[Exciting days – the Pope pays a political visit to the US, China's Xi Jinping is lecturing American business in Seattle while waiting for his turn to bamboozle Obama, and Hillary swings wildly to the left with new price control proposals while 'the outsiders' winnow the Republican field. gjr]
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Posted in Comment Sandbox
208 responses to “Sandbox – 23sep15”
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LOL! Moonbat Brown greeted our soon to be overlord.( “O” was even late to meet the Pope) China is looking to get some of it’s loan back, in the form of Real Estate.( Came to look over his investment) Yes, the U.S. can start with Seattle. It’s pretty much Communist, so they should feel right at home under Chinese rule. Frisco will be next on the payment schedule.
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Exactly Walt. Boy, you are really nailing it with your rational commentary today.
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Walt, most all of Washington State would agree with you, except those liberals living along the I-5 corridor. Those people like to dwell in the pricey neighborhoods. Birds of a feather and all that.
So, Walt, you just could not resist telling us that O was late for his Papal visit. Don’t you know that religious discussions is a big big taboo to the far left radical extremists who are out of touch with the ordinary people, but do not think so? No religion taking allowed, unless it is a good religion like Islam, a political ideal. Something to do with separation of Church and State. Just in case you were unawares about taboos, big guy.
http://patriotpost.us/posts/37800
http://patriotpost.us/cartoons/22462LikeLike
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Hey anti-regulation fans who trust Corporations to do the right thing in a beautiful land of minimal regulations- whats your take on the VW scandal?
Let me guess…they had to cheat because of unreasonably tough regulations on NOx emissions? Are the effects of NOx from diesel emissions overblown?LikeLike
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Well let’s see. Hmmm. You libs support Obama/Kerry letting Iran self inspect on nuclear weapons. So, who gives a shit?
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What a class act you are, Todd. Ignore the question and strike out with profanity because you don’t like the true answer. So we duly note your view of the VW scandal, the impact on the environment, and its half million angry American victims.
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Speaking of corporations doing really good things for society, what is your take on the recent events at Turing Pharma, where it was legal- so they raised a life saving drug taken by people by 5500% overnight? No problem, right? The CEO caught just took a little flak on that one.
http://www.nytimes.com/2015/09/23/business/big-price-increase-for-an-old-drug-will-be-rolled-back-turing-chief-says.htmlLikeLike
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VWs were my first cars – we owned three beetles and one micro-bus – and they have a warm place in my heart. But VW became corporatist as it grew and became a toady of the governments under which it manufactured and sold its products. What they did with their diesel control software is unforgivable, and the PEOPLE involved should pay a hefty price. Investors should also evaluate such corporations that require active government participation/support for them to survive in the marketplace.
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Wel, my 64 bug is exempt from smog, so I don’t give a shit either. Plus, look at all the money I save on smog certificates through the years. Gotta watch one’s pennies during these hard economic times as evidenced by the growing number of homeless Obama Camps springing up. Heard there are 75 people on food stamps for every job this current Administration has created. It’s all Hoover’s fault I reckon.
Yo Walt:
https://www.facebook.com/lastamericapatriots/photos/a.235465606603669.1073741827.235086849974878/556595671157326/?type=3LikeLike
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Agree 100% George. My first vehicle was a VW Superbeetle with the clutchless semi-automatic shifter.
Fact remains that the pollution impact from this deception on human lungs is beyond comprehension, especially on the European continent where diesel reigns.
The brand is forever scarred, no matter what steps they take now. This will drag on for decades.LikeLike
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So “jon” how is it you support Iran self inspecting?
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Hey anti-regulation fans who trust Corporations to do the right thing in a beautiful land of minimal regulations- whats your take on the VW scandal?
They got caught.
As it turns out it was these guys!
The independent body International Council on Clean Transportation (ICCT) conducted a study in 2014 showing that diesel automobile exhaust, under “real-world” driving conditions, tends to contain regulated pollutants above the maximum allowable levels set by European emission standards, as well as similar U.S. regulations.[5] Some tested models showed a particularly large discrepancy, and the ICCT, in cooperation with West Virginia University conducted additional tests to verify their findings. The published results confirmed the ICCT’s findings.[6] The findings were also directly presented to the the Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) and the California Air Resources Board (CARB) in May 2014.[7]
Remember jon…..this wasn’t a question of regulation vs. non regulation…..this occurred with all the regulations in place. Initially I thought it had to be CARB…..I figured that EPA was probably still writing up their “mission statement”….or spinning their mine clean up disaster!
Let me guess…they had to cheat because of unreasonably tough regulations on NOx emissions? Are the effects of NOx from diesel emissions overblown?
