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Sandbox – 5sep19

[Apologies for the delay in providing new sand.  You all seem to have covered every imaginable issue in the last Sandbox.  And there is more to be said about it all.  Haven’t heard of more dropouts in the derby beyond Gillibrand – we’ll update scores when I get home.  Sally forth!  gjr]

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259 responses to “Sandbox – 5sep19”

  1. Gregory Avatar
    Gregory

    Glorious clean sand!
    I’m still waiting for “Robert Cross” to come back and apologize to me and my family for the smear.
    Bobbi, as do some others, has an idea that top colleges, like Mudd, are country clubs for the children of the wealthy. No, Bobbi… they’re a shit load of hard work. There is no royal road to competence in math, physics, chemistry, engineering and the humanities, simultaneously.
    And the children of the wealthy aren’t all that smart.

    Like

  2. L Avatar
    L

    crabb @ 7:34- Pretty sure turbine blades kill millions of times more birds when used as intended (20% of the time) than they could floating off Midway forever.
    Not even sure how that could happen. Birds certainly won’t be ingesting the things, but maybe if enough albatross line up on one edge, it could go Guam and drown them.
    At least the floaters don’t bother bats, deafen people or cause psychosis.

    Like

  3. Todd Juvinall Avatar
    Todd Juvinall

    Cartoon boys bigged out apparently. He sees what an idiot he was with his assertions here. Typical.

    Like

  4. rl crabb Avatar
    rl crabb

    Yo, Scotty. Sorry for the delay. Some of us actually sleep at night.
    The whole point of my comments are aimed at your contempt for any effort to move the ball forward on energy and the environment. Any new technology is going to have flaws. Creative minds will hopefully work out those problems.
    But not here, where all you do is bitch about any energy source that isn’t fossilized. I only watched some of the CNN marathon, but I was sorry to see most of the candidates ignore nuclear power. Just like the other technologies, the problems can be addressed.
    As for my bad attitude when I come here, it’s just a reflection of the hate and contempt I see from most of the comments. I really don’t give a shit whether you like me or not. It’s the nation that suffers from the inability of this left-right schism.
    Okay, you can go back to mocking me now.

    Like

  5. Todd Juvinall Avatar
    Todd Juvinall

    ScottO isn’t it rich that Crabb comes here with his shit attitude and his shit opinions to criticize others and namecall. I think it is a mental disorder. Bit liberals are like that. They never do squat about the tungs they complain about but they sure know how to excoriate others. Maybe Crabb had stock in Solyndra and is really upset and has not recovered yet.

    Like

  6. George Rebane Avatar
    George Rebane

    RL 708am – I don’t mean to speak for all the other readers, but I do believe that part of what you sense as blanket opposition to moving “the ball forward on energy and environment” is that so much of that effort is expended for the sole purpose of expanding political power, and as such has little or no support from prudent applications of technology and/or expenditure of public monies. At least that is the basis for my own critiques of such politically correct enterprises. Where you can show the error of such opposition, I will be most appreciative.

    Like

  7. L Avatar
    L

    RL, perhaps you misinterpret the attitude many of us have concerning our energy future. The problem with both wind and solar is that they are not ‘scaleable” for commercial replacement of our existing plant. Not enough land area available, not enough energy density is solar or wind. That is, physics and economics both tell us that pursuit of these solutions is a colossal waste of money.
    Meanwhile, the left has imposed ongoing costs of trillions by demonizing nuclear powe,r which is the only known solution- be it thorium, fusion or conventional reactors.
    What you see isn’t “hate and contempt,” but disgust with the growing proportion of our population that lacks the numeracy to comprehend that we will soon be forced by economic growth of the third world to adopt the only technology known to be capable of the task. Until that sinks in, the left will remain the major impediment to a successful human future. Pissed? You would be too if you understood the dimensions of the problem, which you and the entire left clearly do not.

