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January 2015
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George Rebane

LakeviewORTraveling with some friends, we just returned from a visit to Lakeview – at 4,798 feet ‘The Tallest Town in Oregon’.  Lakeview sits at the north end of Goose Lake, a huge drainage basin shared by California and Oregon.  It also advertises itself as the ‘Gateway to the Oregon Outback’ which is the sparsely populated high desert of the state’s eastern region.  The town of about 2,200 has definitely seen better days.  And from talking to the locals, the worst is yet to come.  What happened?

During our stay we had a chance to talk to owners of three businesses.  Each had lived there for at least twenty years, and they told us a story of what happens when a town decides to buy into an imported glory road.  Historically Lakeview grew as the seat of Lake County and the commercial center for ranching and timber enterprises in southern Oregon, in later years adding a dollop of tourism that took advantage of the nearby mountains for camping, skiing, and some awesome hang gliding.

Then in the 1990s came some new folks with slick talk of smart growth, things natural, and sustainability.  They pitched the community on getting some OPM (other people’s money) to develop natural sources of wind, solar, and geothermal energy.  In the future, business and living would be controlled as they are in the big cities.  New zoning laws were passed, and strict business ordinances put in place.  With the help of a couple of big name foundations and government grants things were going to get organized – things were going to become progressive as reflected in the town’s new ‘mission statement’  

The mission of the Town of Lakeview is to provide citizens with a safe, family-oriented community while promoting sustainable development of our human, economic and natural resources. We progressively seek a positive future while honoring our heritage.

Well, things didn’t work out as the central planners had it figured.  The projects were delayed, the monies were late, some stuff had been overlooked, and when it came right down to it, people had other ideas which they now had a hard time implementing because of all the new rules and ordnances and codes and … .  Since they could no longer implement their own plans – i.e. continue the free and self-reliant lifestyle that drew and kept them there – people started leaving Lakeview.  Today the town is eerily empty with boarded up stores and empty commercial buildings, as its population has declined for the last twenty years.

There is a lot more to the story of Lakeview as another place that has suffered from progressive blight, and we’ll add to this piece as relevant data warrants.  But what I want to point out with this report is that such blight has quietly spread pretty much nationwide, most certainly since 2009 when we started getting all those new rules and recovery programs for the Great Recession.  It is charitably clear that no one from Washington has looked at how rural counties have taken the brunt of the ‘new thinking’ that is being imposed bit by piece on our less populated regions.  In Lakeview people know about Agenda21 (they told us so) because they are living it every day.  The real plan for Lakeview is for it to revert to its ‘natural state’ before people arrived.

As reported here for some years, California’s rural counties are destined for the same future as Lake County.  We see it right here in Nevada County which has a lot more to offer residents than Lake County, Oregon.  Of course, California imposes on us its own unique and widely infamous brand of insanity to impede growth, economic development, public use of public and private lands, and on and on.  Our own imported progressives are very active in creating and sustaining an environment in these foothills which stifles any vestige of human activity that is not according to the outlined objectives of Agenda21.

Such strategy notwithstanding, we in Nevada County divert ourselves periodically with workshops and meetings that address the holy grail of economic growth.  And we invite speakers from faraway places to tell us how they were able or are still trying to promote such growth.  What we seem to miss is that these hoped for experts come from places that look nothing like our county and community.  Perhaps we should hold more useful gatherings and hear the experiences of people from places like Lake County.  I bet that each of them have a woulda/coulda/shoulda tale to tell that would really resonate with what we have been going through, and maybe even shine a light on some yet-to-be-discovered dark corners where there be tigers waiting for us.

Posted in , ,

117 responses to “The Sad Tale of Lakeview, OR”

  1. Bill Tozer Avatar
    Bill Tozer

    My belief system is where my nose ends, yours begins. Simple.
    The Control Friscofreaks belief system is government is their nose and grows and gets bigger, wider, higher, longer, and heavier with each passing hour. This burderson juggernaut extends to speech, tolerance/intolerance, what you should eat, what your kids can eat a school, to what kind of oil a movie theater can cook their popcorn in. With the Control Friscofreaks Marxist believe system, the individual with such a belief system naturally becomes a self appointed agent of government’s nose allowing the individual to even tell a local market what kind of gator jerky should be displayed in the market’s window.
    I prefer “where my nose ends, yours begins” to where the Lefties’ nose ends, I can finally get my nose some breathing room.

