Rebane's Ruminations
October 2017
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George Rebane

With the Las Vegas massacre still fresh in the news, and memories of previous such shootings indelibly burned into our collective memories, the ongoing debate in these pages about preventing children from accidentally shooting themselves or others assumes a heightened focus and an inevitably extended scope.  We are all standing by for the new spate of progressive platitudes and proposed proscriptions of the lawful ownership and possession of guns guaranteed by the Second Amendment.  This guarantee is not recognized by many of our newly educated citizens, most leftwing politicians, and all lamestream journalists.  But the only guarantee we have is that when the dust of the latest tragedy settles, and it will settle, this next chapter of the debate will leave us more separated than ever – the Great Divide ratchet turneth.

So, back to preventing accidental gun deaths.  I wonder what would happen to current statistics if children were taught about gun safety in kindergarten and/or first grade.  Today concerned parents have no hope of denying their child’s knowledge of the existence and, yes, the romance of guns since the world’s cultures glorify their existence as objects of power, adventure, status, justice, crime, coming of age, … .  Today all of this is drummed into the heads of the little darlins through immensely popular and engaging shoot-‘em-up computer games, realistic movies, and TV/online videos available 24/7 on the youngsters’ phones and pads.  And the more such parents attempt to keep children from having early ‘gun experiences’, the more attractive guns become to kids as the forbidden fruit that when serendipitously discovered, must immediately be handled, explored, surreptitiously shared, etc.

As a youngster (and child war veteran) in 1950s middle America, I was as interested in guns as were any of my friends.  In those days fathers (mine included) put guns into the hands of their sons (and many daughters) when they were, by today’s standards, very young.  I got my Red Ryder Daisy BB gun when ten, and my first 22 mag-fed bolt action rifle when thirteen.  (One of my grandsons now has it.)  I taught my children and grandchildren about guns and gun safety before they were five, and to shoot before they were eight.

Before the age of political correctness it was rare to hear of a youngster tragically discharging a found firearm.  Although kids did have their share of hunting accidents when improperly handling their firearms.  But then such accidents were not political or politicized events, no one became hysterical as a result and started militating for some new draconian laws or regulations that proscribed or constructively denied the then legal ownership and disposition of guns.  Overall, these were viewed as childhood accidents similar to when a kid seriously injured himself on a swing or other playground equipment, or riding his bicycle, swimming, climbing trees, or … .  These were simply tragic accidents the solution to which was more/better safety training.  We recognized that life lived to the fullest has inherent dangers, and their attempted eradication would also eliminate other unintended desiderata that contributed to our quality of life – in sum, the overzealous quest for safety itself has a price, as we see all around us today.

Are we really a better society as a result of fifty years of social histrionics wherein we have sought to impress each other with our social consciousness and caring that today mandates almost everything that we do, say, or think.  How many mass shootings did we have when young people knew more about guns and had easier access to them?

Posted in , , , ,

191 responses to “‘Gun Violence’, girding for the next chapter”

  1. Paul Emery Avatar
    Paul Emery

    George
    I was just citing North Korea as having
    lower rates of gun violence in a UN study cited by Gregory. He was bragging that the US is something like 174 on the list of gun violence. If you have a beef with that talk to Gregory. He’s the source.

    Like

  2. Paul Emery Avatar
    Paul Emery

    Yes
    This is a step in the right direction
    After Las Vegas, Dems demand GOP pull gun silencer bill
    Democrats are urging their Republican colleagues in Congress to scrap a bill that that would make buying gun silencers easier and make it more difficult to classify ammunition as “armor piercing.”
    https://www.rawstory.com/2017/10/after-las-vegas-dems-demand-gop-pull-gun-silencer-bill/

    Like

  3. fish Avatar
    fish

    Posted by: Paul Emery | 03 October 2017 at 08:46 AM
    This is a step in the right direction

    Really? By all means tell us how.