    Like

  8. J. Barron Avatar
    J. Barron

    Rebane 7:29
    The right’s opposition to “moving the ball forward” (and GW denial) is all about profit.

    Like

  9. Steven Frisch Avatar
    Steven Frisch

    I am just glad that Russ will finally have a use for all those light bulbs he squirreled away 10 years ago waiting for the US to elect and Luddite child President.
    https://thehill.com/policy/energy-environment/459884-trump-administration-rolls-back-obama-era-lightbulb-rules

    Like

  10. Steven Frisch Avatar
    Steven Frisch

    L, it’s pretty clear that you would be fun to debate on these issues if a clear set of ground rules could be established for a rational discussion, but I do not expect that here. Ever.
    But I thought I would point out that by far the number one killer of birds in the United States is house cats…yep, simple domesticated house cats.
    Not to mention the fact that it is pretty transparently inconsistent of you guys to be bemoaning bird deaths from wind turbines when the greatest existential threat to most bird species today is changes in habitat caused by a combination of human intrusion on habitat and changing range due to climate change…which comes from the very technology that wind is replacing.

    Like

  11. Walt Avatar
    Walt

    Morn’n jigger Barron TROLL. Your “GW” is made up horse shit.
    Based on manufactured “science*”.
    Your AOC nut,, We only have ten years left to live”.
    Oh.. and the latest just from last week,, “Hurricanes are man made”.

    Like

  12. Steven Frisch Avatar
    Steven Frisch

    “…. so much of that effort is expended for the sole purpose of expanding political power…”
    There is that ridiculous conspiratorial thinking again. When a rational educated man adopts such conspiratorial thinking one needs to wonder what exactly is going on in there.
    We know what’s going in there with Todd, he is a mental midget; but with George and Greg, it is like their occasionally rational minds are caught in some kind of new 21st century virus.

    Like

  13. Walt Avatar
    Walt

    Here ya’ go Frishy,, Ain’t solar great?
    https://www.latimes.com/local/california/la-me-solar-bird-deaths-20160831-snap-story.html
    “Reporting from NIPTON, Calif. — A macabre fireworks show unfolds each day along I-15 west of Las Vegas, as birds fly into concentrated beams of sunlight and are instantly incinerated, leaving wisps of white smoke against the blue desert sky.
    Workers at the Ivanpah Solar Plant have a name for the spectacle: “Streamers.” “

    Like

  14. Steven Frisch Avatar
    Steven Frisch

    Posted by: Walt | 05 September 2019 at 08:04 AM
    I will let you do the math on the comparison.
    https://insider.si.edu/2013/01/cats-kill-2-4-billion-birds-annually/

    Like

  15. Walt Avatar
    Walt

    One more thing to point out “GW” is bogus,, Been through Truckee lately? (I’m sure one or two of you have) Just what do you see up on those hills above town? That’s RIGHT!! SNOW!!
    It made it all the way through Summer. You know the exact opposite of what SHOULD BE,, if “GW” worshipers were even close to being right.
    I’m sure the true believers will have a real good excuse.

    Like

  16. fish Avatar
    fish

    Posted by: J. Barron | 05 September 2019 at 07:49 AM
    ……and GW denial) is all about profit.
    Morning Steve!
    Indeed.
    Profit for Democrat insiders to be more precise…..not that many Solyndras to go around.

    Like

  17. Walt Avatar
    Walt

    That’s what cats do. One of mine is having bird for breakfast as we speak.
    Getting cooked in mid air ain’t natural. And all those endangered species with wings.. But that’s OK.. Right? But some dude with a plow gets fined for one dead endangered whatever (even if they can’t find one) in his field.

