite comment up a couple from here yet the BM-P had to attack me and the rest. What does that say about him? My guess is he gets his money from taxpayer grants and loans so FISH, [pay those taxes man so he can survive. LOL!

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Joe Koyote

21 March 2014

I stand corrected. The country of Switzerland does not engage in financial misdeeds, it just passes laws that allows banks to engage in financial misdeeds. That makes them civil. So do machine guns. How you folks turned this into a discussion of gun ownership is beyond me. There is more to civility than owning guns or not. Just so some of you don’t waste your time going off again, I am not questioning your right to own guns (I own a couple of shotguns myself). The fact that people need guns for reasons other than hunting food, to me, is highly uncivil. That’s all.

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