    Like

  4. Scott Obermuller Avatar

    It’s a ‘step in the right direction’ towards pissing off people he doesn’t like.
    Paul has already admitted he has no proof that his ‘solutions’ will do any good towards reducing violence.

    Like

  5. fish Avatar
    fish

    Posted by: Scott Obermuller | 03 October 2017 at 08:57 AM
    Paul has already admitted he has no proof that his ‘solutions’ will do any good towards reducing violence.

    ….and no justification for the two items he wants to restrict based on recent events in Las Vegas.

    Like

  6. George Rebane Avatar

    PaulE 844am – I don’t need to talk to Gregory, your citing of North Korea in this debate was cynical, pernicious, and misleading. But for the lightly read readers, such citations also serve as fake news when regularly brought up today by our current crop of crack ‘journalists’.
    Here’s an interesting thing to watch post-Las Vegas, how many major lamestream outlet reporters still do not know what an automatic firearm is as they report on the killer’s gun collection, existing gun laws, and the need for more gun controls.

    Like

  7. Todd Juvinall Avatar
    Todd Juvinall

    The shooter was apparently an attendee of a anti-Trump rally.

    Like

  8. Paul Emery Avatar
    Paul Emery

    What does “apparently” mean Todd? What is your source?

    Like

  9. fish Avatar
    fish

    Posted by: Paul Emery | 03 October 2017 at 08:46 AM
    This is a step in the right direction

    ????

    Like

  10. George Rebane Avatar

    Paddock’s party affiliation and rally attendance videos should be a matter of record. Wonder why the lamestream is silent on these – neither reporting or contending such reports?

    Like

  11. Gregory Avatar
    Gregory

    PE 844
    “I was just citing North Korea as having lower rates of gun violence in a UN study cited by Gregory. He was bragging that the US is something like 174 on the list of gun violence. If you have a beef with that talk to Gregory. He’s the source.”
    Paul, are you that incapable of keeping the story straight, you know… being rational?
    The story so far:
    1) Paul declares the USA the most violent modern country
    2) I dig out a list that has the USA at 99 on murder rates (not “gun violence”)
    3) Paul digs out NorKor as a country that did better than the USA
    4) I point out that murders of their own people by NorKor aren’t counted
    I then point out where America is, in effect, 50+ different countries:
    One, Washington D.C. is a very violent place that would be #17 on the list
    Another, New Hampshire, would be near the bottom of the list.
    Guess which one already has the gun laws Paul is itching to spread nationwide? Gun laws that are being peeled away now that the 2nd Amendment has been found to be binding on the States like the rest of the Bill of Rights.
    Now, Don B made that into a Bad Democrat rant, but Hawaii is just behind New Hampshire in murder rates and it has been a One Party Democratic State longer than California. It’s cultural… they’re the least white and most Asian a plurality, the largest single group if Asian can be considered a single group (it can’t, but lets let that go for the moment). The difference between say, NH and HI with DC and Louisiana in their murder rates are cultural.
    Let’s just say that all cultures are equal, but some are more equal than others.

    Like

  12. Bill Tozer Avatar
    Bill Tozer

    Dr. Rebane @ 11:18 am.
    Alex Jones is reporting that Antifa literature was found in Paddlock’s room. Take it or leave it. Sometimes Jones is spot on, sometimes he is off track. I will wait and see. Afterall, it has taken over a year to find out what made the Pulse shooter do what he did.
    https://www.facebook.com/RowdyConservatives/photos/a.217983685002343.55586.217926015008110/1176857095781659/?type=3&theater
    https://www.facebook.com/lastamericapatriots/photos/a.235087906641439.1073741826.235086849974878/929309123885977/?type=3&theater
    Oh, the politics continue. Everytime there is a proposed tax cut or horrific shooting, the libs pull out the same playbook and recite it word for work from the top of their heads since….well, since the Flower Power peaceniks erupted in violent protests against war and Da Man. Vegas is no exception.
    For the life of me, I cannot think of one new law that would have stopped Sandy Hook, where multitudes of existing laws were broken. Nor, can I think of one law that would have stopped Las Vegas. Let the fun and games continue!
    https://www.facebook.com/RowdyConservatives/photos/a.217983685002343.55586.217926015008110/1176986175768751/?type=3&theater
    Gun control education, liberal style. Guess Gun violence is ok if only beer bellied redneck country music lubing at eliminated. BTW, country music is bigger than rock-n-roll in this country, but I digress. Back to the liberal lovefest:
    https://100percentfedup.com/liberal-teachers-social-media-message-goes-viral-lots-white-trump-supporters-las-vegas-asks-liberals-pray-trumptards-died/
    http://truthfeednews.com/illinois-business-owner-praises-shooting-of-white-people-in-vegas/

