Rebane's Ruminations
May 2014
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George Rebane

[This is the addended transcript of my regular KVMR commentary broadcast on 30 May 2014.]

Next Tuesday June 3rd Californians vote in their mid-term primaries.  And the question of voter fraud resurfaces as regularly as clockwork.  Traditionally conservatives are concerned and see it as problem that needs fixing, and liberals see nothing to worry about except that such worries are really designed to deny the vote to their constituencies.  I believe both sides can make their cases.

The most obvious and hard to deny reality is that polls continue to show that Americans have concerns about our elections.  Only 2 out of 5 believe elections are fair, and more than half the voters have no “confidence in the honesty of elections.”


What causes such a poor view of arguably the most sacrosanct institution in our democratic republic?  Well, the documented stories of voter fraud, improprieties, and just plain incompetence in how elections are handled grow after every vote count.  One reason for all this is that our voting systems and governing laws are very decentralized.  What is required to vote in one state or smaller jurisdiction is quite different than the requirements in others.  To systematically detect fraud is therefore difficult due to the apples and oranges problems when comparing factors which indicate fraud.

Legitimate concerns also point to recent elections that have been decided by as few as a couple of hundred votes out of millions, elections in which subsequent irregularities of a much higher number were discovered that could have thrown the results in the opposite direction.

Moreover, everyone knows of stories such as the ones about ‘voter bloat’ where more people are registered to vote than there are residents living there.  Recently ten blue counties in Colorado turned up with such embarrassing numbers, and countless others are scattered across the country.  Reports from local election boards and county commissions constantly identify such infractions as non-citizens registered and having voted.  At the same time these officials claim that there is little they can do because there are no funds to properly investigate and pursue the violators.

Across the country voter databases are a mess.  In a 2012 study Pew Research reported that 2.75 million people had active registrations in multiple states.  Moreover, 24 million, or one out of eight, active registrations in the country are either totally invalid or “significantly inaccurate”, such as the 1.8 million dead people still listed as active voters.

And, of course, there is a history of outfits like ACORN which have been exposed and their staff members prosecuted for systematically attracting and coaching unqualified people in how to vote early and often.  That organization was disbanded, but quickly resurrected itself in multiple follow-ons that are as active as ever in their attempts to improperly influence elections.  In short, the beat goes on.

The often suggested cure for all this is to establish and issue voter-ID cards or national ID cards that can serve the same purpose.  Liberals pounce on this idea as a blatant attempt to harass and intimidate their traditional constituencies among the poor and uneducated.  And outfits like the Brennan Center at NYU have presented ‘research’ arguing against requirements for voter-ID and even proof of citizenship, claiming that millions would be kept from the polls.  On the other hand organizations such as Judicial Watch and Heritage Foundation have systematically deconstructed such research, demonstrating bias toward pre-conceived results in both their survey questionnaires and data analyses.  Adding to the confusion is the libertarian Cato Institute which argues against additional voter-ID requirements, stating that people already have sufficient identification to properly vet their qualifications to vote.

So what can we do?  Unfortunately, precious little.  First, remember to vote.  And if you do have the time and energy, then become a poll watcher either at a polling place or later at the county elections office.  Just make sure they don’t treat you as a potted plant and stick you in a corner where you can’t see anything, that’s against the law.

Finally, please take note that just because voter fraud prosecutions are few does not mean that there is little evidence of voter fraud.

My name is Rebane, and I also expand on this and related themes on georgerebane.com where the addended transcript of this commentary is posted with relevant links, and where such issues are debated extensively.  However my views are not necessarily shared by KVMR.  Thank you for listening.

[Addendum]  Judicial Watch has published ‘8 Things You Can Do Now to Help STOP Voter Fraud – A Citizen Guide to Ensuring Free and Fair Elections in 2014 and Beyond’ to advise voters at the grassroots level what to do to combat voter fraud.  And organizations like True the Vote provide an update of what’s going on nationwide in the fight to keep elections fair and open.  And to get a real snootfull on all sides of the issue, just google ‘voter fraud’.

