136 responses to “Sandbox – 19jan15”

1. 

   Larry Wirth

   20 January 2015

   Tozer, you are one hilarious (but serious) writer. Thanks! L.

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2. 

   fish

   21 January 2015

   Are you actually saying that we were in better shape in 2008 when Bush left office than we are now?
   Yeah….8 1/2 trillion dollars better shape then we are now! You won’t have to pay it off Paul so it’s cool!

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3. 

   George Rebane

   21 January 2015

   fish 703am – Mr fish, who are you responding to, or is this a rhetorical question you want to answer??

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4. 

   Joe Koyote

   21 January 2015

   Some TPP facts:
   Percentage of the total global economy subject to the agreement = 40%. ::::
   Number of corporate “trade advisors” given full access to the official draft = 600 ::::
   Number of Congress members, journalists, trade unionists, and others who have had “unfettered” access to the document = 0. (The latter group have been allowed access under the conditions of no cameras, cell phones, audio recorders, no written notes, and no unsupervised viewing.)
   Apparently the powers that be do not want the public to know what they are signing on to. Very few of the chapters deal with actual trade issues. The rest lays out the legal grounds under which (like WTO) member nations can be sued by corporations for passing laws that limit “trade” like anti-pollution, product safety standards, or any law that protects or encourages (like subsidies) locally produced merchandise. In other words, under this agreement a member nation can be forced to take sub-standard or unsafe products because to not take them limits fair trade.

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5. 

   Bill Tozer

   21 January 2015

   He got my vote last night:
   http://nypost.com/2015/01/20/obamas-free-stuff/

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6. 

   fish

   21 January 2015

   Posted by: George Rebane | 21 January 2015 at 07:55 AM
   Sorry…got the sentiment left out the speaker!
   My comment was in reference to:
   Posted by: Paul Emery | 20 January 2015 at 10:10 AM

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7. 

   George Rebane

   21 January 2015

   fish 840am & 703am – In that case we might want to add that apples-to-apples unemployment comparisons would put today’s unemployment rate at about 10.5%, in fact there are 1.7M fewer workers with full time jobs now than when the recession began. And this litany goes on. I’ll have more to say about Obama’s latest lies later in the day.

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8. 

   Walt

   21 January 2015

   I would like to add,,, more businesses died than were born in the last year.
   Another first.

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9. 

   Bill Tozer

   21 January 2015

   Moving forward, it would be nice for wages to not be stagnet for another 6 years. We better get those good wages up and off flat lined cause somebody has to pay for the free day at the candy store.

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10. 

    Walt

    21 January 2015

    Hell just froze over. Another hard Lefty speaks ill of “O”
    “The highest ranking Democrat on the Senate Foreign Relations Committee, Sen. Bob Menendez of New Jersey, says the Obama administration sounds as if it’s getting talking points from Iran about its negotiations with the so-called Islamic republic.
    “I have to be honest with you, the more I hear from the administration and its quotes, the more it sounds like talking points that come straight out of Tehran,” Menendez charged at a Wednesday hearing.”

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11. 

    Joe Koyote

    21 January 2015

    it would be nice for wages to not be stagnet for another 6 years.” Actually wages have been going down since 2000. The average American’s income is $3600 less now than it was in 2000 (adjusted for inflation) while, of course, the wealthiest Americans have seen their incomes rise by 25% or more during the same time period.

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12. 

    Walt

    21 January 2015

    It’s Bush’s Fault… Right JoeK? Or maybe the Repubs who only now have any real say.
    There is just NO WAY LIBS can be responsible,, let alone Dear Leader.

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13. 

    George Rebane

    21 January 2015

    JoeK 1027am – This twin-modal wage distribution was pointed out to RR readers years ago. As technology advances this phenomenon will become more pronounced as the skilled workers/investors become more productive, the middle workers are displaced, and the transfer payment recipients grow. The only thing to stop that happening will be an autocracy cum tyranny in which everyone save the ruling elites will be paupers a la the former USSR and today’s Cuba.
    Markets – be they black, gray, or white – always demand exchanges of value for value since they are an expression of human nature. No government in history has been able to legislate and enforce an alternative schema for the exchange of goods and services, but the collectivists have yet to give up on devising such a brave new world.

