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George Rebane

As did Hitler’s Brown Shirts, so have other socialist/communist thugs and roughnecks throughout recent history been the ones to physically disrupt the gatherings of their political opponents. This is what happened yesterday in Chicago at the planned Trump rally (here), and appears to be the start of this election season’s violent phase – expect more of such thuggery and violation of First Amendment rights from the Left.

Apparently this junction is the result of the Democrats finally realizing that Trump could beat anyone they nominate whether it be Hillary the Unindicted, Bernie the Communist (forget that ‘socialist’ crap), or even Foot-in-the-Mouth Joe. Were it not so, no one would care.  The Dems’ big money is beginning to fund anti-Trump activities and front their far-left ideologues which tactics bare their true assessment of what’s likely for this fall unless they can physically intervene, and, of course, have the lamestream blame it on the Right.

The astute reader will note and mark the Left/Right asymmetry in the coming travails. The only ones who will remain clueless about what’s going on are the gruberized local lefties here and elsewhere.  They’ll continue singing loudly some version of The Internationale for as long as it takes.  Trump should now cool his rhetoric, to which he has every right, and continue morphing into maximum presidential mode from here on.  Thoughts?


[13mar16 update]  This post has deservedly developed some very interesting and meaningful comment threads in its comment stream.  As the host of RR, I am again pleased.  Here I want to expand on my understanding of First Amendment (FA) rights which have been thoughtfully contended by at least two readers.

In its explicit reading our Constitution’s FA states – Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

Longtime readers will have encountered my own essay (here) on rights and privileges first published some years back and much debated since then.  In sum there I argue that all rights are granted by government (which in a republican democracy is the collective that enforces our social contract in the large).  And to the extent that a government does not enforce that or any right – either uniformly or selectively – operationally that right simply ceases to exist.

The contention is that the FA is “a limit on the power of the government (big or small) to restrict (an individual), not some right (for an individual) to speak and be heard.”  The interpretation of the FA over the last two centuries has been anything but so limited.  When we look at how the government has enforced the ability of individuals to communicate and/or speak freely in the public forum, we see that – due to the precise wording of the FA – they have mostly used other laws the effects of which become proximal to the occasion during which individuals hinder/stop free speech of other individuals.

When individuals attempt to violate FA rights, they almost always do that through some physical action that also and most clearly violates some other law intended to enforce privacy, maintain the peace, security in one’s person, prohibit trespassing, threaten violence, … .   It is then that government, when it selectively chooses, steps in and prevents such actions motivated by and proximal to the intent to deny free speech and/or FA rights.  That has been the clear method of enforcing the right to free speech in our Republic.  To argue that this technically is not the government enforcing the right to free speech is to my mind a specious twist of what has actually been happening in our society.   More importantly, it flies in the face of what we Americans have been taught to expect of government enforcing the Constitution – in short, such methods of guaranteeing the FA rights has made America what it is, and what continues to contribute to public peace.

As the definition of ‘speech’ has expanded in the latter half of the 20th century, a rich body of FA case law reaching all the way to SCOTUS has come on the books.  The currently celebrated Citizens United, which among other things forces privately owned media outlets to accept political advertising from private sources which is contrary to the ideology of its ownership, and thereby goes on to defend individuals’ and corporate funding of such messaging as an expression of free speech, is a case in point

Not being a student of constitutional law, I am unaware of any other parts of our Constitution than the FA that provide an umbrella mandate for the government’s guarantee of free speech.  There may be and no doubt are other provisions in that document that have been invoked invite/impel government to also enforce free speech rights.  If, how, and when the various arms of government continue to guarantee these rights, this election season may become the most important civics lesson of our lifetime.

[16mar16 update]  My interpretation of First Amendment’s support of private free speech continues to draw ever more strident opposition in the comment stream, opposition that has now ascended to ex cathedra levels.  I have also been advised civilly yet firmly to read up on the amendment, my previous scribblings apparently giving no evidence of that.  And all along I thought that I was a student of the pragmatic school of interpreting rights and privileges, and traveled in the good company of outfits like Heritage, Cato, and Founders like Madison.  The latter wrote to his fellow legislators – “The people shall not be deprived or abridged of their right to speak, to write, or to publish their sentiments; and the freedom of the press, as one of the great bulwarks of liberty, shall be inviolable.”

