Marijuana Ordinance Utility/Criteria

September 2014
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Marijuana Ordinance Utility/Criteria

11 September 2014

George Rebane

In the comment stream to ‘Medical Marijuana Cultivation Initiative’ I suggested that a better marijuana ordinance for Nevada County should be developed through a more systematic process starting with laying out what are the criteria that the provisions of such an ordinance should satisfy. A collection of such criteria are also known as a ‘utility function’ against which candidate ordinances or their several provisions can be evaluated. To be clear, in a reasonable development process such a utility function or set of criteria are agreed upon by the parties that will draft the ordinance BEFORE they start writing the individual provisions.

In the figure below I illustrate an example of such criteria for a marijuana ordinance (as I promised to do in the referenced comment stream). Readers may now comment on the adequacy of what I have offered and/or suggest modifications to it. I will do my best to incorporate all such reasonable changes, and then we can see what kind of consensus can be had at this level of developing a better ordinance. All should understand that if we can’t agree on what a good ordinance looks like, then we have no hope of agreeing on ANY fully fleshed out ordinance, and it’s back to politics as usual. Going through this procedure should be illuminating (even in its rejection).

Posted in Critical Thinking & Numeracy, Current Affairs, Nevada County

203 responses to “Marijuana Ordinance Utility/Criteria”

George Rebane

13 September 2014

MichaelK 734pm – Many thanks Michael; they are corrected.

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George Rebane

13 September 2014

PaulE 1103pm – Actually, we don’t have to know anything about current ordinances to develop a consensus on the criteria for evaluating/generating a new ordinance. In short, we don’t have to start from “common ground” in such an exercise.
However, if you wish to start understanding 2349, then go to Jo Ann Rebane’s piece with the comparative spreadsheet. In that post you will also find links to the full texts of 2349 and Measure S.

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Walt

13 September 2014

Watch out for the new variety of MJ to hit the market soon. ” Dog Bar Red”.
The wild red and green will be hard to miss. That fire retardant doesn’t wash off.
That should give you a real blast.

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Richard Wynn

13 September 2014

I find Mr. Donald J Bessee’s comments a bit “interesting”…… LOL!!!
Especially when you consider the following facts (there is court documentation to support the statements below…..).
1. Mr Donald J Bessee has been convicted and spent time in jail and was on probation for 1 year for leaving 30 – @ 30 minute long inappropriate (purportedly the been pornographic in nature) messages on someones phone.
2. Mr. Donald J Bessee was discharged from the Military (DD214) on a mental discharge from the Navy.
3. Mr. Donald J Bessee claims to have been a International Banker, when in fact statements from family members show that he worked at Household Finance cashing checks for 2 weeks (and he was fired).
4. Mr. Donald J Bessee moved into the home of a woman who was on mental discharge from PG&E, put himself on title of her Alta Sierra home (that she owned free and clear) and then proceeded to do a cash-out refinance to pay his back State and Federal income taxes in the purported amount of $195,000. This woman still owes @$200,000 in back child support, which went to pay Mr Donald J Bessee’s taxes leins.
5. Mr. Donald J Bessee was censured by the Nevada County Court for fabrication photographic evidence, and purportedly held in contempt by Nevada County Superior Court.
6. Mr. Donald J Bessee was involved with legal action that occurred when he purportedly put a running hose into the kitchen window of his Alta Sierra next door neighbor. This was because the woman would not turn off her fountain at night.
7. Mr. Donald j Bessee has had numerous complaints as he has video cameras placed at the Elementary School bus stop across from his residence.
8. Mr. Donald J Bessee has had neighbor complaining as they purported stated that he stops and pucks up “roadkill,” or he shoots small animals from the neighboring properties and then puts these into mailboxes around the neighborhood.
9. Mr. Donald J Bessee has had numerous restraining orders put on him be businesses in the Alta Sierra area.
10. Mr. Donald J Bessee purportedly had more than 8 eviction notices (in 10 years) before he was able to secure his current living space.
11. Mr. Donald J Bessee has fabricated numerous documents regarding the killing of his wife’s pet cat, blaming it on her ex-husband.
The list goes on and on and on…..

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George Rebane

14 September 2014

RichardW 1138pm – And how does this relate to Measure S?

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Richard Wynn

14 September 2014

It talks about the leadership of this ordinance, and people that supported it and FABRICATED the necessary information to make this a issue for the BOS…..