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14. 

    Walt

    21 January 2015

    “In Mario Cuomo’s speech delivered in the year George Orwell predicted, Mr. Cuomo brazenly laid out his party’s platform that, indeed, the government is the answer to every problem there is, that personal responsibility is a hateful mirage and that only through government control over every aspect of our lives will America become that “shining city on a hill.” ”
    From http://www.breitbart.com/big-government/2015/01/21/bnthe-nuclear-option-mario-cuomo-and-the-democrats-bleak-ghetto-of-false-promises/
    Yup “1984”….. About the same time Dems re-branded themselves again.. From Liberal to “progressive”.

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15. 

    Bill Tozer

    21 January 2015

    It would be nice to not have our nation’s workforce shrink while our population grows. Moving forward, we need an expanding workforce to pay for all the non income tax payers and those millions now on the dole. Who is going to push the wagon while the barn is now at standing room only packed to the rafters with those milling about eating all the hay? “Who is going to help me made the bread”, asked the Little Red Hen.

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16. 

    Russell Steele

    21 January 2015

    Bill T@01:38PM,
    The sad truth is there are going to be fewer and fewer members of the work force as productivity of the existing work force continues to increase, and more work is being done by robots. The end result will be more people eating from the trough in the barn. The problem is will we have enough barns, troughs and hay to put in the trough. Not likely. The competition for barn space is going to be brutal.

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17. 

    Walt

    21 January 2015

    How the worm turns. AP has stabbed “O” in the back.
    Required reading for our resident Lefties.
    http://dailycaller.com/2015/01/21/associated-press-fact-check-tears-apart-obamas-state-of-the-union-claims/
    In other words,,, OUCH!

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18. 

    George Rebane

    21 January 2015

    Walt 521pm – Good catch Walt. Yes, AP is not exactly your rabid rightwing media outlet, yet they cut Obama a brand new aperture within a couple of hours after he left the House chamber. For more, please see my today’s KVMR commentary transcript that will post right about … now.

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19. 

    Paul Emery

    22 January 2015

    Here’s one for you Russ
    While hitting familiar Republican points criticizing the size of the federal debt, Romney at times sounded like a Democrat, calling for President Barack Obama and other leaders in Washington to act on common liberal priorities such as climate change, poverty and education.
    “I’m one of those Republicans who thinks we are getting warmer and that we contribute to that,” he said of climate change, charging that federal leaders have failed to enact global agreements needed to tackle the problem.”
    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2015/01/22/mitt-romney-climate-change_n_6523530.html

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20. 

    Joe Koyote

    22 January 2015

    Walt 10:37 — I didn’t blame anybody Walt.. just pointing out the facts. If you want to blame Bush for the country going in the tank, go ahead, or you can blame it on Y2k, or you can blame it on sun spots.. it really doesn’t matter. You righties are very good at blaming and very poor at fixing. Besides, just what did George Bush do to make the world a better place anyway?
    I find it hilarious that silver spooner Romney is now the champion of the poor and climate change after his failed run at president where he was on the opposite side of those issues. I wonder how much he paid a political consultant to tell him that if he ever wants to be elected he has to pander to the middle instead of his cronies. Duh! Typical spoiled boarding school rich kid narcissist who will say or do anything to get what they want. If Kerry was a flip-flopper, what do you call Romney.. a liar?
    George – 10:40 — So what do you propose as a solution? Yes we know all about the industrial revolution and the great economic engine that capitalism is, but historically, free market capitalism has always only succeeded in concentrating wealth rather than distributing wealth, that is if you call slum living an improvement on subsistence farming or a tract home better than the slums while ignoring the lavish lifestyles of the elites and the entire third world. Trickle down has been a failure since the beginning of time that is now cleverly being blamed on “excessive gov’t. interfering with natural processes. If it was going to work, it would have worked by now, gov’t interference or not. Economic and political theory fail to account for the wild card, greed. It all looks good on paper but the greed for wealth and power trumps (no pun intended) all the theories. So what is the solution?

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21. 