Posted in , ,

84 responses to “How Real is Voter Fraud?”

  1. Bonnie McGuire Avatar

    Most people I’ve discussed it with think the old method voting was best. I remember having to show my ID. You have to do that for everything. Those against it wouldn’t trust doing business with someone who couldn’t prove who they really are. To be against voter ID questions motives and opens the door to fraud. And then there’s those thousands of uncounted ballots that turn up in warehouses and wherever. Many years ago a good friend who worked at the polls many years noticed workers were becoming more careless….and expressed concern about it. We can hope for the best, but shouldn’t take it for granted.

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  2. Walt Avatar

    Identity theft is more than rampant. We take great care to protect our info these days or it can cost us plenty of grief if we don’t.
    Yet anyone can vote just by knowing a smidgen of one’s needed info. Name and address pretty much covers it in Ca.
    Nationally, there was plenty of voter fraud in the last few elections reported, and many by the election workers themselves.
    The re-election of Harry Reid and the mysterious “pre stuffed” electronic voting machines is another example.
    What’s even more scary, is that Progressives are pushing for on line voting.
    Yup,, that sure would be secure.

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  3. Walt Avatar

    Seems some LIBS have been doing some night work stealing campaign signs..(again)
    Keep it up. Sooner or later you will steal the one being watched by a trail cam.

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  4. stevenfrisch Avatar
    stevenfrisch

    How about a little truth in the mix.
    Voter fraud is almost a non-issue in American elections. The number of confirmed cases is so small, and the cases that do exist are usually from campaign organizations or candidates and thus covered under campaign ethics laws, that it is almost laughable.
    http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/map_of_the_week/2012/09/voter_id_laws_a_state_by_state_map_reveals_how_much_voter_fraud_there_is_in_the_united_states_almost_none_.html
    This is another case of George parroting a fake national issue to use fear to organize a constituency.
    The real issue is what is more important, the right to vote and equal access or the false fear of fraud. The answer is clear, the right to equal access and democracy trumps false fear every time.

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  5. Barry Pruett Avatar

    Now Steve…being from Chicago we know voter fraud occurs. Being asked to show a picture id (which is free) is not too much to ask. You cannot even get into any federal building without id yet we can vote for the people that work in them without proving we are who we say. In this day of identification and technology, showing an id is common place. We have even had instances of dead people voting in Nevada County. The issue is real.

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  6. Walt Avatar

    Steve.. ONE is too many. Don’t you think your “proof” is a tad dated? Or is it the only one you could find that leaned in your favor? Over 700 cases in North Carolina alone, in one year from a different source.
    Now for something a little more up to date.
    http://hotair.com/archives/2014/04/03/video-thousands-of-cases-of-voter-fraud-in-north-carolina/
    ( What Steve posts is from 2012.. Nice try dude..)
    Funny you didn’t deny the facts on Dirty Harry’s election. Even LIB news reported the “pre stuffed” voting machines.

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  7. fish Avatar
    fish

    The real issue is what is more important, the right to vote and equal access or the false fear of fraud. The answer is clear, the right to equal access and democracy trumps false fear every time.
    Wow…..you say that like you have a little Ben Emery doll in your pocket.

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  8. Barry Pruett Avatar

    Nevada actually has a cool system for voting which I observed extensively when working on Romney’s campaign. There is no mail balloting. All people must show up to vote, but early voting starts a month before the election. Early voting locations were mostly grocery stores and the like…places that were very convenient to voters. When checking in, the voters signature is compared to the registration signature saved on the county computer. The system also tells the poll worker if the voter has already voted and where. No id is required…but that additional layer would make the process quite secure.

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  9. stevenfrisch Avatar
    stevenfrisch

    Posted by: Walt | 31 May 2014 at 08:07 AM
    Jeez Walt, 2012 was the last national election, dated? nonsense.