From my ‘Rights and Privileges’ A RIGHT is a codified permission to do, be, or have that is granted by an agency to its member individuals/agencies who have formed and maintain the granting agency to carry out their collective will in a manner that requires the agency to expend all necessary resources to insure that such granted rights are enjoyed uniformly by all of its franchised members.

The method by which governments (‘granting agencies’) convey and guarantee rights is by forcefully and through force of law act to prevent any third parties from depriving or abridging a person’s ability to do, be, or have what is permitted, and also constraining its own actions in the same manner and to the same degree.  Pertaining to rights, anything beyond that is perfidious pabulum.  For example, no matter how strongly I abhor Nazi ideology, I cannot deprive or abridge present day Nazis from proselytizing, marching, waving flags, etc in the public fora any more than I can do that to a 4-H club or the parading Shriners.  Were I to attempt such interdiction, some law enforcement agency of government would swing into action to thwart me, and depending how I resist, would even kill me to protect such expressions of free speech.

This interpretation has a long history in our country, and is especially relevant in the last decades as “today's free speech and free press law is not much influenced by original meaning. It is mostly the creature of the experience and thinking of the twentieth century”.  Within this thought and practice, there remains “a small set of rather narrow exceptions to free speech protection” among which we can count incitement, false statements of facts (knowing lies), obscenity, child pornography, threats, fighting words, and words “owned by others” (intellectual property).

For Heritage, UCLA law professor Eugene Volokh also advises us that “free speech/press law is sometimes called the tax code of constitutional law. (Its discussion) suggests how complex the law is, but while some of the complexity may be needless, much of it is inevitable. Communication is in many ways the most complicated of human activities, and no simple rule can properly deal with all the different kinds of harms that it can cause—or all the different kinds of harms that restricting communication can cause.”

I hope that I’ve made clear my own humble perspective on the matter; I do tend to be the pragmatist, especially when it comes to viewing the behavior of collectives like government and in the professed practice of technology – avoid quo vadis, just watch their feet.  From my own studies, anyone speaking with certitude on what the Constitution and case law summarily conclude about free speech is definitely riding the high horse of hubris.  As with preventable global warming, the debate is far from over.  So by all means, let the debate continue.

[20mar16 update] Some random observations about the ever widening differences between the people of the Left and Right.  We now hear that more leftwing thugs in Arizona have shut down a highway leading to a Trump campaign venue, and have also had to be removed from preventing supporters entry into the venue.  Since Bolshevik times denying or disrupting the free speech of the opposition has been the hallmark, or litmus test if you will, of the collectivists under whatever banner they gather.   It’s the indelible proof that the Left’s ideas are bankrupt, and cannot contend on their own in the marketplace of ideas even when the audiences have been dumbed down.

Posted in , , , ,

177 responses to “The Stop Trump Terrorists (updated 20mar16)”

  1. Walt Avatar

    @ Bill’s 8:10 post,,
    Uh, RIGHT HERE!!! Guilty as charged. We elect a so-called “Repub”, and the first thing he does is put on the kneepads to spitshine a donkey peck*r. (Cruz being the lone exception at the moment) The GOP (as stated in the past) is LIB lite these days.
    Name a “promise” made by the GOP that has been fulfilled since they took control.
    ” You elect US,, and we will stop “X”…”
    It’s been more like ” Thanks for electing us!,, SUCKERS!!!!”
    And they wonder why the blue collar voters are behind Trump. Like Barry said, he telles it like it is, and is no pansey apologist.