    Like

  2. Todd Juvinall Avatar
    Todd Juvinall

    George Boarman has a excellent article about “free speech” in the Union today.

    Like

  3. anthony kropotkin Avatar
    anthony kropotkin

    Posted by: Todd Juvinall | 18 January 2015 at 04:51 PM
    Mr. Juvinall could you please respond to the information and link posted above with mapping of clear cut areas of the Sierra Nevada and correct your false claim that clear cutting was ‘banned’ many years ago?
    Many here may not trust the narrative on the site I posted but the mapping tells the story, and you can see with your own eyes see the data by zooming in on the map..check out Nevada, Eldorado, Amador and Calaveras Counties, and check it versus Google Earth.
    Or you could go to the California Board of Forestry and look at current filed Timber Harvest Plans.
    I am not saying that we should not clear cut forests in some specific circumstances, I am just showing the data and correcting the record for those here who are misinformed.

    Like

  4. fish Avatar
    fish

    Posted by: anthony kropotkin | 19 January 2015 at 08:06 AM
    Morning Michael! What’s new?

    Like

  5. Todd Juvinall Avatar

    Clearcutting by fire is a common practice. We in California have lost millions of acres of forest to lousy government management of the lands under their watch. I believe that clearcuts are banned on government properties but on private lands a five acre maximum is allowed (leaving seed trees every so spaced). That is my recollection. So, perhaps I am incorrect in saying they were totally banned. There is and has been for years a concerted effort by the SIerra Club etal to get laws passed to deny Sierra Pacific Industries their rights on their own lands and the management of same.
    So MichaelA, maybe you could add up the acres of burned forests here in our state and compare them to the acres that you say are clearcut. That would be good info for me. Also please send me your links to the actual laws allowing clearcuts so I can be better informed.
    Also, I believe only 30 inch diameter trees at three feet up the trunk are allowed to be cut for lumber. Please verify that law for me as well so if I am incorrect I can be better informed.

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  6. Joe Koyote Avatar
    Joe Koyote

    Carp — someone has to take the high road to point out the low road on which you continuously travel.

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  7. fish Avatar
    fish

    Posted by: Joe Koyote | 19 January 2015 at 09:17 AM
    Well I just thank god that you are here to maintain teh interwebz usual high standards!