    Like

  18. Marvelous Merv the AV Perv Avatar
    Marvelous Merv the AV Perv

    ,,,gotta stare in wonderment at the stupidity of the Circle of Jerkers comments on recycling wind machine parts and bird deaths.
    Buncha flat earthers me thinks,,,among their many other mental deficiencies
    How is that nuclear waste recycling going for y’alls??? Is it still sitting in drums in a hole in the desert???
    Where do fiberglass hulled yachts go to die?
    What a buncha lame brains

    Like

  19. Todd Juvinall Avatar
    Todd Juvinall

    I have said this AGW crap is and always has been a hoax. Perpetrated for political control. I am conscientious about the environment as any eco nut but I am a realist and figured out their strategy long ago. I like fossil fuels. When the Steve Frisch windmill can supply the heat to the homes of the north on a windless day I may be found wrong. But CO2 is not a pollutant even though the politicians say is it is., I give the Frisch’s credit though for being able to shyest the taxpayers.

    Like

  20. Walt Avatar
    Walt

    The jiggered boob is missing in action. Yup, that’s what happens when a TROLL sticks his head up his own posterior.
    So tell us again how great the Proggy gun laws are at stopping criminals from getting guns. You can start right here in Nevada Co. Then you can yap about Tex.

    Like

  21. Walt Avatar
    Walt

    Dougy comes out of the closet.

    Like

  22. Scott O Avatar
    Scott O

    Crabb is a typical lefty – “As for my bad attitude when I come here, it’s just a reflection of the hate and contempt I see from most of the comments. I really don’t give a shit whether you like me or not.”
    Your attitude is your responsibility, Bob.
    You look pretty childish trying to blame others.
    I get tired of your typical left wing BS about how conservatives don’t care about birds or the environment or poor people or whatever.
    Just because our solutions don’t match yours is no excuse to claim we don’t care. The fact is that the left and the green weenies constantly try to minimize or coverup the damage their ‘solutions’ to so-called global warming are causing.
    And the same bunch constantly lie about the true carbon footprint of things like electric cars.
    Saying you don’t care whether I like you or not is no excuse to smear and lie about people.
    If you have an accusation to make against me or anyone else, you have the responsibility to prove the point.
    Well – as an adult you do, but if you just want to blame other people for your rude and insulting behavior there’s nothing I can do but sadly shake my head.

    Like

  23. J. Barron Avatar
    J. Barron

    Walt-
    Your “GW” is made up horse shit. Based on manufactured “science*”.
    Is this what you know, or simply what you have been fed by right wing media funded by the fossil fuel lobby? Uneducated and dumb, you and Todd are precisely the target audience for this propaganda. You probably still smoke cigarettes in defiance of the manufactured medical conspiracy that says they are harmful.
    The numbers of birds killed by solar and wind energy are a tiny little drip in the bucket compared with cats, high rise buildings, and habitat destruction. If you have any sense what so ever, you know this to be true, but will go yo your grave defending your asinine position.

    Like

  24. Scott O Avatar
    Scott O

    Steven at 8:18 – And just what is your logic, here?
    We were talking about wind mill generators killing birds. Are you saying it’s OK as long as cats kill more?

    Like

  25. Scott O Avatar
    Scott O

    Well – MM at 8:32 certainly sums up the left’s attitude.
    Thanks for being honest. Admitting that your solutions are bad for the environment but it’s OK because you’re on the side of the angels.

    Like

  26. fish Avatar
    fish

    Posted by: Marvelous Merv the AV Perv | 05 September 2019 at 08:32 AM
    dugsKKKi Keachie…….diminishing the tradition of Scottish intellectual excellence each and every day!
    Although I do think you finally have a posting handle appropriate to your personality.

    Like

  27. Walt Avatar
    Walt

    Jiggy Barron,, you have already shown yourself as an idiot.
    Facts are not on your side. From gun control to AGW you have nothing but bumper stickers. No facts or proof.

    Like

  28. J. Barron Avatar
    J. Barron

    Wally-
    When the sum of your scientific “knowledge” is spoon fed (in little words with big pictures) from American Rifleman and Breitbart . . . uneducated pawn. Have another cigarette.