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Richard Wynn

14 September 2014

I am talking about the current MMJ ordinance 2349, and it’s sad that Mr. Bessee is too blind to see the FACT that Measure S will make 97% of Alta Sierra, 98% of LWW, and 98% of LOP ineligible to grow outside, but it does allow for sufficient space to provide patients with the space the require.

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Richard Wynn

14 September 2014

required to grow inside

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Michael Anderson

14 September 2014

Nice little blog ya got here, George. Will you let Richard Wynn’s charges against Don Bessee reside on your blog unchallenged? Oh right, First Amendment and all that. I guess this is how they do things in Estonia.

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Bill Tozer

14 September 2014

Meanwhile, the real news about dangerous drugs is coming out of Virginia:
“Fifth-grade girl fights ChapStick ban before Virginia county school board” the headline reads. ChapStick banned cause some people might be allergic to it. The 11 year old girl sent each board member a nice letter with a tube of ChapStick included. That is how you change peoples’ minds, hint, hint.
The spokesman for ChapStick said folks have been using ChapStick safely for over 100 years. The School Board has yet to render a decision.

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Laura Rose McLeod

14 September 2014

Finally the truth is revealed! How can we believe someone like Don Bessee and his rants! Thank you Richard Wynn for putting this information out there. The Sheriff and his Posse need to clean up in their own backyard!!

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Bill Tozer

14 September 2014

Mr. Walt. Just change the name from Dog Bar Red to Panama Red and we have ourselves a winner. Like changing the name of cottonwood to seasoned firewood. Let the buyer beware.

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Todd Juvinall

14 September 2014

I think Don Bessee is being attacked by the POTTERS becasue he is actually not a smoker/toker and remembers the real information correctly. When someone is attacked as some of these posters here are doing, it always indicates to me that the person being attacked is right.

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Walt

14 September 2014

He who tries to pry open the door to someone else’s skeleton closet, has a much bigger one of their own.
As the good book says,, ” He who is without sin, cast the first stone.”
Be carful RW,, someone may publish your dirty laundry.
Just how did you obtain private military records? ( DD214) That’s far from public info.

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Todd Juvinall

14 September 2014

Googling Richard Wynn, this is one that came up. Looking at his attack and list regarding Don Bessee, I would say it has to be a person who did depositions? Perhaps for a ex?
http://www.wynnlawgroup.com/index.html

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Walt

14 September 2014

The ” S.F.” attitude is shining through. ” I want to “do my thing ( grow dope) and screw the guy next door. Tough sh** if he doesn’t like the smell.( or the riffraff that goes with dopers)

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George Rebane

14 September 2014

re MichaelA 111am – Just discovered another one of Mr Anderson’s signature comments in the spam folder. Enjoy.

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Bill Tozer

14 September 2014

Such evil hate speech this fine morning. And all this time I thought marihuana made people mellow. Making it easy to tell who is smoking their non-addictive herb on a daily basis for the last 10 years, who hasn’t had their non addictive daily medicine today, who is in fear that their well will run dry, and who needs a big fat MX missile hooter.
Walt, got an idea for you to kick around. Your daddy might remember when Ponderosa pine had no commerical value. Then they changed the name of our yellow pine to Monterrey Pine and it began to sell. Nobody wants yellow pine, but now they want Monterrey/Ponderosa pine.
Knew a guy who bought some land with an old mine on it in Placer County. His idea was to crush up the tailings pile with a rock crusher and sell gravel. The county stepped in and forbad him cause there were common lizards running around on the tailings and it was a declared a animal habitat. The guy argued in vain that the lizards were there solely because man created this unnatural animal habitat.
So, if you start digging for gold and the county approaches with their panties all tied in a knot, just tell them you are creating an animal habitat. Who could ever be opposed to that? Plus it will make you a good guy. Remember to wear khaki pants, a floppy gardeners hat, add more grey to your beard and you will be in like flint with the green crowd. Heck you can call it a green job.
Oh, better tie this into Measure A-Z. Just change the name of marihuana to medicine and you be part of the in crowd. Start singing one toke over the line and you be grooving down happy funny farm road. Just an idea.

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fish

14 September 2014

Posted by: George Rebane | 14 September 2014 at 08:57 AM
I hope it’s one of his proletarian hangover specials….those are fabulous!