    Like

  8. anthony kropotkin Avatar
    anthony kropotkin

    Reply to: Posted by: Todd Juvinall | 19 January 2015 at 08:40 AM
    The current guidelines for timber harvesting in California are linked here:
    http://calfire.ca.gov/resource_mgt/downloads/2014_FP_Rulebook_w_TRA_No.1.pdf
    The primary law regarding timber harvest is the Z’Berg-Nejedly Forest Practice Act which can be found at Division 4, Chapter 8, of the California Public Resources Code
    There is nothing within the code that specifically prohibits a specific forest management practice, including the practice euphemistically know as ‘clearcutting’ which actually has no official or recognized definition. The code requires that certain specifications be met, and if those specifications are met, harvest is allowed, including harvest from large acreage taking the vast majority of trees, or what is know as a clear cut.
    If you want to see the current timber harvest plans on record you can go here:
    http://egis.fire.ca.gov/watershed_mapper/
    If you want a good briefing on the process to approve a timber harvest plan you can go here:
    http://anrcatalog.ucdavis.edu/pdf/8249.pdf
    There is also nothing specifically prohibiting ‘clearcutting’ on federal lands; there are requirements to comply with other federal legislation, such as the Clean Water Act, the Endangered Species Act and the National Environmental Policy Act, all laws passed with an overwhelming bi-partican majority in Congress. If a project on federal lands can comply with those acts, and engage in a ‘clear cut’, then they can be permitted on federal land, and that is a common practice in such of the country.
    Your question regarding the total acres of ‘clear cut’ lands versus the total acres of burned lands is a difficult one to answer, and the most likely answer is that it would take a boatload of money to know.
    First, one has to recognize that time frames are important in a forest. A typical fire interval for some forests may be over 100 years, but others every 10-20 years, depending on soils, forest composition, naturally occurring ignition sources, weather patterns, etc. Some fire is naturally occurring, some fire is made more widespread due to changes is management practices, and some fire is made more intense due to changes in forest management practices. So there are multiple moving factors to track. To know how many acres were lost to fire, and attributable to changes in forest management practices we would need to model the change in fire interval relative to the change in forest management practices. That has been done in some places, but not across the entire Sierra Nevada. Second, until recently compared to the age of a forest we did not require permitting for timber harvest, widespread permitting did not go into effect until the early 1970’s, thus data is all extrapolated from anecdotal knowledge or in some place supported by on the ground surveys. But even though we did not require permitting, we do know that the vast majority of Sierra Nevada forests have been cut at least once since European settlement; the estimated remaining old growth forest in the Sierra Nevada is about 15%
    http://www.fs.fed.us/pnw/pubs/rp516.pdf
    Finally, there is no specific provision that trees below 30 inches dbh cannot be harvested on either private or public lans, There may be specific provision in individual THP’s that limit the number of trees of any specific diameter that can be harvested. The primary reason people do not wish to harvest trees below roughly 24 inches dbh is that the yield of merchantable timber goes up exponentially with dbh–the bigger the tree the more cost effective the harvest–small trees cost more to mill.
    One impediment to timber harvest for fuel load reduction purposes has been limits on the maximum (as opposed to the minimum as you suggest) dh of trees harvested. Recently California passed a law with bi-partisan support signed by Governor Brwn to begin to address this issue.
    http://www.leginfo.ca.gov/pub/13-14/bill/asm/ab_0701-0750/ab_744_cfa_20130919_112441_sen_comm.html
    Hope this begins to put you (and Mr. Steele) on the path to knowing what the heck you are talking about.

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  9. Bill Tozer Avatar
    Bill Tozer

    Want to take the high road? By all means, my good fellow. Simply plan a trip to the Tallest Town in Oregon. Be sure to pack a picnic lunch is cause the restaurants are closed.

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  10. Russ Steele Avatar

    AnthonyK@09:40AM
    You wrote: Hope this begins to put you (and Mr. Steele) on the path to knowing what the heck you are talking about.
    Can you please be more specific as to were I (Mr Steele) went wrong, so we can discuss my failure to understand.
    Thanks

    Like

  11. anthony kropotkin Avatar
    anthony kropotkin

    Mr. Steele: The entire post
    Posted by: Russ Steele | 17 January 2015 at 04:07 PM
    would be a good place to start. It shows a remarkable lack of understanding of federal forest policy, conservation biology, and the basic economic of western forestry.
    A great example would be your separation of the intrusion of barred owls in northern spotted owl habitat from human causes. Barred owls, native to the northeastern United States and previous unknown in the western US, prefer a more open forest canopy for forage. They would not even be able to compete with northern spotted owls if it were not for the fact that forest management practices first open the west to them through fire suppression allowing them to migrate west, then provided them with a preferred habitat type for forage.
    Consequently your statement, “It was not the loggers that caused the decline in the spotted owl, but an unforeseen player, the eastern barred owl.”
    The decline of spotted owl attributed to barred owl intrusion is in and of itself a result of human causes and forest management practices.
    You fail to understand or acknowledge that in the words of John Muir, “When we try to pick out anything by itself, we find it hitched to everything else in the Universe.”
    Basic rule of conservation biology my friend.

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  12. Todd Juvinall Avatar
    Todd Juvinall

    AnthinyK 9:40M
    I went to every one of your links and not one supported your position at all. Not one thing I said was discussed in those links. So, I must conclude you are a ideologue not a forest expert.
    The 30 inch rule refers to a no cut of larger, not smaller diameters. If you want to learn something worthwhile about the timber harvesting rules I would suggest you get a hold of Tim Fellers here in Nevada County. It appears I am correct and you are a bloviator.
    Also, I would suggest you read the TNF’s Management Pln for the Federal Forest here.