    Like

  2. Bill Tozer Avatar
    Bill Tozer

    Walt: Sorry for diverging off topic, dear reader but….But nobody asks what a large portion of the electorate from both sides of the aisle are angry about. All they (the pundits) do is say “they are angry”. But they never finish the statement. They are angry at….fill in the blanks. Then it is not a pie in the sky general mood, but a specific reason. Our anger has a target. Anger had a focus, a cause, a thing to be directed at.
    I have often mused within myself Trump’s meteoric rise. It is no mystery. First, I never watched his show, never even liked him in the least, and when I heard he was one of the 19 or more asswipes throwing his hat into the ring, I said “what a joke! He is an idiot. Besides, this is not time for a 1% to jump in since we (the county’s left) have spent the last years since OWS hating on the 1%ers. Great, another New Yorker with a private jet” was my initial reaction. That’s the facts, Jack.
    Then he gets up on the stage and says we need to control our borders. The house erupted! Then, surprised by the reaction, he lets his hair own and says what everyone was too afraid to say…build a wall! A big wall. And if you say we need a ten foot wall, I will build a 20 foot wall. And if you say we need 20 foot wall, I will build a 30 foot wall. And let’s round up all the illegals who are robbers, cheats, liars, rapists, and murders and get them the hell out of here! With that, he blew the roof off the building and we are witnessing the aftermath from that day.
    What are we angry about? Well, after losing to Obama twice, the RNC got together for a big internal introspection and came up a plan. The DNC did as well, but they said the problem was their message was not being heard. Oh, it got heard alright, which is why they got shellacked in 2014, but I digress.
    Anyway, the RNC came up with a roadmap after much soul searching. The plan is to expand the base by being nice and reaching out to Latinos. Thus Gang of 8 and numerous proposals from all sides. Yet, the real point was never addressed. No use discussing legal immigration when illegal immigration is quasi-lawful, not enforced, and pretty much the practice of the land. We lost control of our borders as well as our say in a good orderly legal immigration processes. Plus the idea of rewarding bad behavior sticks like barbed wire in many a caw.
    So, that is why I am angry. And when the Trumpmeister said build a wall, I erupted. Then, after Fergerson and Baltimore and everybody was talking about criminals being unfairly targeted in high crime areas and we need to be much more tolerate, understanding, gentle, and confess our sins of Whte Privlege, Trump said he would send nr cops to clean up the area ad make it safe for the residents! Wow, that blew the doors off the building and the beginning of black mothers (fearing for their kid’s safety walking to school) standing on their chairs.
    People are concerned about him being a homophobe. Not I. When the transgender topic had its 15 minutes of fame foaming out of every lib’s lips, Trump said you got an innie and an outie, you figure it out. He ain’t going to waste time on these side issues or do the micromanage thing.
    I am angry that this push to make us like Europe (there was a Revolutionary WAR to not be like Europe) with a borderless Nortth America pisses me off. Don’t trod or our country! I love most every legal and illegal Mexican I have ever met. And I speak Espanol quite well, thank you. I am angry over losing our sovereignty to not offend Muslims, illegal aliens, and the Globalists.
    And I am half white and come from the First Nations, unlike the butt ugly late comers like the Navajo Nations and the idiots like the Apaches. Build the wall. Make it 40-50 feet tall as a replica of the Vatican.
    Thank you.

    Like

  3. drivebyposter Avatar
    drivebyposter
  4. Todd Juvinall Avatar
    Todd Juvinall

    True the democrats are pretty stupid. At least there is a difference of opinion on the right. But you can bet the dems will put a convict in charge as well as a commie. Good call.

    Like

  5. George Rebane Avatar

    rlc 758am – “party of stupid”, hmmmm. Admittedly the Repubs have not always done the right thing. But assuming you are contrasting the Repubs with the smarter Dems, then pray what are the particular attributes of the Dems that support your conclusion?

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  6. George Boardman Avatar

    As The Wall Street Journal points out this morning, there’s plenty of blame to go around:
    http://www.wsj.com/articles/trump-and-the-protesters-1457909062
    As for Breitbart, any “news” organization that won’t stand behind its own reporters isn’t worthy of the title. Their reaction to the assault on their own reporter shows they are spineless toadies for the conservative cause.

    Like

  7. Todd Juvinall Avatar
    Todd Juvinall

    And ABC supported their gal who was gang raped in Cairo? Seems the press is slimy no matter what side it is.