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Walt

14 September 2014

Speaking of LWW,, This pretty much sums up the effects for those who have never partaked. ( Not quite,,, but it’s close)….Enjoy…
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YyQi-1Z2tN8

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fish

14 September 2014

Ah…not as thunderous as I’ve come to expect from Michael!
Still…he has flashed the ~~Bat~~….err…Great Moderator Signal!
http://www.simpsoncrazy.com/news/simpsons-season-12-dvd-cover-revealed
Let’s watch him “spring” into action!

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Walt

14 September 2014

Comic book guy reminds me of someone… Just who could that be??
The resemblance is striking….

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fish

14 September 2014

OT again but since government revenues have figured into this discussion not wholly inappropriate!
This is why we can never ever afford to cut spending…..high quality science…..first the study of obese lesbians…..now drunken monkeys!
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2014/sep/11/golden-hammer-feds-spends-millions-to-study-drunke/

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RL Crabb

14 September 2014

Walt 9:59AM – Comic Book Guy was modeled after a real person, a now-deceased guy named Rory Root who was a regular at the San Diego Con for years.

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Walt

14 September 2014

Vary TRUE RL.. Just like all the Simpson characters. ( Have ALWAYS enjoyed the show.)
Had one boob tube tuned into the ” Every Simpsons ever” to pick up the ones I may have missed.
Heck. There is some computer program to ” Simpson” your own picture. ( haven’t done it yet.)

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fish

14 September 2014

Posted by: RL Crabb | 14 September 2014 at 10:20 AM
I love stuff like that!
I always figured CBG was a composite of every guy running a comic book store that Simpsons writers had bumped into over the years!
No idea it was a single inspirational figure!

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Bill Tozer

14 September 2014

Love the Simpsons. Bart, Marge, Homer, Jessica, and OJ. Especially liked the cover of Cracked Magazine’s pic of OJ with an elongated forehead donning Marge ‘s blue hair. Caption below said “OJ Simpson”. Short and sweet.
Fish, nothing wrong with obese lesbians….unless you are a lesbian on the rebound.

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Don Nelson

14 September 2014

Hi:
I am a conservative in the old-school sense where liberty is paramount. I am not a board-room style corporate Republican seeking to gut the middle class by putting profit ahead of everything.
There was a time when Republican’s had class. A minority still do. But, with the advent of the “Drug War” a new breed of “Conservative” has emerged.
This new breed likes to arrange it so that the security apparatus of the state (and the county) is permitted to intervene in the “culture war” by invading personal freedom.
What I can’t understand is how my party has embraced the security apparatus to prosecute a culture war under the guise of a “drug war.” Other states have done so at one time or another leading (in the extreme) to Soviet Russia or Nazi Germany.
The Tea Party is supposed to be hip to this slippery slope and chime in to prevent just this sort of abuse by the State (see Sherriff Mack and Tom Mclintock).
The biggest question I have is why the local Tea Party leadership has been mute and not even allowed “Yes on S” to make a case in front of their supposedly open-minded membership?
To me, it appears that Tea Party leadership in this county is merely a shill for the Republican social conservatives. They talk-the-talk of being against the nanny state…but when it comes time to actually be relevant in a pressing local issue…the Tea Party leadership muzzles an open debate in front of their membership.
Fortunately, it is only the local Tea Party that is behaving this way for purely local political reasons.
Message to the Tea Party: The Bill of Rights is not a Chinese take out menu. You cannot choose one from this list and one from that list. The Bill of Rights is absolute.
Again, I am very disappointed with the what is left of the local Tea Party but I do see why their membership is slowly drifting away.
Best,
Don Nelson

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fish

14 September 2014

Fish, nothing wrong with obese lesbians….unless you are a lesbian on the rebound.
Indeed…and I’ve known a couple….all in aviation for some strange reason? Still don’t know why we are studying them or the drinking habits of monkeys.
Posted by: Don Nelson | 14 September 2014 at 10:42 AM
Keep it up Don…….!

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Paul Emery

14 September 2014

Don
The silence of the Tea Party is indeed intriguing in this matter since the current Ordinance allows the police to enter and search your property without even a verifiable complaint. Being a “code” inspection they do not need any evidence a crime is being committed only the possibility of a code violation from a complaint that doesn’t even have to be verified.