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  13. anthony kropotkin Avatar
    anthony kropotkin

    Mr. Juviall:
    You appear to revel in a lack of specificity. Here is what you said, “Also, I believe only 30 inch diameter trees at three feet up the trunk are allowed to be cut for lumber.” Any literate reader would take from that that you meant that only trees above 30 inches dbh would be allowed to be cut. I can’t help it if I am lucky 🙂
    I am glad you went to every link I provided, because they cite the actual law. The fact is that nowhere in those links, or any others that cite the law, can you show me where ‘clear cutting” is disallowed. The fact that the only way to prove a negative is to cite the actual law should not be held against me.
    I can only conclude from your response that not only are you woefully ignorant of the law, you only choose to acknowledge information that support your beliefs.
    FYI, I know many people at SPI, have actually read the TNF Plan, and follow forest management law pretty closely.

    Like

  14. Todd Juvinall Avatar

    AK,
    If you read all those links and plans then you would be agreeing with me. You seem to have a problem with comprehension. Last;ly, your name is a phony name so that means your are dishonest to begin with. Tell us all who you really are and prove it. Otherwise, all that I have said seems to be the truth and what you are saying is not.

    Like

  15. anthony kropotkin Avatar
    anthony kropotkin

    Au contraire Mr. Juvinall, rumors of your idiocy seem to be confirmed by your inability to make a clear point.
    Please show me where in California law clearcutting is prohibited? You can not.

    Like

  16. Joe Koyote Avatar
    Joe Koyote

    ” We’ve evolved a system, largely with government help, that has made it difficult to begin and grow small businesses.” — Yes, but.. is this government being bad, or large corporations running small businesses out of business with the help (i.e.. NAFTA, CAFTA, WTO, etc etc) of their purchased legislators? Government is not inherently good or bad, as it is just a collection of paperwork (rules, regulations, treaties, etc). Government doesn’t write laws or sign trade agreements, people do. I think if the general focus changes from “gov’t is bad” to “people are bad” the whole discussion changes. After all, guns don’t kill people, people do, right?

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  17. Todd Juvinall Avatar
    Todd Juvinall

    AK, you libs always lie and start the namecalling when defeated. You have been taken to the woodshed by my superior intellect information. You need to tell us who you are and gibve us those contacts you say you have in SPI. Oh, you won’t? OK. Seems you are simply a liar.
    If not, show me in your links the proof of your allegations. Oh, you won’t? What a hoot!

    Like

  18. drivebyposter Avatar
    drivebyposter

    “is this government being bad, or large corporations running small businesses out of business with the help (i.e.. NAFTA, CAFTA, WTO, etc etc) of their purchased legislators?”
    Yes.
    There’s so many players in the game, I certainly couldn’t point out any single guiding hand. Obviously, there’s a tendency towards oligopoly whenever it’s possible. Whether you are a labor union or Walmart (or a government department for that matter), it’s probably in your interest to restrict a market. A monopsony will do if you can’t build a monopoly.
    A basic flaw that I see in the US political Left is that their vision of equalizing the playing field is to allow large players to collect all the money, confiscate some of it, and then pass it out to groups currently in favor. Even if the political ruling class isn’t especially kleptocratic, they’ll still pool power when possible. There’s a feedback loop of regulation that better ensures that money flows through fewer players.
    A better model might be to analyze why money is accumulating and to understand why the market is broken in that area. Naturally, there are areas that tend towards monopoly due to economies of scale (or political power), but an antitrust suit might be a better remedy than the vigorish the Democrats naturally tend towards.

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  19. fish Avatar
    fish

    Posted by: Joe Koyote | 19 January 2015 at 11:12 AM
    An interesting perspective. According to your logic then corporations can’t be bad either only the people within them….much like government. Sounds like life would be paradise if only we could just get rid of certain people! Wreckers, hoarders and the like!
    Bad people!