IIRC the newest VWs use a heated system that was supposed to dissociate NOx without needing Urea addition. But no…..they too need the exhaust treatment!
Starting with the 2009 model year, Volkswagen Group began migrating its light-duty passenger vehicle TDI diesel engines to a common-rail fuel injection system. This type of injection system allows for higher-precision fuel delivery through the use of electronically controlled fuel injectors and higher injection pressure, theoretically leading to better fuel atomization, better air/fuel ratio control, and by extension, better control of emissions.[1][2]
2010 VW Golf TDI Clean Diesel on display at a U.S. auto show.
With the addition of a diesel particulate filter to capture soot, and on some vehicle models, a urea-based exhaust aftertreatment system, the engines were touted by Volkswagen as being as clean as or cleaner than U.S. and Californian requirements, while providing good performance and drivability.[3][4]Sounds like a good time to look into buying a new VW!
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go for it fish. After they do their recall and make the changeout, the diesels will run horribly, like they did in the 80s with smoke and problems in the winter. But you’ll be unique.
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hey Todd, no I don’t support self inspection. Neither would anyone in our Administration. That’s why its not in the deal.
MOVE-ON. the Iran deal is done.LikeLike
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Let’s see, VW, violating the spirit but maybe not the letter of the law, spoofed the Federal tests and delivered a better driving car to their customers. That has stopped, you can’t buy a diesel from a VW dealer until they get Fed approved software in place. If you want one, I’d suggest the used market.
I’d like to see a before and after comparison of all measured quantities, including things like acceleration and mileage. If what they delivered really does have significant performance advantages, expect a bang up black market for downloads with software that can be switched on and off by owners before they take their vehicle in for an inspection.LikeLike
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“jon” you are a ignorant loon. Too bad.
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Posted by: fish | 23 September 2015 at 02:24 PM
Let’s give credit where credit is due, VW was caught by CARB…
http://www.vcstar.com/opinion/columnists/timm-herdt/timm-herdt-how-the-california-air-resources-board-caught-volkswagen_01503757
“How was the deceit uncovered?
Hebert writes that California regulators had noted unexpectedly high in-use emissions from light-duty diesel vehicles and initiated discussions about that with their European counterparts. They were engaged in their own testing last year when the International Council and the University of West Virginia released their own findings that were “consistent and complementary” to the Air Board’s research.
Discussions with Volkswagen officials were initiated, leading to a voluntary recall last December that the company claimed fixed the problem. The Air Board’s testing to confirm that assertion found the recall had resulted in some improvements, but that NOx emissions were still elevated.
Technical meetings with VW officials were conducted over the summer until the company came clean about its defeat devices on Sept. 3”LikeLike
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Nice try Todd. You can’t answer my inquire on VW, so its time to go for the personal attack and go off on the Iran deal.. good one. Kesti is so spot on about you.
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Posted by: Steven Frisch | 23 September 2015 at 03:14 PM
“Initially I thought it had to be CARB…..I figured that EPA was probably still writing up their “mission statement”….or spinning their mine clean up disaster!”
Tip of the Cap to CARB then!LikeLike
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” jon” move along now. You are more irrelevant with each post. Jeeze you sure a dumb.
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Posted by: Jon | 23 September 2015 at 02:33 PM
Please….your going to see a thriving aftermarket in performance chips and tuning kits.
You should see what is available for the diesel truck aftermarket…you would wet yourself!LikeLike
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“VW, violating the spirit but maybe not the letter of the law” Gregory
Sure Gregory..it was the spirit! Yup, that’s why the CEO resigned and they have already admitted wrongdoing. And every freaking prosecutorial body in the US and Europe is coming in like a tsunami on the company. The Spirit was broken! LOL.
“That has stopped, you can’t buy a diesel from a VW dealer until they get Fed approved software in place. If you want one, I’d suggest the used market.”
why in the hell would anyone want to get near a VW diesel after the news of the past few days? OMG, are you alright?LikeLike
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Wasn’t that car “Hitlers” invention? I bet Frisch drives a Jetta.
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fish 328pm – re the “diesel truck aftermarket”, pray where may I go to wet myself? (My lovey truck is a GMC 2500 Duramax diesel.)
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Posted by: Jon | 23 September 2015 at 03:28 PM
OMG
Let us know when you exit the fetal position…..we can talk again then.LikeLike
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Gregory is on to something. Instead of doing what most people do, just buy aftermarket software. Normally people reattach the vacuum lines and adjust the idle down before the test. It may run like crap, especially after the smog guy make a few more adjustments, but you drive out of the place with smog certificate in hand. Then straight to the mechanic who fixes what the smog guy did. Or do it yourself. Smog guys will tell you exactly what they did and to what degree if asked. Your sweet for another two years…or just the aftermarket software which is the easiest way. Get it from Germany. Think Global, Act Local.