    Like

  29. George Rebane Avatar
    George Rebane

    Our left wing readers’ complaints about not having any opportunity to engage in substantive debates here would ring a bit more true had any of them taken the opportunity to deconstruct the arguments presented in, for example, these commentaries –
    ‘Scattershots – 6aug19’
    ‘Democrats’ Big Lie #3671 – America’s economy’
    ‘Smaller Governments and Corporations’
    Until any of them do, they are continuing to blow hot air about having the desire for any substantive debates about any of the issues that separate us.

    Like

  30. Walt Avatar
    Walt

    A little bit of fact for the factless AGW lunatic.
    https://www.thegwpf.com/media-ignores-michael-manns-court-loss-it-doesnt-fit-the-warmist-agenda/
    “MEDIA IGNORES MICHAEL MANN’S COURT LOSS — IT DOESN’T FIT THE WARMIST AGENDA
    Date: 30/08/19Editorial, Issues & Insights
    Last week, a Canadian court tossed out a lawsuit in which Michael Mann, the researcher who published the idolized hockey stick temperature chart, had sued another researcher for libel. Did the mainstream media run with this story? Of course not. That would ruin the narrative.”
    Ain’t it GREAT?? Mr. AGW himself can’t defend his AGW horse shit.
    And Frishy one thinks he can? LOL!!!

    Like

  31. Steven Frisch Avatar
    Steven Frisch

    Posted by: Scott O | 05 September 2019 at 08:43 AM
    No Scott, what I am saying is that one has to put bird mortality from renewable energy resources into 1) the context of overall mortality, and 2) mortality caused by alternatives, like fossil fuels and CO2 emissions and their impact on habitat and range compared to renewables.
    Walt is essentially cherry picking to create a false narrative.

    Like

  32. Walt Avatar
    Walt

    Hummm Not going to explain why there is still snow.. Got it.
    Ignore that fact too. Just don’t fit the AGW BS,, so ignore it.
    ” Snow.. to be a thing of the past” (stated 20 years ago)

    Like

  33. Walt Avatar
    Walt

    Sure Frishcy,, at least we have some cherries to pick.
    What do you have? manufactured data. Weather stations in the middle of parking lots. Yup, that’s going to give accurate readings of heat.

    Like

  34. J. Barron Avatar
    J. Barron

    Walt-
    A headline that includes “warmest agenda” might tip off a more educated reader, but is catnip to ditch diggers and nail pounders who wouldn’t know a photon from a proton. How did that prayer thing go to dissolve the hurricane? You must feel like a complete idiot.
    https://davidappell.blogspot.com/2019/08/a-decision-in-mann-v-ball.html

    Like

  35. Jig Wiggly Avatar
    Jig Wiggly

    I found a team bumper sticker for RR readers.
    “Imagine denying climate but believing Mexico is going to pay for the wall”

    Like

  36. Walt Avatar
    Walt

    You sure are one desperate bastard. Gotta go hunting on the fringes. Never heard of the guy. So you find some obscure blog.
    Uh,, how did that “prayer thing go” to take Trump down? That was all over the news.
    If Mann had an ounce of credibility, he would have forked over the data and said, “HERE!! PROVE IT WRONG.” Nope, he destroyed it.
    That’s fact, numbnuts.
    Your only concern about AGW is how much OPM you can get from it.
    Still won’t address the snow issue above Truckee. It should not be there is there is AGW.
    That’s a Jiggered boob action. Coward.

    Like

  37. Bill Tozer Avatar
    Bill Tozer

    J Barron @ 9:09 am
    Not so fast. That is Mann’s spin on things. Mann refused to produce the documents and his research to the defense. The defense stated to the judge that he could readily refute and disprove Mann’s findings if Mann produced his research docs. The plaintiff refused. This was a libel case. Since the plaintiff refused repeatedly to turn over his documents as to how he reached his conclusions, there is no way the defense could prove there was no libel. Thus, the case was dropped.