    Like

  13. Paul Emery Avatar
    Paul Emery

    Bill
    You are such a chump.
    Oh yeah. Alex Jones believed Sandy Hook was a CIA staged event. Why in the world Bill would you quote such a certified nut?
    In September 2014, conspiracy theorist Alex Jones, who runs the website InfoWars, which had previously claimed that the murders were a “false flag” attack perpetrated by the government, made a new conspiracy claim: that “no one died” at Sandy Hook Elementary School because the Uniform Crime Reports showed no murders in Newtown for 2012, and that the victims were “child actors.”

    Like

  14. Bill Tozer Avatar
    Bill Tozer

    Yes Paul, I know that Sandy Hook CIA conspiracy theory all to well. First I heard of that kind of nonsense was an whole hour devoted to proving that Sandy Hook never happened…..one afternoon when I made the mistake of listening to the “proof” on KVMR. I listened to the whole thing and afterward I was almost convinced that Sandy Hook never happened, until I laughed at my foolish passing thoughts.
    That was before I heard of Alex Jones. But, to be fair, Alex Jones has been spot on other things that you have no interest in, such as the Hillary Clinton e-mails run through her homebrewed server and what happened in Benghazi. One man’s trash is another man’s poison.
    Besides Alex Jones, do you really think more laws are the fix? Last I looked, rape is against the law and Europe is having a rape epidemic. See any connection? Even if the NRA never existed, Sandy Hook, The Pulse, and Vegas would have happened. You cannot legislate evil.

    Like

  15. Paul Emery Avatar
    Paul Emery

    Bill
    I think appropriate laws do help and send a message to sellers and buyers that accumulating illegal firearms is against the law. It’s not a fix all. Crazy people with guns degrade the intent of the 2nd amendment and make it difficult to come up with a solution. What limits do you believe are appropriate to prevent the accumulation of an arsenal such as that which was used in Vegas? Should there be any limits?

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  16. Don Bessee Avatar
    Don Bessee

    Degrade the intent of the 2nd amendment? You clearly have no clue what the framers of the constitution intended however the SCOUTS has defined its current meaning and you just hate it. That reminds me I need to go buy a case of shells. 😉

    Like

  17. Paul Emery Avatar
    Paul Emery

    Have at it Don if that’s what you need to do.
    Do you think the framers of the Constitution intended for nut cases to be able to purchase 20 automatic rifles and thousands of rounds of ammunition?

    Like

  18. Gregory Avatar
    Gregory

    Don, I think Big 5 is again selling 500 rounds of Winchester 22LR ammo packaged in very nice retro pine boxes, one-third off. The ammo is US made, the pine box is Hecho en Chine. Nice for $40, two thousand rounds out the door for $160. Nice!
    Pauls, if the definition of a “nut case” is someone diagnosed with a mental illness, nut cases aren’t allowed to buy or possess weapons or ammunition, so you’re just spouting nonsense. Perhaps you’re trying to build the case that since anyone who wants to buy one of those icky guns is a nutcase, anyone who wants to buy a gun and ammunition to match must be crazy and therefore forbidden to do so.