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  8. George Rebane Avatar

    Have to agree with the observations of both Messrs Boardman (939am) and Juvinall (1006am). My overall view of our Fourth Estate has been dim for a couple of decades now. And their claims to be ‘fair, balanced, and unafraid’ are for the most fraudulent. Some years back I was compared to a journalist; my considered response was –
    http://rebaneruminations.typepad.com/rebanes_ruminations/2007/12/i-am-not-a-jour.html

    Like

  9. rl crabb Avatar

    Come November, we’ll see which party has the least functioning gray matter. I wouldn’t give you a plug nickel for either one.

    Like

  10. Todd Juvinall Avatar
    Todd Juvinall

    How many cartoonists were outside the cancelled gig? Any throw a punch?

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  11. drivebyposter Avatar
    drivebyposter

    “I will say the Trumpster has been good for my profession”
    -rlcrabb
    Scott Adams appears to be taking the blame, so maybe you have something there.
    http://blog.dilbert.com/post/140995102361/the-trump-riots-that-are-mostly-my-fault

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  12. rl crabb Avatar

    There are many who compare 2016 to 1968, or 1932. It makes calling this election difficult, because if it turns into a shooting gallery, all bets are off. (Does anyone doubt that RFK would have been elected if not for that Palestinian?)
    I’m working on my time machine so I can go back and kill baby Hitler. Maybe I’ll stop in the fifties on my way back to take care of baby Trump. But then, we might have a sane election and I’d have to work at these cartoons. Never mind.

    Like

  13. fish Avatar
    fish

    Posted by: rl crabb | 14 March 2016 at 12:34 PM
    I’m working on my time machine so I can go back and kill baby Hitler. Maybe I’ll stop in the fifties on my way back to take care of baby Trump. But then, we might have a sane election and I’d have to work at these cartoons. Never mind.

    OK….solid plan RL…..while you’re back there I need you to pick up a lottery ticket for me…..I’ll e-mail you the numbers! Just don’t leave until you hear from me!

    Like

  14. drivebyposter Avatar
    drivebyposter

    (Does anyone doubt that RFK would have been elected if not for that Palestinian?)
    I doubt he would have won the primary.
    I was just musing about the poorly behaved groups crashing the Trump get-togethers.
    What’s the bet they are indirectly run from the Clinton camp, but using Sanders uniforms. It’s a win win situation for Mr. Tozer’s gal in that case.
    All this Hitler talk has made me thirsty. Time for a glass of wine.

    Like

  15. fish Avatar
    fish

    Posted by: drivebyposter | 14 March 2016 at 01:04 PM
    All this Hitler talk has made me thirsty….

    The Rebanes Ruminations comment thread line of the day!~

    Like

  16. rl crabb Avatar

    drivethruposter 1:04pm – He did win California. Nobody knows how that election would have played out, but RFK would’ve put up a good fight in Chicago. McCarthy was too much like Bernie and no one really cared much for ol’ Hubert.

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  17. George Rebane Avatar

    rlc 122pm – Agreed. That was the year we registered as Dems and voted for RFK, and then that night …

    Like

  18. drivebyposter Avatar
    drivebyposter

    “. Nobody knows how that election would have played out, ”
    That’s true. OTOH, there were only three more states after California, and Humphrey vs Kennedy was at 561 vs 393 delegates when Kennedy was killed. Personally, I’d have to vote for party bosses + LBJ to likely hand the nomination to HHH in any case, although there would have been more of an uproar. Admittedly, given the Kennedy family ability to work the back alleys of US politics, RFK had a much greater chance than McCarthy.
    It’s probably a good reminder for me to consider former US Presidential candidates when I think of Hillary Clinton as being utterly corrupt. In the scheme of things, she’s probably just your average office seeker at that level.