    Like

  20. George Rebane Avatar

    JoeK 1112am – A good but incomplete point Joe. Governments inherently are large organizations which employ people in complex bureaucracies where more often than not individuals’ performance is totally decoupled from its delivered societal benefit. This inevitably causes bad behaviors (e.g. corruption) and harmful results to its citizens since critical feedback paths are weak or totally missing. Add to that the unfettered ability of governments to grow (since they have a monopoly on use of deadly force) and we get the inevitable cycles of authoritarians and revolutions. In short, governments historically bring out the worst in its workers, and more so to the extent that these workers are of low quality to begin with (i.e. government being the employer of last resort).
    Large corporations have similar organizational and performance problems, that is why they sidle up to governments and pay to get favored treatment and the protection of the government gun. Without that, such corporations are pruned by natural market forces. It takes ample doses of government/corporate corruption to keep such a system going. And yes, it is the people involved in such organizational structures that do the dirty work.
    The only reasonable solution is to limit the size and ability of such organizational structures to grow. For governments, it is through hewing to a well written constitution that intrinsically limits the size and scope of government. For corporations, it is through exposing them to real market forces without government coddling (e.g. subsidies, favorable tariffs, etc).
    Both nature and people work best when knowledge and control is distributed and not centralized.

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  21. anthony kropotkin Avatar
    anthony kropotkin

    Posted by: Todd Juvinall | 19 January 2015 at 10:11 AM
    “It appears I am correct and you are a bloviator.”
    Funny, it appears you are the one who started the name calling Mr. Juvinall.
    I wonder how all the posters here feel about the fact that fail to be capable of supporting your statements when they are challenged? Do your friends here know you are a fool? Do they cringe when you speak knowing that you actually harm their case? Do they suffer your ignorance lightly or do they quietly wish you would just be silent when so clearly proved wrong?
    I state again, you show me in California or Federal law a citation that says that ‘clear cutting’ is banned. You cannot because it is not.
    You are a fool Mr. Juvinall.

    Like

  22. Russ Steele Avatar

    Jeff@05:17PM
    If you think that Nevada County should becoming more like San Francisco and Lake Tahoe, why do you think the ERC invited representatives from Bend Oregon, Asheville North Carolina, Austin Texas and Boulder Colorado to tell us how they created jobs? That seems to indicate the ERC would like Nevada County to be more like one of these communities, not San Francisco or Lake Tahoe. One, very big difference is that all of these communities invited by the ERC have a four-year college or university. These colleges bring a large diverse number of young people in too a community. We do not have that opportunity in western Nevada County.
    Nevada County would be more like Lakeview if Charles Litton Sr. had not moved his Engineering Laboratory to an unfinished hospital at the top of Litton Hill. His invitation to Dr. Hare was key to the development of an applied technology business cluster in the western county. Before Litton arrived, there were shuttered shops and empty stores in Grass Valley and Nevada City. He launched his own personal initiatives to stimulate the timber industry that was collapsing by repurpose the output from raw lumber to more finished furniture products.
    Where would Nevada City and Grass Valley be today without the millions of private investment by entrepreneurs who left Grass Valley Group, plus other entrepreneurs attracted to the unintended incubator on Litton Hill? All of these entrepreneurs spurred the development of a robust applied technology cluster. A cluster that is in decline. Where will Nevada County be when the decline is complete and the last of the tech cluster has vanished, no longer contributing to the local economy? If current trend continue, it will be sooner rather then later.
    As our tech cluster continues to decline, we will become more like Lake County and Lakeview, highly dependent on government employment to sustain the local economy. By percentage, government employment in Nevada County is currently at 17%, the highest contributor percentage wise to the local economy. In Lake County it is 48%. Unless the ERC is highly successful in attracting more business to move to the community, we will soon become more dependent on the government payroll.

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  23. drivebyposter Avatar
    drivebyposter

    “Where will Nevada County be when the decline is complete and the last of the tech cluster has vanished”
    Now that is a good question.

    Like

  24. Walt Avatar

    Ahhhh… The promised “high tech”. Remember when IMM was trying to bring good jobs to town?
    The anti mining gang claimed that if IMM was run out of town tech companies from points South would flock here.. “for the beauty”. More have left than ever showed up to even look.
    Now we have neither. Then we hear an illegal drug ( nope this isn’t Denver) is supposedly keeping the County afloat. ( underground economy?) Wow… What a distinction.
    Then there is the “want”to become a retirement community. Big bucks oldsters who have money. Well they didn’t get rich by spending it in tourist trap shops, and once here are not going to start.
    Tourism? Yaaa…The Northern Queen Motel is supplementing by renting out to those on the county dole.