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  10. Brad Croul Avatar
    Brad Croul

    I applaud those who wish to donate their time on election days as “poll watchers”.
    That said, I think it is complete waste of time in our neck of the woods. You might as well be a potted plant. The people working at the polls are already making sure the rules are followed. Not to mention that the poll workers probably collectively know most of the people coming into the polls personally, eliminating the possibility of someone voting as someone else.
    Of course, if you are a paranoid conspiracy theorist, you probably need to sit there and scowl at everyone who comes into the polling place, hoping to “scare them straight”. I would look for women carrying bigs bags filled with papers or guys with backpacks and make sure they are not standing over the ballot boxes for long periods of time stuffing multiple ballots into the boxes, or guys and gals wearing disquuises (wigs, moustaches, different jackets, or hats) repeatedly returing to the polls. Also pay attention to poll workers who say something like, “Hey Joe, your neighbors are out of town and said they did not submit absentee ballots, would you like to vote for them also?”

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  11. Walt Avatar

    LOL Steve,, a three paragraph “in depth” report, from a needle bending Lefty, low traffic web site, who pilfered it from a local TV station.
    Here is a little more info from AFTER the elections.
    * In 59 voting districts in the Philadelphia region, Obama received 100% of the votes with not even a single vote recorded for Romney. (A mathematical and statistical impossibility).
    * In 21 districts in Wood County Ohio, Obama received 100% of the votes where GOP inspectors were illegally removed from their polling locations – and not one single vote was recorded for Romney. (Another statistical impossibility).
    * In Wood County Ohio, 106,258 voted in a county with only 98,213 eligible voters.
    * In St. Lucie County, FL, there were 175,574 registered eligible voters but 247,713 votes were cast.
    * The National SEAL Museum, a polling location in St. Lucie County, FL had a 158% voter turnout.
    * Palm Beach County, FL had a 141% voter turnout.
    * In Ohio County, Obama won by 108% of the total number of eligible voters.
    NOTE: Obama won in every state that did not require a Photo ID and lost in every state that did require a Photo ID in order to vote.
    Read more at http://www.snopes.com/politics/ballot/2012fraud.asp#iyh8Byr59Ep0cKu5.99
    And PLENTY of other reports are out there, from PLENTY of other sources, if just care to look.
    Now choke on THIS….
    http://www.truethevote.org/news/how-widespread-is-voter-fraud-2012-facts-figures

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  12. Joe Koyote Avatar
    Joe Koyote

    Voter fraud is very real. George Bush would have never been President without it. Do Diebold voting machines ring a bell? Is the fact that not one incident of computer vote counting error in the Kerry/Bush election favored the Democrats ring a bell? Is the fact that in Ohio (the swing state that made the difference) some precincts had more votes for Bush than voters ring a bell? Is the fact that some Diebold machines were programmed to subtract votes for Kerry and add them to Bush’s vote count ring a bell? As art imitates life, where do you think the TV show Scandal got the idea that a Republican President got “elected” by rigging the vote count in Ohio? Modern election fraud is not about a busload of illegals driving around from precinct to precinct casting votes for dead people, it’s about rigging the machines that do the counting and limiting who can legally vote via voter list purges, etc.

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  13. fish Avatar
    fish

    Oh Magoo….err…I mean jeffy you’ve done it again…..
    “The Tea Party also will target voter fraud.” And sure enough, Rebane takes a cue from the hard-right political playbook and makes it an issue just days before the election, using the platform that KVMR gives him on the “news hour”
    Hey….what do the numbers:
    0, 7, 1, 20, 8, 0, 1, 0, 1, 5, 9, 15, 1, 19, 2, 23, 0, 19 have in common…..I know what you’re thinking….some series of code numbers from the latest M. Night Shyamalan film…and you could be forgiven for thinking that, but in truth they are really the numbers of comments at jeffy site for his various Scoops…., instances of snooty indignance, and whiny complaints about George and Todd.
    The saddest part…..jeffys personal input to these threads…anywhere from 30 to 100% and that’s just sad.