    Like

  19. Bill Tozer Avatar
    Bill Tozer

    Did somebody mention Herbert Heracio Humprey?
    “Richard Nixon,” wrote Hunter S. Thompson, “is living in the White House today because of what happened that night in Chicago.”
    Hunter got that one right.
    That fall, Humphrey was daily assailed by the kinds of haters now disrupting Trump rallies. Everywhere he went, they chanted, “Dump the Hump!” At times, Humphrey came close to tears.
    That fall, Humphrey realized the monster he helped nurture.
    My tormentors, he said, are “not just hecklers, but highly disciplined, well-organized agitators … some of them are anarchists, and some of these groups are destroying the Democratic Party and destroying this country.”
    “In 1970, when President Nixon sent U.S. troops into Cambodia to clean out Viet Cong sanctuaries, and students rioted, Ronald Reagan called them “cowardly fascists,” and declared, “If there’s going to be a bloodbath, let it begin here.”
    Good timing. Love stories from the old geezers that were there. “Power to the people!” Nothin new under the sun.
    http://www.wnd.com/2016/03/republican-wimps-absolve-the-rioters/

    Like

  20. rl crabb Avatar

    fish 12:38 pm – Forget the lottery. I’m going back to September, 1981, and putting a grand down on the 49ers to win the superbowl.

    Like

  21. Don Bessee Avatar
    Don Bessee

    I have to crack up at the reports that madam liar liar pantsuits on fire’s voters are the high propensity lottery buyer types. CBS reports that madam liar liar pantsuits on fire’s voters have the worst credit scores of all the candidates. I would have thought that comrade Bernie would have won that from all the occupy wall street types in his camp. LOL 😉

    Like

  22. Bill Tozer Avatar
    Bill Tozer

    Boys will be boys. Now we have food fights in the streets. Heard a few knuckle sandwiches were exchanged among the Love Feast. It’s so nice to see everybody acting so nice and so PC. Even the mischievous,youngsters,took the night off and no protests going down. Peace out Bro dig yourfro.

    Like

  23. Don Bessee Avatar
    Don Bessee

    Whatever your view of Trump the fact that the red Chinese govt. is doing editorials against him has to be worth some votes just on the face of the Chinese fear factor.

    Like

  24. Bill Tozer Avatar
    Bill Tozer

    Don, expect the onslaught on foreign governments nervous about Trumppress. It’s been going on since Vinente Fox about 10 days ago. Now the Japanese, Chinese, and the whole EU is nervous as hell. Pus even the House of Saud. Doom, doom, doom if Donald J Trump keeps on hitting back and hitting hard. The Whole Friggin World is nervous, ROFLMFUEO.
    I bet 20 years from now some researcher or student doing a homework assignment on the old 2016 Election comes across a memo or e-mail that links foreign governments pouring in millions funneled through PACs to Dump the Trump.
    Bring it one, open the floodgates and give us all you got!
    Mr. Trump, keep smoking the varmint out of their holes. You got our back, we have your back. Ain’t the time to play nice or go jello legs. We ain’t no Sunsne Patriots. Hit back, hit hard, hit often. We have our powder dry, torches at the ready, and the gullitine sharpened all nice and shiny. Bring it on.
    Hey corrupt foreign governments, Soros types, and the Clinton DNC Machine: hopefully you can show us more firepower than those blanks and cap guns you have been firing. Wimpy, wimpy is all I can say you girlie men. Time to bend you over our knee and spank your bum bums.

    Like

  25. Jon Avatar
    Jon

    Down Goes Drumpf! Down, down goes Drumpf! The adult in the room wins and hatred and bigotry takes a massive shot to the gut.
    Y’all need to listen to your Uncle Jon.:)
    Brokered Convention, Cleveland, OH! MARK THE TAPE.

    Like

  26. fish Avatar
    fish

    I do so enjoy watching seemingly grown “men” swoon over politicians.

    Like

  27. Jon Avatar
    Jon

    Here’s a funny one. Not that we didn’t know this. Despises the guy but needs work :).
    http://thinkprogress.org/politics/2016/03/15/3760261/carson-offered-position-by-trump/
    Similar to Christie pining for the AG slot, with upcoming trials of his NJ cronies on the pending agenda.. Couldn’t hurt to be the AG..