    Like

  19. Don Bessee Avatar
    Don Bessee

    While there is evidence that he had installed shoulder bumpers there has been no evidence he purchased automatic weapons. To the contrary the most recent report I read today said he made legal purchases in AZ and NV with full background checks. The LV Sheriff just said he was not aware of any automatic weapons. So the laws were followed on the purchases. No one has yet come up with a predictor for an eruption of evil. A rich guy with multiple homes, an airplane and a lavish gambling lifestyle is not the usual mass murder profile. Pink pussy hat pic and the antifa angle are intriguing though. 😉

    Like

  20. Bill Tozer Avatar
    Bill Tozer

    No one can purchase 20 automatic weapons. Bogus. A gun dealer can purchase one, but the process can take up to 15 months, through the Feds’ Federal Firearms Permit process, not to mention complying with various State Laws. It’s up to the States since Congress was purposefully restricted by the founders of the US Constitution on the issue.
    But, let’s put that bogus agrument of someone legally purchasing 20 machine guns aside.
    “As evil as this massacre was, gun controllers took to the microphone before any facts surrounding this atrocity were unveiled. Leftists immediately screamed about how their preferred policies would have prevented this tragedy without presenting any facts to back up their claim.”
    https://patriotpost.us/articles/51637
    I know. Let’s have a Constitutional Admendment. 3/4 of the State Legislatures would have to sign on and agree to the changes of our 2nd Amendment, the guarantor of the First and other Amendments. Let’s see. The R’s are only a few States short of having that 3/4 State houses under their control. That’s the way it’s done, the way our founders envisioned the whole ball of wax.

    Like

  21. George Rebane Avatar

    As forecast, the predictable bullshit has started flowing. And the Left is lapping it up as if it were ambrosia from heaven.

    Like

  22. fish Avatar
    fish

    Posted by: Paul Emery | 03 October 2017 at 01:01 PM
    Do you think the framers of the Constitution intended for nut cases to be able to purchase 20 automatic rifles and thousands of rounds of ammunition?

    ….and with that naked appeal to emotion Mr. Emery has forfeited the match….if you’ll follow the smartly uniformed attendant she will show you off stage and present you with a home version of our game.

    Like

  23. Barry Pruett Avatar
    Barry Pruett

    “Do you think the framers of the Constitution intended for nut cases to be able to purchase 20 automatic rifles and thousands of rounds of ammunition?” You know Paul…I don’t know. Did they intend that citizens have the right “to purchase 20 automatic rifles and thousands of rounds of ammunition?” Probably. It is a different question regarding nut cases. Who decides who is a nut case? The government? I don’t know if there is a solution. At this time, your garden variety liberal would likely demand that, if you voted for Trump, you are clearly a nut case and should not own a weapon.
    “The Founding Fathers, having just broken away from Great Britain, understood the new federal government they were ratifying might one day become just as tyrannical. If it had the authority to control citizen access to firearms, then it could disarm them, just as the British attempted to do. This would make any attempts to restore liberties futile.”
    How do we balance the public safety and protection from a tyrannical government as the founders intended? It is a difficult question that we have debated for a long time. I do know that, based on empirical evidence, restricting gun ownership does not necessarily equate to less gun-related deaths. Look at Chicago…Chicago racks up 50 gun-related deaths a month, and they have some of the strictest gun laws in the country.
    I will watch this debate avidly in order to peel back the rhetoric and hopefully find a solution to a seemingly impossible dichotomy. I do appreciate reading your thoughts on the matter.