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  25. Todd Juvinall Avatar
    Todd Juvinall

    anthony kropotkin | 19 January 2015 at 03:23 PM
    My goodness, your certainly are a name caller aren’t you? Well, it appears you cannot back up yur claims on the clearcutting (or even age management) so you resort like all liar liberals do to namecalling. Bedises your name is a fake so therefore you have no credibility. Go read the manuals and laws and get back to me. I am obviously smarter than you could ever be about forestry.

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  26. Barry Pruett Avatar
    Barry Pruett

    FYI. Kropotkin is the surname of the late 19th century Russian philosopher who founded anarchistis communism. Intersting tidbit that has dubious relevance.

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  27. Todd Juvinall Avatar
    Todd Juvinall

    It is relevant Barry. It says a lot about this nut on here.

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  28. Joe Koyote Avatar
    Joe Koyote

    George 11:31
    Is it the “use of deadly force” that causes/allows governments to grow or does government grow in direct proportion to corporate growth and wealth concentration which rely on government for success? It seems that the rise in big corporations also coincided with a rise in big government.
    “bad behaviors (e.g. corruption) and harmful results
    governments historically bring out the worst in its workers–”
    I agree, especially with regard to the military and spy apparatus. Any number of procurement scandals, bribes, cost overruns, $200 toilets, and questionable invasions of sovereign nations, supports this notion. Beyond corporations, where loyalty is more often rewarded than integrity (not unlike the military), I would have to add virtually any large organization to the list along with government including unions for the same reason, NGOs, and the media conglomerates, just to name a few.
    “government being the employer of last resort.” A myth designed to denigrate public servants in the propaganda campaign of global conglomerates to convince the public to privatize everything. I think Walmart, McDonalds, and the like are the real employers of last resort. Many government jobs at least require a BA. To the counter that fast food and similar low end jobs are “entry level” belies the fact that many of these “entry level jobs” are permanent, especially for single women who are heads of households.
    How do we limit the size of organizational structures at this juncture in history when the legislative, the military, and the judicial branches of government are in the pockets of the multinationals? I think it will take a coalition of right and left and everyone in between to drop their petty differences (manipulated by the same gov’t/corp complex to keep people divided on ideological rather than practical logic) and stand up. I think it starts with Citizens United. If that is not repealed we will never loosen the stranglehold the owners of the multinationals have on our country and large portions of the globe. By the end of 2016 it is projected that 1% of the global population will possess 50% of the world’s wealth.

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  29. Jeff Pelline Avatar
    Jeff Pelline

    Russ,
    You wrote: “If you think that Nevada County should become more like San Francisco and Lake Tahoe, why do you think the ERC invited representatives from Bend Oregon, Asheville North Carolina, Austin Texas and Boulder Colorado to tell us how they created jobs?”
    Huh? Bend Oregon, Asheville NC, Austin Texas and Boulder are ALL more like San Francisco and Lake Tahoe than western Nevada County is. That’s why they were invited. We could use a hotel like the Oxford in Bend, Ore., http://www.oxfordhotelbend.com or the new Sierra Nevada brewery near Asheville or the mall in Boulder. That’s why they were invited. And all of these things are more common in San Francisco and Lake Tahoe than here. Having said that, western Nevada County will never become like Lakeview Ore., because it is midway between Sacramento and Lake Tahoe. Though some people in our community would like to build a moat around us, it is too late.

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  30. George Rebane Avatar

    JeffP 715pm – I think you misunderstood Russ’ point. You seem to be implying that having some hidden and transferrable attribute (‘SF values’) of San Francisco beyond its geography will promote economic success. That’s a remarkable claim that we would all like to see you defend. Nevada County has no demographics to support the hotels, malls, etc of the bigger cities with which you are so taken, and it most certainly does not have a growth-friendly business environment that would invite the investment needed to migrate in the direction of the communities from which we will hear. Our maintenance of the quality of life that we enjoy in this off-the-beaten-path community will have to take a more creative different and different path.
    JoeK 708pm – Government growth in direct proportion to corporate growth and wealth creation? Well yes, but that is only one way in which powerful bureaucracies grow. The big governments of, say, the USSR, China, East Germany, … all grew without the aid of corporate growth, but, as Mao taught, simply from the power that grew out of the barrel of a gun.
    I can tell you from experience – my own and peer hiring managers – workers exiting government to seek equivalent positions in the private sector are at a great disadvantage when it comes to relevant education, experience, people skills, initiative, and just having an overall attitude for getting something productive accomplished. The lack of having to work for productive ends in a feedback intensive environment takes its toll. The reputation of government workers is definitely not a fomented myth, but well earned in almost every department as they interact with the (tax paying) public. You apparently have not dealt with the DMV, Postal Service, IRS, planning departments, CARB, EPA, … .