    Like

  28. Bill Tozer Avatar
    Bill Tozer

    We will see how good of an AG Christie is after he is he has been in the Trump Administration for a few months.
    Yo, Jon, hope you got over your man crush with Rubio. Yes, he is indeed handsome man, but your flirtations and yearnings over Beautiful Marco was kinda weird. Now, it appears your mangina is all a flutter for Gov. K.
    Please, for your Peter’s sake, wipe up after yourself.

    Like

  29. Gregory Avatar
    Gregory

    George, back to the last update up top:

    “When individuals attempt to violate FA rights, they almost always do that through some physical action that also and most clearly violates some other law intended to enforce privacy, maintain the peace, security in one’s person, prohibit trespassing, threaten violence, … . It is then that government, when it selectively chooses, steps in and prevents such actions motivated by and proximal to the intent to deny free speech and/or FA rights. That has been the clear method of enforcing the right to free speech in our Republic. To argue that this technically is not the government enforcing the right to free speech is to my mind a specious twist of what has actually been happening in our society.”

    You still have that absolutely WRONG. Freedom of Speech under the first amendment is the right to speak without censorship or restraint by the government. Nothing more, nothing less. As British subjects, the founders of this country didn’t have it, and current citizens of Great Britain still don’t have it to the extent we do in the US though they arguably have a very genteel and well behaved country (outside of the Sharia law regions, of course).
    You certainly have the right to step onto a soapbox in a public park and start giving everyone your opinion, but I would have every right to stand nearby and give countering opinions, as long as I avoided “fighting words” which the government does have a right to counter. You also have a body of other rights which together might “feel” like the 1st Amendment to you, but they aren’t.
    I’m afraid the asshole with the Cal State ‘Frisco Bachelor of Arts Poli Sci degree who absolutely hates you has it right and you would do well to actually read up on the issue. NONE of the relevant SCOTUS decisions on the 1st involve a private entity restricting the speech of another.
    In fact ALL of the Bill of Rights are restrictions on the Federal Government, which have been found to apply to state and local governments in more modern history, with the normalization of the 2nd being the most recent. That’s what the modern lefties are referring to when they speak of “negative rights”… things that tie the hands of governments, as opposed to “positive rights” which is their misleading words for entitlements to money and goods they did not earn but the government takes from Peter to give to Paul, whose vote they want to buy… but I digress.
    Rather than spin more of your philosophy to prove to your satisfaction that the First is, in a roundabout way, actually granting your rights to speak your mind to friends in your living room, I suggest actually reading up on it.
    Here’s a couple online legal dictionary entries that may help:
    “The right, guaranteed by the First Amendment to the U.S. Constitution, to express beliefs and ideas without unwarranted government restriction.”
    http://legal-dictionary.thefreedictionary.com/Freedom+of+Speech
    The entry for the 1st Amendment as a whole is more complicated but it remains solely the restrictions on governments to restrict the rights specified:
    http://legal-dictionary.thefreedictionary.com/first+amendment
    So George, I agree, you put together a rational and distinctly American case for the 1st reaching down into everyday life, but it doesn’t. It’s a straitjacket for the government that keeps them from censoring views they do not like. I’d say “nothing more” again, but that really doesn’t fit, either. I think that was unique for the world in the late 18th Century and is still altogether too rare.

    Like

  30. Bill Tozer Avatar
    Bill Tozer

    Excellent Mr.Gregory. Figured it was just telling Gov’t to butt out. Somebody on the left saw it your way as well. If not, then there would not have been this great rush to get hate speech laws passed.
    A quote of the day in video form.
    http://news.yahoo.com/video/barbour-ve-never-seen-anything-010013255.html

    Like

  31. Michael R. Kesti Avatar
    Michael R. Kesti

    Gregory 15Mar16 10:44 PM
    The government does not have a right to counter “fighting words.” It has the power. This is, again, not pedantry. The distinction is significant.

    Like

  32. Gregory Avatar
    Gregory

    Splitting hairs, but yes, the government is granted powers, people have rights. A momentary slip, I assume you had no other hairs that needed splitting.

    Like

  33. drivebyposter Avatar
    drivebyposter
  34. Gregory Avatar
    Gregory

    Reset!