    Like

  24. Russ Avatar

    NICK GILLESPIE: This Is the Time To Defend the Second Amendment and Less-Strict Gun Control: Anti-gun activists are pushing for a crackdown in the wake of the Vegas shooting. That’s understandable but wrong. They demand a sacrifice of liberty to their god the State.
    Writes Gillespie:
    It’s not cold-blooded or Vulcan to point out that we remain in the midst of an unprecedented deceleration of violent crime and gun crime. Surely that has some connection to policies over the past quarter-century or so that have made it easier for a wide variety of people to legally own and carry guns.
    “From 1993 to 2015, the rate of violent crime declined from 79.8 to 18.6 victimizations per 1,000 persons age 12 or older,” says the Bureau of Justice Statistics in its most recent comprehensive report (published last October, using data through 2015). Over the same period, rates for crimes using guns dropped from 7.3 per 1,000 people to 1.1 per 1,000 people. The homicide rate is down from 7.4 to 4.9. These are not simply good things, they are great things. They are the essential backdrop of all discussions about gun crime and mass shootings, even as we grieve the people killed nonsensically in Vegas.

    http://reason.com/blog/2017/10/03/this-is-the-time-to-defend-the-second-am
    This is all about grabbing power, and the facts do not matter. Just like a lot of other lefty causes, like climate change. It is all about grabbing power.

    Like

  25. Paul Emery Avatar
    Paul Emery

    Thank you Barry for your openness to different ideas.
    Gregory, George, Fish Scott amd Walt in my view your views on the 2nd Amendment and gun rights in general seem be in agreement with Bill O’Reilly who recently said ““This is the price of freedom, Violent nuts are allowed to roam free until they do damage, no matter how threatening they are.”……..
    “The Second Amendment is clear that Americans have a right to arm themselves for protection,” O’Reilly wrote. “Even the loons.”

    Like

  26. Don Bessee Avatar
    Don Bessee

    Politifact blew up the liberal talking point from the NYT that there were more gun deaths since 1968 than all deaths in US wars. They totally blew up the number of military deaths as wildly low. The big part was their citing the 2013 CDC numbers that said 63% of gun deaths were suicides, 33% were homicides, 1% ea for accidents, undetermined causes and LE interventions ( yes cops only shot 1% of the total ).
    Again the left never misses a tragedy opportunity to push the false narrative party parrot talking points often used by the likes of our resident po’ ol’ fakenewsman. In his case being a druid may be part of his disconnect. People of the book recognize evil lives among us and must be fought by the faithful. 😉

    Like

  27. Walt Avatar

    OK,,,,
    “Enforcing immigration law is tyrannical, but rounding up hate thinkers is noble. Police drawing guns on minorities is an outrage, but law enforcement mowing down armed rednecks is something to aspire to. The president criticizing left-wing journalists is a sign of fascism, but shutting down right-wing “fake news” on Facebook is necessary.”

    Like

  28. Walt Avatar

    Paul if someone is hell bent on killing people they will do it.
    If not by gun, then by some other means. Forget so soon about London? Going to ban trucks? Cars? Name you possible weapon.
    Not one law would have stopped this Paul, and you know it.
    Just like all the laws on the books about drugs. Crack down on opioids.. Yup,, that’s going to go far . Just more break ins somewhere,, and with a gun most likely. Felons are not supposed to have them… Like that has stopped them.
    Let’s have some more LIB claptrap on “we need laws!”

    Like

  29. Paul Emery Avatar
    Paul Emery

    Walt, Don
    So you agree with O’Reilly saying its the price of freedom. That’s another way of saying “shit happens”. Would you be willing to tell that to the friends and family of the victims of Vegas?

    Like

  30. fish Avatar
    fish

    Walt, Don……at this point all Punch can do is virtue signal and emote. You’re wasting your time trying to discuss anything with him.

    Like

  31. Don Bessee Avatar
    Don Bessee

    Too true Fish. Would the po’ ol’ fakenewsman be willing to tell the victims that evil exists? 😉

    Like

  32. fish Avatar
    fish

    Seen elsewhere……..