40 times the gross pollutants coming from a car is peanuts compared to the 50-100 times of gross foul hideous pollinates coming out of Jon’s posts. Software won’t help Jon or any lib for that matter.LikeLike
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Posted by: George Rebane | 23 September 2015 at 03:32 PM
Start here…..
http://www.trucktrend.com/diesel-power-magazine/LikeLike
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Posted by: George Rebane | 23 September 2015 at 03:32 PM
Check your typepad spam folder…..my post with link was just eaten!LikeLike
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good one Tozer. Congrats to you and your friend, firmly in the minority position on the VW scandal.
1 million tonnes of pollutants per day in Europe because of the fraud.LikeLike
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Bill Tozer | 23 September 2015 at 03:35 PM
Yep, and of course he never answers any questions from the posters here. It also appears he is ignorant on the “side deals” the IAEA made with Iran about self inspecting. Iran with a nuke, “jon” seems to be OK with that. Liberals do have a mental disorder.LikeLike
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My son has a chevy diesel and he has added a few aftermarket items. I think it could pull 10 elephants now. LOL!
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Well maybe not quite such an enthusiastic hat tip after all!
“Hebert writes that California regulators had noted unexpectedly high in-use emissions from light-duty diesel vehicles and initiated discussions about that with their European counterparts. They were engaged in their own testing last year when the International Council and the University of West Virginia released their own findings that were “consistent and complementary” to the Air Board’s research.”
Looks like CARB turned in someone else’s homework…….
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That’s right Todd, I am OK with the Iran deal. Really good with it. So are most Americans. Another crowning accomplishment of an African American President. (but is he a Muslim??? oooh). You guys continue to linger here on the fringes of American opinion, and that’s just fine with me.
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That is OK “jon”. We understand our mental illness.
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Oops, your mental illness. LOL!
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Posted by: Jon | 23 September 2015 at 03:51 PM
You guys continue to linger here on the fringes of American opinion, and that’s just fine with me.
Me too!
Mainstream America these days is populated largely with an invasive species of unthinking slack jawed conformists.
But hey…..on you it looks good!
/DangerfieldLikeLike
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Oh, also, 82% of the American people were opposed to the Iran deal. It appears you don’t read well or your comprehensive abilities are severely lacking there “jon” boy.
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“40 times the gross pollutants coming from a car …”
That is patently false. The reports are one particular pollutant is up by a factor of 40 in one phase of the test. We don’t know what happens to all categories in actual use, or in the static testing.
I’m going to make a wild guess that CO2 (if we call it a pollutant, which it is not) is unchanged in cruise and idle because it’s sold to customers based of mileage, and the best mileage (all else being reasonably equal) will be when it emits the most CO2 per gallon burned.
I’d bet Frisch’s 6 figure salary as CEO of a wretchedly misnamed 501c3 rentseeking corporation that the head of VW who fell on his sword has a nice golden parachute for his willingness to be the one to fall on his sword for not being better at fudging the software.
Estimate the particulates emitted by all the VW diesels sold vs the particulates from the Valley Fire… anyone?
Here’s how Hot Air put it:
“The way most of the regulations are written seems to indicate that the vehicle must have a functional system of this type which is accurately monitoring system performance and meets the maximum emissions requirements at the time of testing. Obviously the VW vehicles in question were doing just that. But cars today have all sorts of bells and whistles which drivers can use to customize their driving experience. They can switch from “performance” mode to “economy” mode with the push of a button. Things like that obviously affect the vehicle’s emissions. Other such options are available. And when you think about it, the “disable device” was really just putting the car into a different mode of operation which includes heavy emissions control. When it was disconnected and ready to head back out on the road it was switching back to a different mode with a bit more performance. None of that changes the fact that the emissions were within the required limits at the time of testing.
Of course that’s a horribly transparent dodge in terms of legal tactics, but the law is generally held to and enforced based on how it is written. Volkswagen was obviously gaming the system here but if it’s going to come down to 18 billion in fines I can’t help but wonder if they won’t make a run at a defense like that in court.”
You can bet the EPA is or has new wording of the regs to make it ironclad.LikeLike
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Well somebody had their fiber, sandbox filled up fast. So now the ayatollah says no deal unless sanctions are totally removed not just lifting sequentially with compliance by iran. Is anyone surprised they are already going all slippery on their obligations like self inspecting and delivering soil samples to the IAEA?