    Like

  35. drivebyposter Avatar
    drivebyposter

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Thw6k1XNRtc
    Bam!
    Trump is alright.
    Russ Steele, is that a bonafide ad or something the net cooked up? It’s brilliant.

    Like

  36. Russ Steele Avatar
    Russ Steele

    drivebyposters@02:22PM
    This is a real 15-second ad. Rush mentioned on the air and has linked to it on his website. I saw it linked at PJ Media, Glenn Reynolds blog.

    Like

  37. Gregory Avatar
    Gregory

    George, perhaps the Heritage Society has enough credibility for you. They write, in part,

    “1. As with all of the Bill of Rights, the free speech/press guarantee restricts only government action, not action by private employers, property owners, householders, churches, universities, and the like.
    2. As with most of the Bill of Rights, the free speech/press guarantee applies equally to federal and state governments, which includes local governments as well as all branches of each government. In particular, the civil courts are subject to the First Amendment, which is why libel law and other tort law rules must comply with free speech/press principles. New York Times Co. v. Sullivan (1964).
    3. The free speech and the free press clauses have been read as providing essentially equal protection to speakers and writers, whether or not they are members of the institutional press, and largely regardless of the medium—books, newspapers, movies, the Internet—in which they communicate. Newspapers enjoy no more and no fewer constitutional rights than individuals. The one exception is over-the-airwaves radio and television broadcasting, which has for historical reasons been given less constitutional protection. Reno v. ACLU (1997).”

    http://www.heritage.org/constitution/#!/amendments/1/essays/140/freedom-of-speech-and-of-the-press
    You have it wrong, George.

    Like

  38. Gregory Avatar
    Gregory

    George, rereading todays addendum, since you cited the Heritage Society in supporting your views on the 1st Amendment, perhaps it is time for you to revise your remarks.

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  39. Gregory Avatar
    Gregory

    Checking further, George cited the same link I did, and by reading the lesson plan on the Bill of Rights that Heritage supplies on that page, the “First, the guarantees in the Freedom of Speech and Freedom of the Press Clauses protect individuals against the actions of government, not against the actions of private individuals” is a quote from a Eugene Volokh essay that Heritage reproduces.
    Q.E.D.

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  40. George Rebane Avatar

    Gregory 453pm – You are free to take any part of Heritage’s interpretation on the FA you wish. I have taken mine and will stand with what actually happens in real life and on the street with regard to governments’ behaviors, and not with what lawyers argue under marble arches. You may want to test your theory by attempting to halt the speech of the Nazis or the Shriners.
    I do think that we have now talked past each other enough, but you may not agree.

    Like

  41. Gregory Avatar
    Gregory

    George, what part of “the guarantees in the Freedom of Speech and Freedom of the Press Clauses protect individuals against the actions of government, not against the actions of private individuals” do you disagree with?
    It was your citation and I see no need to “test my theory” as I agree wholeheartedly with Volokh and Company, nor do I feel a need to wander into a Black Lives Matter gathering to proclaim Michael Brown was shot lawfully by an officer of the law who had a rational fear for his life at the time.

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  42. Bill Tozer Avatar
    Bill Tozer

    Die Donor Scum: a case history.
    http://www.anncoulter.com

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  43. drivebyposter Avatar
    drivebyposter

    Just to catch up, I checked out one of the debates on youtube.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w-McIdVuY88

    Like

  44. Bill Tozer Avatar
    Bill Tozer

    Too funny Mr. drivebyposter. This election has something for everyone. Popcorn time. Shirts vs Skins, toe to toe, low blow after low blow. And the ref is related to the Boxing Commissioner. Oh goody.
    Note to the faint of heart and those who cry out “Doom and Carnage” from Essentric Aunt Esther’s attic room window: Best pull down hard on that seatbelt. The roller coaster operator is thinking bad thoughts and hates his job today.
    https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10209164699453478&set=o.235086849974878&type=3&theater

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  45. Don Bessee Avatar
    Don Bessee

    Notwithstanding the vying merits of the broader free speech thread, I have to acknowledge the erudite free speech that flourishes here. Thanks Doc!

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