    It’s obvious from the divergent reactions to last night’s shooting, on top of the year-long-triggering that has become our new public discourse, that the nation is coming apart. To be sure, there’s plenty of noise amplification due to social media, but it is amplifying opinions that are less fringe than they were 10 years ago and did not really exist 20 years ago. We no longer have a shared narrative to guide us forward together, so we will go forward apart.
    I suspect that the lunacy, the nastiness, and the rage are going to get worse — far worse — before they get better, mostly because I don’t think they’re going to get better for a century. Civilizational collapse tends to be that way. And make no mistake, that’s what we are staring down.
    The first lesson a larval systems analyst is taught when diagnosing a problem is to ask, “What’s changed?” If the code ran fine yesterday and it’s broken today, then something new has been introduced. Find that thing and you’ll likely find the problem.
    The Second Amendment has been around since 1791. Americans have always had guns, lots of guns, even before we were Americans. That hasn’t changed, ergo that is not the problem.
    But individuals using them on innocents for maximum effect is new. So what has changed? Lots and lots of things, and they are woven into the fabric of our current culture. It’s not gay marriage or broken families or diversity*, but the underlying problem with all of them. We are collectively living for today and nothing else. No past, no future, no God, no vision. Nothing but appetite.
    In our quest to grasp the trendy, we have torn down the fences that prior generations erected. And we have done so just because they were there, and without asking them or even ourselves why they were erected. We build ugly buildings filled with ugly art. We pipe ugliness into our homes via satellite with a monthly subscription. Half of us are on antidepressants. We eulogize the pornographers of our youth but our kids don’t know what sex they are.
    It is no wonder we are going mad, in little groups, in big groups, and individually. “Senseless” shootings, if indeed that’s what this is, are evidence that the sweat of our collective insanity is starting to flow through some of the weaker pores. But this will not cool the body. It will inflame the body.
    Now, I’m not saying any of this to criticize America or the West – there is simply no need for that. I’m saying that this is the position in which we today find ourselves. We can howl and moan and vote** about it, but I suspect that it’s not going to make much difference in any macro sense. This road goes somewhere very bad, and drag your heels all you want, there are millions of your neighbors slavering like huskies and dragging our collective sleigh at top speed. They want to go there.
    The shootings are going to get worse. The crime is going to get worse. The violence is going to get worse. And then it’s going to get organized. And then it’s going to get nasty. We may not get all the way there in my lifetime, and I am certainly aware of the dangers of extrapolating current trends into an unknown future. But the trajectory looks that way and the trend has plenty of support to continue, from people, institutions, even inertia.
    This mad carousel may go on for a while, maybe a long while. Or it may not***. When it stops, you’d better be where you want to be, surrounded by the people you want near you. Teach your kids, support your church, love your neighbor, get to know your sheriff. And as much as possible, physically stay the hell out of the way.
    Something wicked this way comes.
    * by which is meant a generation raised to identify themselves primarily by hues, genitals, or sexual disorientations. By which is also meant establishing hostile microcultures, like Roman settlements without the order, throughout the nation.
    ** While voting matters, I fully suspect that significant change will be imposed from outside the current constitutional order. Nature abhors a vacuum.
    *** much of that depends on the dollar, and how many we will print before the futility of something-for-nothing becomes too obvious to ignore.

    The Last Great Century of Man…..

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  33. Paul Emery Avatar
    Paul Emery

    I agree there is no need to continue this conversation since the “price of freedom” argument is way beyond compromise and reason. We’ll find something else to chat about I’m sure.

    Like

  34. Don Bessee Avatar
    Don Bessee

    Now that’s funny @ 440. 😉

    Like

  35. Bonnie McGuire Avatar

    Gregory. Stop hammering Paul, or anyone who questions vaccinating children. Many doctors say too many are being given to young children, and they do believe it’s caused the rise in autism regardless of those pushing vaccination. Also there are many parents who witnessed first hand what happened to their child following vaccination. All medicine affects people differently. That’s why there are so many side affects listed, along with all the lawsuits. If you pay attention you’re aware of it. Plenty of advertising on TV.