    Like

  38. L Avatar
    L

    Steve, I’m well aware that house cats are hard on songbirds, but I’d guess they kill zero eagles, hawks, large owls and nearly zero bats. Wind turbines do kill birds, the possession of a single feather from which can get you incarcerated (unless you’re Native American). So we see yet another example of the classic Marxist dictum of means/ends, eggs/omelets. It’s ok, cause it’s for a noble cause.
    Contrary to our wishes, some things are truly, physically, impossible. Building enough windmills and solar panels to power our current society (much less a more prosperous future one) is one of those things. With a little math, you can easily demonstrate this to yourself and don’t have even to admit it to the rest of us; you don’t need to apologize, just stop encouraging self-destructive behavior by ignorant propagandists for a ‘green’ future. More like gangrene.

    Like

  39. Bill Tozer Avatar
    Bill Tozer

    “The funny thing about people who advocate reducing the population to save the planet is that they always want to start by killing babies. They never seem to see themselves as members of the surplus population in need of extermination. What a strange coincidence.” —Matt Walsh

    Like

  40. Robert Cross Avatar
    Robert Cross

    Greg 11:47 — My apologies, I mistook your arrogance and sense of entitlement based on the university you went to for that of a spoiled rich kid. In fact your story is not too dissimilar from my own.
    George 8:55 — it is difficult to engage in “substantive debates” when your writings are so couched in “right wing good guys- left wing bad guys” rhetoric that the discussion is over before it has even started, which, perhaps, is by design. You don’t really discuss issues but instead use responses as fodder for your biased lampoons and then use the lack of response to further impugn with whom you disagree . This is not unlike Ahmed Chilabi’s tactic of releasing a false story about WMD’s to the press and then using those news releases as proof of his assertions.

    Like

  41. Walt Avatar
    Walt

    Really? In just ten years? Has booker been smoking dope in Nevada City?
    “Booker’s plan aims to “accelerate the end” of fossil fuels and aims to achieve “100% carbon-free electricity” by the year 2030.”
    Maybe our ECO bastard can show us the simple math on that. How many windmills, how many states to be paved over with solar panels. Dam every river,(even the S. Yuba!) for hydro.
    https://www.breitbart.com/politics/2019/09/05/cory-booker-millennial-republicans-really-with-us-climate-change/

    Like

  42. fish Avatar
    fish

    Posted by: Robert Cross | 05 September 2019 at 09:44 AM

    Wow……how many editorial re-writes did that little gem suffer through Roberta?

    Like

  43. Walt Avatar
    Walt

    See folks? When confronted with reality the ECO nuts run for cover.
    With snow still on the ground in plain sight of Truckee from last Winter, it’s kinda tough to sell GW. So just change the subject.

    Like

  44. Don Bessee Avatar
    Don Bessee

    Its a say it over and over and perhaps it will be so all evidence to the contrary –
    Thursday on CNBC’s “Squawk Box,” network host Jim Cramer argued the U.S. economy gave it leverage over China in the trade dispute between the two nations.
    Cramer told host Joe Kernan that the only ones talking about a recession as a result of the trade war with the Chinese were them in the media.
    “I think President Trump is set in his ways because he doesn’t see any weakening,” Cramer said. “I mean, look at the jobless report today. I mean, someone earlier said manufacturing was in recession. Well, manufacturing has been in recession in this country for ages. What I’m surprised at is how strong the consumer is. I think that the Chinese still need it more than we do. I know when I say that, everyone just is, ‘But wait a second, that’s a nice bias that you’re showing.’ It’s statistical. I think our economy is very strong.”
    https://www.breitbart.com/the-media/2019/09/05/cnbcs-jim-cramer-i-think-the-only-people-talking-about-a-recession-is-us/
    😉