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fish 337pm – Thank you Mr fish, the spam sucker had actually devoured two valid comments.
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We all knew the “Supreme Commander” of Iran would quit. Hell, Obama bent over and took it from them and they still screwed him. Our dopey Senate even gave up the right to enforce the “Treaty” clause for all this. I bet they already have a nuke and a delivery system (thanks to North Korea) and just want the sanctions lifted so they will have food in their fallout shelters.
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Comment of the day from reason.com
R C Dean|9.23.15 @ 1:49PM|#
Kill a bunch of proles? Pay a $900mm fine and go on your way. Oh, and that recent DOJ memo swearing to go after corporate officers and directors – don’t you worry about that.
Cheat on a regulatory test? We’ll bankrupt your ass, even though there’s really no reason to believe a single person was harmed.I guess the feds still have a warm place in their hearts for GM.
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Gregory, really good stuff there. Are you pining for a defense attorney role with VW? You might even have time to complete a law degree and get hired on, in the decades this case will take to completely resolve itself.
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Not surprised that Jon says 82% of the people think this Iran No Nukes No Way deal is a grand idea. Jon, you are one funny man, or funny man or woman. Very funny Jon with your practical jokes. Yep, the overwhelming majority of American like this deal.
A nuke in the hands of the Iranians is no laughing matter. Caution: this graphic picture shows what happens to an American city when it is wiped out. Not for the faint of heart.
https://www.facebook.com/RowdyConservatives/photos/a.217983685002343.55586.217926015008110/733527586781281/?type=3&theater
So, the deal is a winner!!!. Oh Jon, you are a funny dude
https://www.facebook.com/PatriotPost/photos/pb.51560645913.-2207520000.1443051568./10152842759605914/?type=3&theater.LikeLike
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Posted by: Gregory | 23 September 2015 at 04:01 PM
That’s funny, I never mentioned anything about CO2, made no representation of the rationale behind CARB’s investigation, and I said nothing about testing methodology.
No where is there any rationale for comparing VW vehicle emissions to the Valley Fire [or the Butte Fire which I would have picked because its in the Sierra] nor do I see the relevance. [Not to mention the fact that I am a champion of forest thinning to rescue the risk of wildfire.]
Yet Greg still seems to get in a dig about my organization and my salary—of course he is functionally unemployable because he is such a raging ass and he can’t get along with anyone–even though that has no relevance to the discussion either.
But that’s OK Greg–we know who you are.LikeLike
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Speaking of treaties the Chinese state media is reporting that 0 will sign a cybersecurity pact that was designed by Beijing. Sure why not, they already have all the background files of everyone with a security clearance and 6 million fingerprint sets of same. State media says this pact confirms that china had nothing to do with hack in spite of all evidence and official statements to the contrary. If you cant stand up to them now what is going to happen when they take an island from say Japan? Let me guess what the ‘jon’ will say, that the Chinese have all the background checks on our senior security holders just means they will get to know us better and come to understand our good intentions as long as we don’t sabre rattle or accuse them of what we know they are doing across the world.
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I certainly don’t get along with raging assholes like Stephen Frisch; with no evidence besides his bias, he claims I’m not currently working in the corporate world because he can’t get along with me. Que lastima! Yet another libel from Stephen. Enough to be actionable? That is a question.
I brought up CO2 because people like you call it a pollutant, Steve, and it’s likely not a problem with the VW. I brought up the particulates of one of the largest fires ever in California to get a sense of proportion, which you seem to lose when it suits you. My guess is that the particulates of even that one fire dwarf the incremental particulates of the fudged VW over the VW the EPA thought was being sold but until more information is made public it’s anyone’s guess.LikeLike
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The fear and paranoia exploding from the tortured souls of Bessee and Tozer have reached unimaginable new levels….blood pressure check please!
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Todd and Tozer, I guess the strategy is just to keep repeating the bogus 82% figure enough and hope there are enough dumb crackers out there who will believe it? You might want to check your Daily Caller sources before posting falsehoods. 82% of Repubs disapprove of the deal…I can believe that.
The American public support the Iran Deal, but are skeptical of its ultimate success. All logical, rational and expected results. They don’t particularly care that BeBe is angry.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/national-security/poll-2-to-1-support-for-nuclear-deal-with-iran/2015/03/30/9a5a5ac8-d720-11e4-ba28-f2a685dc7f89_story.htmlLikeLike
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Gregory,
VW created 1 MILLION Tonnes of pollution PER DAY, over several years in Europe alone. Above and beyond what the public expected. You tell me us that compares to a CA wildfire such as Valley or Butte. And whats the point here? To excuse VW?LikeLike
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