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Bill Tozer

14 September 2014

Mr. Fish. Perhaps to save money and advance research in a more responsible manner, they should combine the two high priority projects and study drunk obese lesbian monkeys or monkeys drinking drunken obese lesbians or obese lesbians drinking monkeys. These projects is what used to be called white collar welfare, or also known as “to the victor goes the spoils”.
OT will make the little woman happy. Keep up the good work.
To stay on topic, we need to study drunken monkeys smoking pot with obese lesbians. Lez be friends…..until one of them sobers up. Which one will be first to sober up and cry aloud “I will never drink tequila again.”

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Walt

14 September 2014

Nice stretch Don, The TP is for LIMITED gov. Not full blown ” I will do what I feel like and if you don’t like it tough sh**”.
Yes, I believe in “live and let live” but few abide by that.
You want to do drugs? well have at it, just as long as it doesn’t affect me. Don’t make me pay for your actions. Don’t show up at the ER and have the taxpayers foot the bill for your overdose. Don’t take tax money because you can’t hold a job because of your drug usage.
Want to grow dope? then keep the smell on your side of the fence.
Your “right” shouldn’t be my nuisance. I have “rights” too.

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fish

14 September 2014

Posted by: Bill Tozer | 14 September 2014 at 11:16 AM
A little ambitious from a controlled experiment standpoint William! Too many variables.

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Walt

14 September 2014

How about smokers of Cig.s Don? we have been chased off the streets and huddle in little “leper colonies” far from those that dislike us. And WE pay taxes on what we smoke. We have been chased out of every bar and restaurant, and even the town streets. Every law written to “benefit others” imposes and curtails someone else’s rights.

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George Rebane

14 September 2014

Re the silence of the NC Tea Party. As a member of that group I agree that the NCTP should have weighed in on the civil liberties aspects of 2349 and S. Their silence does not speak well of either their attentiveness to such local issues or their lack of position on the issue. This should be right up NCTP’s alley since it does not involve partisan politics or candidates, but does involve principles and practice of local governance.
I am no longer involved with the leadership of the NCTP, and don’t personally know the people so involved. However, I did call a friend who was recently a NCTP leader and urged him to communicate to their current leadership their unfortunate absence from this discussion.

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Walt

14 September 2014

just to show I’m not all bad,, here is a big “bong hit” for the “pro” side.
http://kdvr.com/2014/09/13/auditions-begin-for-marijuana-based-reality-show/
( OOppsss. just off the scanner. someone is getting a talking too about growing too close to a school. ( 1000 ft.) )

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Bill Tozer

14 September 2014

Geez Walt, we already had little Chucky B do the Gong Show, now we will have The Bong Show. No gonging people off the stage, no saying “you’re fired knucklehead.” Why deprive the viewer of all the enjoyment of watching someone make a complete fool of themselves or getting axed on National TV? No villains?, no primidonnas, no meanies, no public pain and humiliation? Why bother. No wonder they sticking it on the web. Heck, the viewers probably won’t even notice the internet is down while watching the show. Perhaps Doritos will be the major sponsor.

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Walt

14 September 2014

Damn Bill,, Give them a call and forward those ideas. This keeps getting better and better. ” Driving while stoned”. ( on a closed course with PLENTY of orange barrels
to keep car replacement down.)
Don’t forget the tried and true hippy chow. PB&J sandwiches. ( buy stock in peanut butter)
I await your next words of wit. Keep it up, your on a role. The stoners can’t keep as it is.

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Michael R. Kesti

14 September 2014

Walt 14Sep14 11:29 AM
Yes, how about cigarette smokers?
They publicly practiced their filthy, smelly habit for years allowing the power of their addiction to blind themselves how inconsiderate they were being to others. Now they sometimes complain that they are no longer permitted to force the filthy, stinking byproduct of their practice on others as if they would be polite company while positioning their behinds inches from one’s face and farting profusely. They often leave their sometimes still burning packages of poison anywhere they find convenient. Some are openly hypocritical, denying others the ability to legally enjoy their lives as they see fit while claiming that their duplicity is justified by the tax they pay on their drug of choice.
As you say, Walt, a drug is a drug. Why should using the drug to which you are powerfully addicted be legally permitted while others become criminals by using their drug of choice?