    Gregory

    22 January 2015

    NY’s Speaker of the Assembly, (a D-NYC) has been arrested on major bribery charges. Break out the popcorn:
    http://www.nydailynews.com/news/politics/assembly-speaker-silver-arrested-report-article-1.2087758

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22. 

    Don Bessee

    22 January 2015

    As the media is trashing Jindal, Breitbart has an article about a brit from Trinidad who is black doing a film on race relations across the world. His experience in Birmingham is chilling. Wonder what shapton would do there? What’s really chilling is that its from 11 years ago.

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23. 

    Todd Juvinall

    22 January 2015

    Then we have a push to reopen the plea deal given the Epstein billionaire in Florida. He was getting underage girls for himself and all his important pals. It is alleged Bill Clinton, Prince Andrew and Alan Durshowitz are among the alumni. Only RT and FOX are reporting this.

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24. 

    fish

    23 January 2015

    Posted by: Joe Koyote | 22 January 2015 at 11:24 AM
    While I’m pretty sure that I can guess…..what is your solution to the problem of inequality?

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25. 

    Joe Koyote

    23 January 2015

    As I thought.. crickets.. with the exception of fish who used the tried and true Todd response of answering a question with a question. Like I said…. all blame and no solutions..

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26. 

    Todd Juvinall

    23 January 2015

    JoeK, you are not a real person as you use a phony name. Why would we debate with a phony?

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27. 

    George Rebane

    23 January 2015

    JoeK 1124am – Joe, you are again demanding that every comment stream in RR must contain the whole litany – from soup to nuts – of any issue that is discussed and/or revisited. Positions on systemic unemployment, inequality, and redistribution of wealth have been posted here and are a matter of record for you and anyone else to read and critique. You are invited to do that, and then take a specific tenet, proposal, or interpretation of mine to task.
    Your socialist position that market driven capitalist economies (your ‘trickle down’ versions) have not benefited humanity over the last two centuries is IMHO incomprehensibly ignorant. It is only capitalism, with its attendant, inevitable inequalities and other warts, that has lifted mankind out its centuries of living lives which were forever poor, short, and brutish. And all that collectivist alternatives have contributed in this interval is hundreds of millions of citizens killed by their own governments.

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28. 

    fish

    23 January 2015

    Posted by: Joe Koyote | 23 January 2015 at 10:25 AM
    No Joe. The solutions offer here are usually reduce government regulations, reduce taxation, and reduce government spending. So we have tried to at least to present a point at which the argument can start. This is almost countered by a whiny….”why do you want to poison XXXX”, …..”why do you want people to live like XXXX”, …….”why do you hate XXXX”! We have in the United States more regulation, government intrusion, and taxation than we ever have at any point in this countries existence and yet things “just ain’t right”!
    So Joe I’ll ask you again do you have anything to contribute to the discussion?

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29. 

    fish

    23 January 2015

    …and there would be the Crickets!

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30. 

    Walt

    23 January 2015

    LOL little Joe, Capitalism works every time it’s tried. Conservatives are real good at fixing things, just as long as LIBS don’t find a way to ham string the situation.
    The states where Conservatives regained control from LIBS, things turned around for the better. That’s a fact. Ca. is no better off since Moon beam reared his ugly head. Only worse. Yup,, tax and spend is a real winner.
    If there less illegals you might have a job.
    And speaking of jobs,, It;s the first time I went to work to make a buck and come home owing my boss nearly 2 grand. Our delivery truck was involved in a traffic incident and the asphalt was going bad. Since my place was closer to the truck than the job, I bought the load.(at cost) The boss had the boys pave my driveway with it. ( that part was free)
    See Joe? No free lunch. There was give and take here. I got nearly 6 grand in ” driveway” , and the boss didn’t take it in the shorts, and the trucking Co. didn’t have two big boat anchors of asphalt to throw away. They will have to make up the cost of labor that was lost. Yes,, there will be horse trading going on.

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31. 

    Bill Tozer

    23 January 2015

    Walt, good job. May not have been high on the priority list to get a paved driveway yesterday, but strike while the iron is hot. When opportunity knocks, answer the door.
    I been disguised by all this violence being committed by the younger generation from sea to shining sea on a daily basis. Heck, was watching the Alabama/Auburn basketball game yesterday and a big ole donnybrook fight broke out. 3 players were ejected. Yep, women’s basketball has come a long way, baby. I yearn for the days of civility, like back in the Bennict Arnold days.