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  31. Walt Avatar

    Another S.F. value where people are concerned… “pack’m and stack’m.”

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  32. Todd Juvinall Avatar
    Todd Juvinall

    I think he means (Pelline) a “sanctuary city” where an illegal immigrant can murder with out fear of arrest. That would be a value he can get his head around.

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  33. Todd Juvinall Avatar
    Todd Juvinall

    Here is the Reuters poll Paul Emery that shows Obama at 37% approval. I’ll take this one. LOL
    http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/latest_polls/

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  34. Jeff Pelline Avatar
    Jeff Pelline

    George,
    The claim is really simple: Bend Oregon, Asheville NC, Austin Texas and Boulder all support “purple” politics. It is a key to success economically because “most of us are in the middle” politically. Most of us are not political ideologues and extremists. It’s why we are a center-left state. Those are our community’s “customers.” The sooner our community figures that out the more it will prosper.

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  35. Barry Pruett Avatar
    Barry Pruett

    LOL. Only a true believer in the extreme leftist ideology would refer to California as “center-left.” That is the funny statement that I have ever read on a blog…besides the Scooper of course.

    Like

  36. Russ Steele Avatar

    Jeff@09:12Pm
    I will be willing to bet the ERC does not give a damn what the party affiliation of the owner of a company is, as long as the company is willing to bring jobs to the county. Nor, do I think that a company seeking a pool of trained labor in the county would be interested in how that labor force was registered democrat, republican or independent. Companies are interested more in the talent pool than the politics of the pool.

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  37. Jeff Pelline Avatar
    Jeff Pelline

    California has elected people such as Pete Wilson, George Deukmejian and Ronald Reagan to office, along with Jerry Brown. Nixon was elected President from California. Only a true believer in the extreme hard right ideology would think California was anything but “center left.” The Scooper should do a parody on this mindset, but it’s too irrelevant to be newsworthy.
    Companies are interested in talent pools but they also are interested in communities where people who are not like minded work together rather than throw rocks at each other. Examples include Bend, Asheville, Austin, Boulder — and Truckee. Otherwise, it isn’t very productive or efficient. Western Nevada County has a reputation in the rest of the state for being “redneckish.” That’s a hard label to shake. A real sign of collaboration was the “Save the Yuba River’ campaign, which showed real bipartisan support, but there is a certain segment of the community who want things to go their way or no way.
    We’re about a generation away from being perceived as a community that wants to work with the rest of the state rather than thumb its nose at it.

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  38. drivebyposter Avatar
    drivebyposter

    RussSteele@9:42
    You would be absolutely, positively correct. Your ‘bet’ is reality.
    You can argue that ‘politics’ (mostly conflicting cultures I think) has a mild leading influence on the available talent pool, but it’s mostly manifested in an interest in local amenities.
    A quick opinion. If we are a talking technically skilled people, few people will move without a job in the pocket and fewer still will start a money making venture. Candidates care about the presence of other jobs (in case the new one disappears for whatever reason), house prices, school quality if they have children (less than you might think, though), and generally how shabby and ‘safe’ the area appears.
    For the middle-aged and up, I strongly suspect that ‘safe’ is a codeword for lack of ethnic diversity.
    At this point, I’d say that it’s nearly impossible to grow a tech company beyond a few tens of engineers in this area. There simply isn’t the critical mass, plus most of the growth is in particular skillsets that are lacking here.

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  39. Barry Pruett Avatar
    Barry Pruett

    Nixon was elected president!? That was 40 years ago. Let’s live in the present which features a California that is the extremist liberal guidestar, not the past when California was “normal.” Texas is “redneckish” and people and jobs are moving there in droves FROM CALIFORNIA! I have been trying to ignore your shear stupidity, but sometimes you say some of the dumbest things.