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  36. Scott Obermuller Avatar

    The ‘price of freedom’ argument is hardly ‘beyond reason’.
    It’s quite simple, really. We can pass all sorts of laws that would have stopped the shooting at Sandy Hook and the Mandalay Bay shooter, etal.
    But would you want to live with those laws? And are you willing to stomach the staggering number of deaths by both civilians, and law enforcement officials as they go about enforcing such laws? I can’t speak for Paul, but I know it wouldn’t be any sort of country I’d want to live in.

    Like

  37. Bill Tozer Avatar
    Bill Tozer

    1) Great Post @ 4:34 pm. What has changed? Whatever it is, it has not been for the better.
    2). My thoughts concerning an armed citizenry has been seen on bumper stickers almost all my entire life: “I love my country but fear my government.” Today the libs carry signs that basically say, “ I love government and hate my country.”
    3) Our founders had a well deserved deep distrust of government. They believed forcefully that government is a necessary evil to be constantly restrained and always limited. To quote another, ‘The price of liberty is eternal vigilance.”
    “Some one has justly remarked, that ‘eternal vigilance is the price of liberty.’ Let the sentinels on the watch-tower sleep not, and slumber not.”
    May 2, 1833 edition of The Virginia Free Press and Farmers’ Repository
    Let the

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  38. Bonnie McGuire Avatar

    One more thing that’s disgusting to me. We have an opioid problem in America! You want to know the horrific reason why? For many years our public school system was pushing drugs on young children supposedly to help them…instead of old fashioned discipline. I watched it being done to a family member. Thank God his parents wouldn’t be badgered, and brought their attorney to school. They wouldn’t listen to the parents. They listened to the attorney who asked how the boy’s grades were. The answer was “okay” so they were breaking the law and getting $420 per kid turned on to Ritalin or Adderall. A Sacramento attorney was enraged our schools were drug pushers. If you paid attention there were many documentaries about the damage done to our future generation…mostly boys. Now it’s a. If deal in colleges. If you get a little to hyped on Adderall and can’t sleep you’re prescribed the addictive opioid Zanax. Young college students are pretending to suffer from ADHD in order to get prescriptions to get high. Now…locally we have a terrible homeless problem because there are so many down and out human beings trying to survive. Most are drug addicts and alcoholics. Do the research that shows the cause and effect results of those we’re supposed to trust.

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  39. uired to take behavioy control Avatar
    uired to take behavioy control

    Thanks for bringing that up Bonnie. I don’t have a firm opinion on the topic but the combination of education being compulsory and saying you have to vaccinate you children in order to attend is a huge government over reach. Autism is a huge concern to many families who blame injections for the affliction. What bothers me is their ability to add new shots at their whim without careful evaluation by parent groups. It could be just a matter of time when children could be required to take behavior control drugs to stay in school.
    The option of home schooling is not available to working families so they are stuck having to take shots in order to go to school and fulfill their legal obligations.

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  40. George Rebane Avatar

    ScottO 510pm – The limits to progressives’ ability to reason are real. There is a whole host of societal issues for which their ability to overcome the teachings of the Frankfurt School is literally absent. Understanding the role of broad-based gun ownership by a free people in a democratic republic that has served as the beneficial hegemon of western civilization and now of world order is beyond their ken. That is why the Great Divide is real and growing.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frankfurt_School

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  41. Walt Avatar

    Paul dismisses the use of vehicles as terror weapons. Yet they still kill more than guns daily. How bout booze? Everyone know not to drink and drive, yet do it anyway. Many lost the privilege to drive yet no real punishment for the repeat offenders.
    Plenty of lip service is given to DUI,, but I have yet to hear a bitch about all the bars with parking lots.
    The Yuba River has killed more people than my guns.(or all the guns in the county for that matter) Yet no push to close that river.
    Shut down HY49. Lives will be saved.
    LIBS will always blame that hunk of steal for the killing,, not the bastard pulling the trigger. “if only”…

    Like

  42. Bill Tozer Avatar
    Bill Tozer

    Psittaciformes @ 4:40 pm penned:
    “I agree there is no need to continue this conversation since the “price of freedom” argument is way beyond compromise and reason”
    Hmm. Perhaps our Popinjay meant to write “the ‘price of freedom’ argument is way beyond compromise and my reasoning abilities.” There. Makes sense now. Much better.