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32. 

    Walt

    23 January 2015

    Ya Bill,, my first thought was to pave the main drag from the Co. road, in as far as the stuff would go. ( only four houses in here) Then I realized the ungrateful bastards that I have for neighbors are all tightwads, and getting a dime out of them to help cover the cost was slim to none. ( I have always graded and maintained the communal drive at my expense)
    It was time to be a little selfish. So I said to myself,,” Self,, screw’m”..
    Done with the JoeK way of thinking. Time to let others do the fixing for a while. They have been reaping the benefits of MY work and contributing nothing.
    Wow.. a cat fight on the hard wood.. And I missed it.

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33. 

    Ben Emery

    24 January 2015

    Republicans are embarrassing the USA once again. James Inhofe (Republican) Chair of Environment and Public Works Committee cites the bible AGAIN to prove global warming and climate change aren’t being caused by humans.
    “There’s archeological evidence of that. There’s biblical evidence of that. There’s historic evidence of that.”
    “The hoax is that there are some people who are so arrogant to think that they are so powerful, they can change climate. Man can’t change climate.”
    http://www.motherjones.com/environment/2015/01/inhofe-climate-change-bible
    We are screwed as a nation and I welcome it. The faster we collapse under our own weight the faster we will be on the road to recovery.

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34. 

    George Rebane

    24 January 2015

    BenE 739am – There is a coterie of scientists who have never accepted quantum mechanics (Einstein was among them) and seek alternative explanations (e.g. many worlds). Would you be inclined to join them if a member of Congress stated that quantum mechanics was true and God’s will, since he did not want Man to know anything too exactly in his creation, and a result become sinfully proud of his knowledge?

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35. 

    Todd Juvinall

    24 January 2015

    Ben Emry, you cannot have it both ways. You libs tell us that the Bible is only a historical document and now you are claiming it is “divine”. Inhofe is a clear voice in exposing the hoax you believe in. My goodness, he is a hero to many of us who have exposed this hoax to the light of day and who have been subjected to the hate of you “believers”. (hopefully he will cut off the grants)
    I watched Inhofe for a while the other day and his charts and info was based on science, not “feelings” as you seem to think. So, I am so happy that a man like Inhofe is in charge of exposing the hoax at such a high level in our country. Thank you Oklahoma voters!

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36. 

    fish

    24 January 2015

    Posted by: Ben Emery | 24 January 2015 at 07:39 AM
    We are screwed as a nation and I welcome it. The faster we collapse under our own weight the faster we will be on the road to recovery.
    Finally…..a point of agreement!

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37. 

    George Rebane

    24 January 2015

    fish 916am – I join in the agreement. But alas, the recovery will be delayed, for we all will want to launch our phoenix in a different direction.

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38. 

    Joe Koyote

    24 January 2015

    Fish 11:40 — I would tax the shit out of the wealthy (back to 1950’s levels when America as a whole was doing quite well) and put Americans to work rebuilding the country’s infrastructure, end membership in global corporate schemes like WTO, IMF, NAFTA, CAFTA, TTP and so on, end corporate subsidies and bailouts, end corporate tax breaks that create incentives to move jobs off shore, repeal Citizens United, eliminate the electoral college, limit campaign spending, re-regulate media ownership, stop keystone XL, ban fracking, ban GMOs (patents on food sources is a scary concept especially with Monsanto in charge), reign in the Pentagon, CIA, NSC, etc., recognize that climate change is the most pressing issue in history and do something about it rather than stick our collective heads in the sand, and so on. I could go on, but this should give you all enough fodder to fill these pages with vitriol for the next few days. Have fun getting flustered and angry that those “solutions” you support have never and will never work and over time have made the future look worse not better (vast accumulations of wealth aside, as the current system does very well at that.)
    George: The big point you are is missing is that neither the form of capitalism you so vehemently support nor the socialist experiments of the last century have worked to the benefit the planet and its people as a whole, but rather concentrated wealth and power into a very few hands. Power corrupts whether you are a commie or a CEO and those who seek such power are often psychologically broken people in the first place (Hitler, Stalin, Jamie Dimon, Donald Trump.) It is time to try something else, something different.. perhaps a hybrid of mom and pop capitalism with enough government to prevent the plundering and destruction in the name of constant growth and ever increasing profits that is now prevalent. Otherwise the planet is doomed to return to its feudalistic past where the robber barons run the show and everyone but their minions fight over the scraps. This is not the world I want for my grandchildren, do you?