    Like

  45. Bill Tozer Avatar
    Bill Tozer

    What nobody has told me is how much of climate change is manmade. What percent? How many degrees? Simple questions. A headline yesterday was Climate Change is causing hurricanes. Ok, I can buy that since the oceans are warming. But, the article did not say how much of that Climate Change is due to man. The article implied it was man’s fault, but did not prove the allegation.
    My objection to solar fields and windmill farms is the massive footprint on the landscape. Now, solar panels on a home may be a good supplement to PGE power, but on a large scale, how effective is it? We have not even build an effective low carbon grid, not to mention transmission loss. I see solar at the residential level as just an expensive battery charger. As mentioned before, the largest solar field in CA can run only the NYC subway system. Nothing more. One nuclear plant is equivalent to 17 massive solar fields…without the ugly footprint. It will take solar and wind turbine fields the size of Pennsylvania to meet most of East Coast’s needs, barring any inefficiencies, weather, and times of zero output.
    R.L. mention solar panels will evolve in efficiency. They already have. They have doubled the efficiency through the years, but physics will tell you that there is no chance that panels in its present form will achieve anything but a small improvement. A few percentage points, but the physics for big improvements is already achieved. Back to the drawing board.
    I go back to the ice cores in the Antarctic. Drilled 2 miles down (10,000 feet, 400,000 years old. Those ice cores tell a story of our Earth. The warming preceded the increase of CO2 levels by a few hundred years every time. Now, one can say that the Antarctic is not global and pooh-pooh the findings (as many do), but if natural changes in the climate precedes increase in CO2 levels, it throws things on its head. Now they are drilling down to look for other gases such as nitrogen levels. And yes, the ice is above a giant lake.
    The questions remain: What percentage of Climate Change is due to man’s activities? How many degrees? How many inches of sea level rise? Will achieving zero carbon emissions change anything?

    Like

  46. Gregory Avatar
    Gregory

    Bobbi 944am
    Sense of entitlement? I earned the knowledge I have.
    Non-apology not accepted, nice try, no points. And Mudd is a small (was 400 students, has grown to 800) liberal arts college of science and engineering, not a University.
    20 Quatloos say Bobbi Cross remains Steve Frisch.

    Like

  47. fish Avatar
    fish

    Posted by: Gregory | 05 September 2019 at 10:56 AM
    20 Quatloos say Bobbi Cross remains Steve Frisch.
    👍
    The smug, self-satisfied tone gave it away…..?

    Like

  48. Gregory Avatar
    Gregory

    toes 1046am
    And that 400,000 year old ice core covers less than 1% of the age of visible life on Earth, about 540 MILLION years.
    Shaviv and Veizer 2003, “Celestial driver of phanerozoic climate?” remains a key climate paper in my mind.
    Zero carbon emissions will not change anything measurable besides the temperature of our homes in the heat of summer and cold of winter, our mobility and our wealth, which will transfer in large measure to our new masters, the folks who would keep track of CO2 emissions and settlements.
    I’d be delighted to have a small fusion reactor power my home for pennies a day, or 99% efficient solar panels integrated into building materials, but we won’t get there by the rocket scientists we send to Washington DC or Excremento passing laws to make it so.

    Like

  49. Gregory Avatar
    Gregory

    toes 923am
    Ahhh, Michael Mann. I am transported back a few years ago to a Michael Mann Other Voices submission (w/Heidi Hall) to our own Tea Party Gazette
    https://www.theunion.com/news/twi/heidi-hall-michael-mann-lets-have-a-worthy-debate/
    Yes, let’s have a worthy debate. Let’s have Mann put his research out in the sunlight where all can see it, and perhaps Ms. Hall can keep the vodka in the liquor cabinet.

    Like

  50. Don Bessee Avatar
    Don Bessee

    Tell em sister –
    Friedrichs said that since politicians, the American Civil Liberties Union, and teacher unions have “stuck their noses in, things have been falling apart.”
    https://www.foxnews.com/media/former-public-school-teacher-warns-lenient-suspension-policies-are-dangerous
    😉

    Like

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