    Like

  43. Don Bessee Avatar
    Don Bessee

    ATF at press conf. update just said NO automatic weapons just shoulder bump stocks used in LV which are legal since they don’t really make it into an automatic. The guns were legally purchased. Well that just crumbled the fakenews party parrot narratives foundation. 😉

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  44. Gregory Avatar
    Gregory

    Paul 333pm
    Isn’t that special… you can’t see any difference so there must not be.
    I’ve never been a fan of O’Reilly, and that screed is a fine example why.
    “This is the price of freedom, Violent nuts are allowed to roam free until they do damage, no matter how threatening they are… The Second Amendment is clear that Americans have a right to arm themselves for protection… Even the loons.”
    Now, I’m trusting you, Paul, to have gotten the quote right because I didn’t dig out OReilly’s words from an original source and in the past you’ve been unclear on what a proper quote is. But no, when someone is “loony” enough to be “threatening”, they need to be adjudicated to be nuts so that the power of the state can be used to strip rights from them, including the right to keep and bear arms which includes more than just guns.
    I’ve thought all along that we needed to wait until we have information about the guy and what he’s done. The latest seems to be that none of the weapons he had were fully automatic and a couple had “bump stocks” affixed in order to get a high rate of fire. Personally, I’ve never seen the point of the “bump stocks” that give you the rate of fire close to a full auto but with greatly lessened accuracy which, in the case of shooting fish in a barrel or Country Western concertgoers, isn’t a big drawback.
    Putting a Bump Stock ban, classifying it as an NFA item, in with the silencer bill when it comes back up for air might be a good and passable idea.
    Still no word on the guy’s politics but he did spend a number of years as a Federal employee including Postal Service and IRS. Interestink.

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  45. Paul Emery Avatar
    Paul Emery

    Why is his politics important Gregory?

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  46. Gregory Avatar
    Gregory

    BMcG ”
    “Gregory. Stop hammering Paul, or anyone who questions vaccinating children. Many doctors say too many are being given to young children, and they do believe it’s caused the rise in autism regardless of those pushing vaccination. Also there are many parents who witnessed first hand what happened to their child following vaccination. All medicine affects people differently. That’s why there are so many side affects listed, along with all the lawsuits. If you pay attention you’re aware of it.”
    And some believe in the Easter Bunny, Bonnie.
    A friend of mine, without their child being in any particular risk to vaccines, refused them. A bright woman, with a bright husband, they were more afraid of them because of all the claims to the contrary.
    Until they almost had a child die of pertussis (aka Whooping Cough). After that, they got their kids vaccinated and thought their lucky stars they didn’t lose them.
    There are kids who really can’t take vaccine. They need the herd immunity to keep them from get ill, and others who got the vaccination but it didn’t take. Including folks like my first wife when she was taking chemotherapy and was trying to stay alive, and she couldn’t take vaccinations… and yes, she was teaching during her 18 month slide.
    So, shove it, Bonnie, Paul’s hypocrisy was palpable… how many kids would die without vaccinations? Isn’t one too many?

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  47. Bill Tozer Avatar
    Bill Tozer

    Answer: Motive. Answers the big question, “Why, why, why?”

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  48. Gregory Avatar
    Gregory

    Give that Toes a kewpie doll for getting it right.
    “Hurry hurry hurry, there’s so much time and so little to do!” – Willy Wonka

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  49. Gregory Avatar
    Gregory

    And another response to Punch-E’s 7:45pm… because I think it’s likely there was a political statement at the core of the deed and we should know what it is. Whatever it is.

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