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39. 

    Walt

    24 January 2015

    Yup,, and Liberal Progressiveism is responsible for said collapse.
    Way to go Lefties….

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40. 

    Russ Steele

    24 January 2015

    Alas, the going in different directions is the very reason that Nevada County does not have an economic recovery plan. All the Nevada County tribes want to take a different path to the future. You can not get there for here, unless you know where here is. Unfortunately, every tribal council has a different path to here, and we will never get there until we have unity on a future path to a clearly defined goal. As George notes, we will have the same problem with the recovery after the collapse, only on a larger scale than just our little community of tribes. If we cannot solve the problem locally, how could we do it on a larger scale?

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41. 

    Russ Steele

    24 January 2015

    Rewrite:
    Alas, the going in different directions is the very reason that Nevada County does not have an economic recovery plan. All the Nevada County tribes want to take a different path to the future. You can not get there from here, unless you know where there is. Unfortunately, every tribal council has a different path to there, and we will never get there until we have unity on a future path to a clearly defined goal. As George notes, we will have the same problem with the recovery after the collapse, only on a larger scale than just our little community of tribes. If we cannot solve the problem locally, how could we do it on a larger scale?

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42. 

    George Rebane

    24 January 2015

    JoeK 944am – Please don’t automatically label disagreement with your ideas as “vitriol” – does your vision for society really enjoy such an exalted place in the Pantheon of Truth?
    From your past entries in these comments, it is very clear that you have not taken the time to study the “form of capitalism that (I) so vehemently support”, so until you do so and then take their specific tenets to task, there is no point in giving you an extended reply. But I do note that you and yours continue using the notion that our form of governance should have some group of elitists with the power to “put Americans to work” rebuilding this or doing the other thing that this group mandates as benefitting a more desirable society.
    From my conservetarian perch that is a dangerous mindset common to autocrats and totalitarians of all hues dating back to the days when the pharaoh ‘put people to work’ building the pyramids. But that seems to be the received wisdom of today’s progressive Left.

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43. 