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Walt

14 September 2014

As usual the bait was taken. ( another well done “set up” if I do say so myself.)
Thanks for reinforcing MY point about the stench of MJ plants, and the militant mindset of growers. The smokers of a taxed (and heavily)product got the shaft,
yet the pro MJ den want free run, and a penny to “the man”.

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Michael R. Kesti

14 September 2014

Walt 14Sep14 02:13 PM
Not even close.
I am on record here as favoring the repeal of marijuana prohibition and treating its production, distribution, consumption, and taxation in the same ways we currently do with alcohol and tobacco. This would include legal home production for personal use, just as one may legally brew beer in the home. There are laws in place regarding nuisance odors and these would apply to the odor of backyard grows in the same way they do to the odors of home brewing.
If anybody got the shaft concerning smoking tobacco it was the non-smokers who were and sometimes still are subject to the inconsideration of smokers. I understand, however, that the power of your addiction makes it impossible for you to admit that subjecting others to your disgusting habit is extremely rude.
Did you intend to say, “…and not a penny…”?

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Walt

14 September 2014

Don’t feel too bad MK,, I’ve had plenty of experience at burying people with their own dirt.

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Walt

14 September 2014

Take a hike through Nevada City and the open dope smokers there. ( no consideration)
Playgrounds with dopers smoking around kids.
Until it’s legal play by the rules. ( not bloody likely)

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Walt

14 September 2014

Bottom line… Funny how the tune changes when it’s something YOU don’t like…

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Michael R. Kesti

14 September 2014

Walt 14Sep14 02:54 PM
If this vague threat is your best retort (and it does appear to be both of these) then it is you who has been set up. Please do try again, though, as I would prefer to believe that you can do better.
Walt 14Sep14 03:00 PM
I typically observe far more illicit tobacco use than marijuana use but if the law is being broken then it should be enforced.
I wondered how long it would take to hear a “for the kids” rebuttal. This is often a tack take by those who cannot otherwise support their side of a debate.
Walt 14Sep14 03:03 PM
I believe that my participation in this discussion has been entirely consistent. Do tell, though, which tune it is that you feel I have changed.

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Walt

14 September 2014

Ya.. “for the kids”. That’s want pushed taxes on tobacco higher and higher, then any other excuse under the sun.
Yes, your tune changed, since you “dislike” cig. smoke but where the smell of weed is the issue,, ” no problem”. Growing weed stinks up the place 24/7. ( depending on the grow)
As I recall, you neither use nor grow, yet think it’s a great idea. Me,, “been there ,,done that” and now smarter to know the difference.

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Michael R. Kesti

14 September 2014

Walt 14Sep14 03:54 PM
I never said, “No problem,” concerning the odor of marijuana grows. I did say that I felt existing law would cover the issue when legalization would allow home growth for personal use.
I am amused by, “Growing weed stinks up the place 24/7. ( depending on the grow)” Which is it, Walt, always or depending?
I have never made any statements here concerning my experience using or cultivating marijuana, nor whether I feel these are great ideas. I have said that I believe that, just as with the prohibition of alcohol, the prohibition of marijuana has generated more problems than it has solved and that the only solution that makes sense is legalization and regulation in the same way alcohol and tobacco are currently legal and regulated.
I think it’s wonderful that you have been there and now know the difference. I still find using that to support a demonstrably stupid prohibition to be an example of a liberal/progressive mindset.
When do you suppose you will become smart enough to kick your nicotine addiction?

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Don Bessee

14 September 2014

Programing Note! 4 P.M. Monday afternoon on Ch 3 DR. OZ will have a show on the dark side of legalization and the insidious marketing of edible pot that is clearly directed to kids. Gummy Bears, infused Soda’s, chocolate kisses and so on. Big Pot takes a page from Big Tabaco, get em early and you got em for life. So what if it costs 10 or so IQ points in kids who start early. Disproportionately impacting children of color. Gotta tell ya that Oprah is a tough negotiator! 🙂

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Richard Wynn

15 September 2014

Sorry Don, with the list of monkey business you’ve been involved with here, all I hear is the sound of flies from the BS you’re trying to push!

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George Rebane

15 September 2014

RichardW 246am – OK Mr Wynn, now that you’ve thoroughly trashed the messenger, it would be helpful for the rest of us if you moved on to the message – else you relegate yourself for membership in a group I’m sure you want to avoid. What exactly is the BS that DonB is trying to push?

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