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  40. Jeff Pelline Avatar
    Jeff Pelline

    Barry,
    I know you struggle mightily with this, but western Nevada County is still part of the Great State of California, not Texas, Indiana or Kentucky. It has to learn to get along. Even in our community,, electeds such as Brian Dahle are working across the aisle — and being re-elected by wide margins. Our GOP supervisors and groups such as the RCRC are inviting Jerry Brown to their meetings and learning from each other. Our Western County doesn’t have the deep pockets of the Texas Enterprise Fund to attract jobs, so it has to play “nice” with all of its constituents and “customers” in California, not just the like-minded ones.
    Your insulting tone only reflects on your continued need for “anger management” training. Take a drive to Big Sur for a breath of fresh air! Grab lunch at Nepenthe Restaurant but watch out for the hippies! LOL.

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  41. Barry Pruett Avatar
    Barry Pruett

    Arguing with uou is like trying to catch a fly with chopsticks. You keep moving around and never responding with a direct answer. Face it Jeff…your comment was plain dumb. “Folks will move jobs to Nevada County if the citizens were more liberal!” “California is center left!” Hall of Fame of Dumb. Have a good day at the computer…I have to go to work creating jobs for our community.

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  42. Jeff Pelline Avatar
    Jeff Pelline

    Barry,
    I am not “arguing with you,” you are arguing with me. Therein lies the problem each and every time. And I’d really encourage you to work on that anger issue. It’s unbecoming of an “economic engine” like yourself. ROFLOL.

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  43. Todd Juvinall Avatar

    Barry, congrats on the new office! Nice to see some of the empty store front occupied. I am sure Pelline’s bedroom office is neat and tidy but soes nothing for the local economy. So keep up the good work for the county Barry.
    Regarding “anger management”. I have never seen Barry angry. But I have seen liberals like Pelline get their panties in a wad when he beats them in the arena of debate and ideas. Pelline is experiencing that constant defeat at the hands of us “good ol’ boys” and he is just lashing out. What a hoot. Now off to create some jobs.

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  44. Jeff Pelline Avatar
    Jeff Pelline

    Todd,
    Well, I am glad to see the “Taj” offices over on Sierra College Dr. get filled up with lawyer service jobs. That’s real economic windfall for our community — well, at least for the building’s owner.

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  45. fish Avatar
    fish

    Posted by: Barry Pruett | 20 January 2015 at 07:45 AM
    Arguing with you is like trying to catch a fly with chopsticks. You keep moving around and never responding with a direct answer.
    Hey Barry as long as you’re chatting with him see if you can get him to define his “San Francisco Values”. That always makes him buzz in circles!
    ……and as always LOL!

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  46. Barry Pruett Avatar
    Barry Pruett

    Thank you Todd. We just expanded into a nearly 3000 sq ft facility on E. Main across from “the Dump.” We are having a grand opening in mid to late February. Thank you for your kind words.

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  47. Walt Avatar

    Oh Ya… Ca. has it’s act together where elections are concerned.. Brown??,,, Twice???? REALLY???? CA. is a welfare state. Even government is on welfare. From the FEDS.
    And what do LIBS push more of? taxes and spending. Seems that’s whats got us into trouble to start with. The “redistribution of wealth” is work’n SO well..

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  48. Jeff Pelline Avatar
    Jeff Pelline

    Good to hear: Olympia Business Park is a better price point for a law practice such as Barry’s.

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  49. Barry Pruett Avatar
    Barry Pruett

    It was more the shear size. We are too big to fit in a smaller place and needed room to grow. Further, Phil Ruble is a good guy and was very helpful. Not bad being across from “the Dump” either, as everyone in town knows where “the Dump” is and our staff loves the location.
    But to get back on topic, California is now on the fringes of the American political spectrum. For instance, Jerry Brown will never be considered a serious presidential candidate while governors from Texas and Indiana will be. These states are creating jobs. These states are taking jobs from other progressive extremist states. We do not live in a vacuum and job creators take the path of least resistance. Maybe…just maybe Jeff…California should do some soul searching and accept more of a Texas or Indiana model. As both ancient and recent history shows, the path to prosperity is certainly not paved with progressive extremist ideology as you apparently dream it would be.

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