    Ben Emery

    24 January 2015

    Todd,
    There are few things in life that a person can give a 100% guarantee but claiming the bible as a book of history is one of those incidents. I 100% guarantee that I(lib) have never as an adult thought of, or claimed, the bible is anything other than a book of stories or fables to help humans try to get through the trial and tribulations of life. The bible is four contradictory stories told from men and two of them who did not live in the time of Jesus. Matthew, one of the men who lived in the time frame of Jesus is the gospel that tells us the teachings of taking care of those in need but oddly enough that seems to be the part of the bible you seem to ignore with your politics. Once again I encourage you and all at RR to read “Misquoting Jesus: The Story Behind Who Changed the Bible & Why”. Spoiler alert, in its translations and hand copied bibles(mainly by semi literate slaves) is where the actual meaning of the bible changes. Most were probably by mistake but some for sure were very wealthy individuals making changes in their copies by choice.
    Yes, I have read the bible. As a child attended catechism and have very devout Catholic second parents and family, spent parts of almost every summer of childhood with my second family in Yuba City. I also have Protestant relatives that I am very close with and we regularly talk about faith and religion.
    Misquoting Jesus: The Story Behind Who Changed the Bible & Why
    https://archive.org/stream/Prof.BartEhrman-MisquotingJesus/BartD.Ehrman-MisquotingJesus_djvu.txt
    Here is the bio of the Author
    http://www.bartdehrman.com/biography.htm
    Bart D. Ehrman is the James A. Gray Distinguished Professor at the University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill. He began his teaching career at Rutgers University, and joined the faculty in the Department of Religious Studies at UNC in 1988, where he has served as both the Director of Graduate Studies and the Chair of the Department.
    Professor Ehrman completed his M.Div. and Ph.D. degrees at Princeton Seminary, where his 1985 doctoral dissertation was awarded magna cum laude. An expert on the New Testament and the history of Early Christianity, he has written or edited twenty-nine books, numerous scholarly articles, and dozens of book reviews. In addition to works of scholarship, Professor Ehrman has written several
    textbooks for undergraduate students and trade books for general audiences. Five of his books have been on the New York Times Bestseller list: Misquoting Jesus; God’s Problem; Jesus Interrupted; Forged; and How Jesus Became God. His books have been translated into twenty-seven languages.
    Professor Ehrman has served as President of the Southeast Region of the Society of Biblical literature and chair of the New Testament textual criticism section of the Society. Among his editorial positions, he has served as associate editor for the Journal of Early Christian Studies, book review editor of the Journal of Biblical Literature, and editor of the monograph series The New Testament in the Greek Fathers (Scholars Press). He currently serves as co-editor of the series New Testament Tools, Studies, and Documents (E. J. Brill), co-editor-in-chief for the international journal of early Christian studies, Vigiliae Christianae, and area editor (early Christianity) for the Encyclopedia of Ancient History.
    Professor Ehrman has been the recipient of numerous academic awards, grants, and fellowships, including the UNC Undergraduate Student Teaching Award (1993), the Phillip and Ruth Hettleman Prize for Artistic and Scholarly Achievement (1994), the Bowman and Gordon Gray Award for excellence in teaching (1998-2001), the Pope Spirit of Inquiry Teaching Award (2008), and the Religious Liberty Award from the American Humanist Association (2011).
    Professor Ehrman has featured widely in television, radio, and print media, including The Daily Show with Jon Stewart, The Colbert Report, CNN, Discovery Channel, History Channel, National Geographic, BBC, Fresh Air, Talk of the Nation, The New Yorker, Time Magazine, Newsweek, the New York Times, and the Washington Post. He now lives in Durham NC with his wife Sarah (and dog Billy).

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44. 

    Todd Juvinall

    24 January 2015

    Ben Emery, you have my deepest sympathy for your way of life and thought processes. I feel terrible that I am unable to help such a sorry soul.

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45. 

    George Rebane

    24 January 2015

    BenE 1053am – I take it that pounding on the veracity of the bible is an easier task than returning to the point of your main argument and addressing my 753am.

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46. 

    Ben Emery

    24 January 2015

    Walt,
    The implementation of Trickle Down Economics and Free Trade Agreements are the main sources of the collapse. The problem we have is the leadership of both Democratic and Republican Party’s still believe in both of these ideas. The leadership are the 1% and want to keep it that way without having to pay back into the system that has made them incredibly wealthy.

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47. 

    fish

    24 January 2015

    Posted by: Joe Koyote | 24 January 2015 at 09:44 AM
    No vitriol Joe…..I asked for an answer and you provided it! It was as I expected …..exactly what I thought I would get…..exactly.
    Have fun getting flustered and angry that those “solutions” you support have never and will never work and over time have made the future look worse not better (vast accumulations of wealth aside, as the current system does very well at that.)
    Why would I get flustered or angry…..you stand less chance getting of your Peoples Republic than I do of getting my libertarian Disneyland! Of course if you simply can’t bear to part with the fantasy you can still book a direct flight to Maracaibo….important travel tip……bring lots of tampons…..I hear they’re like gold there.

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48. 

    Walt

    24 January 2015

    Now “Grass Valley” ( emphasis on “Grass”) is getting into the dope reality tv game.
    I got wind of some inside info. My Grand kid is a (um)” friend ” of one of the “cast”?
    Maybe they can get me in on this. Always need a “Villon” And what better than a reformed smoker of the herb?

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49. 

    Russ Steele

    24 January 2015

    Agenda 21 right here in Penn Valley.
    http://sierrafoothillcommentary.com/2015/01/24/penn-valley-confronts-agenda-21-packem-and-stackem/

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50. 

    Walt

    24 January 2015

    Just what we need here Russ, more out of work welfare cases.
    There are NO jobs here, and NO businesses to hire them. So LIBS
    want to import “our fair share” of lower class people. I say, don’t Nevada City, Penn Valley.

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