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  14. stevenfrisch Avatar
    stevenfrisch

    Posted by: Walt | 31 May 2014 at 09:10 AM
    http://www.snopes.com/politics/ballot/2012fraud.asp#iyh8Byr59Ep0cKu5.99
    Walt, did you actually read the Snopes report (not that I would consider Snopes an unimpeachable source)? The report debunks the ‘facts’ you posted above.
    I also must note that although you do a good job pointing out anomalies in voter registration, the big driver of those is the fact that 2.5 million people per year die in the US, and well more than half of them are registered to vote. It is normal that it takes more than a couple of years to get them off the books.
    I guess it would be too much to ask that you actually read the nonsense you post before you post it…but I will not object…because it really does show just how much a tool of ignorance you are.

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  15. stevenfrisch Avatar
    stevenfrisch

    “***Obama won in every state that did not require a Photo ID and lost in every state that did require a Photo ID in order to vote.”
    In the 2012 presidential election, Barack Obama did lose in every state that required all voters to provide photo ID, but those states were only four in number: Georgia, Indiana, Kansas, and Tennessee.
    Meanwhile, contrary to what is claimed here, he also lost in many states that did not require all voters to provide photo ID: Alabama, Alaska, Arizona, Arkansas, Idaho, Kentucky, Louisiana, Mississippi, Missouri, Montana, Nebraska, North Carolina, North Dakota, Oklahoma, South Carolina, South Dakota Texas, Utah, West Virginia, and Wyoming.
    Read more at http://www.snopes.com/politics/ballot/2012fraud.asp#fv35zywxcRtAzEm4.99

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  16. Walt Avatar

    Leave it to Joe for the “hanging chad” fiasco. The counts,, the recounts,, the re,recounts, and all the way to re,re,re,re,,recounts. They even made potato chip commercials out of the video footage.
    GOD help us if Gore had actually won! ( shiver at the thought)

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  17. stevenfrisch Avatar
    stevenfrisch

    By the way Walt, while you are busting me for using 2012 data, which is coincidentally the last national election, you might want to check your sources from “True the Vote”. They are entirely consistent with my sources from Slate.
    http://www.truethevote.org/news/did-you-know-there-are-voter-fraud-convictions-and-prosecutions-in-46-states
    Go through the list and note the incidents of voter fraud. In most states where links are still active they are one or two cases out of millions or hundreds of thousands of votes cast, and many of those are charges against candidates fro fraud, for things like living out of district.
    The total incidents of voter fraud in the US is approximately .0000013 %.
    http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/OTUS/voter-fraud-real-rare/story?id=17213376
    “Out of the 197 million votes cast for federal candidates between 2002 and 2005, only 40 voters were indicted for voter fraud, according to a Department of Justice study outlined during a 2006 Congressional hearing. Only 26 of those cases, or about .00000013 percent of the votes cast, resulted in convictions or guilty pleas.”
    This is another example of ‘conservatarians’ supported a bloated big government solution to a problem which does not exist so they can intimidate voters to stay home.

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  18. stevenfrisch Avatar
    stevenfrisch

    Walt, read your own links on voter fraud. They prove you are full of crap! That is why I love George’s site, it is basically nothing but an echo chamber for illiterate parrots.
    It makes me laugh every day.
    Sharia law in the US…I think I will laugh all the way to the shopping mall or to go see a Hollywood movie. I mean which is it George, are we countenancing a liberal society with no meaningful social values or are we welcoming Sharia? Kind of hard to do both buddy.
    My guess is Scarlett Johansson wins out over Hassan Rouhani any day!

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  19. Michael Anderson Avatar
    Michael Anderson

    “The sky is falling, the sky is falling, everyone run for your lives!!!!!”
    Tweety Bird or Geore Rebane? You decide…
    I’m going to go watch some Little League games now on the field of dreams at Pioneer Park. Hopefully there won’t be any bubonic plague outbreaks, food riots, DHS snipers, meteors, or other unpleasantness while the kids are playing today.
    Luckily, they have plenty of aluminium foil in the Snack Shack so I think I’m covered.

    Like

  20. fish Avatar
    fish

    I’m going to go watch some Little League games now on the field of dreams at Pioneer Park. Hopefully there won’t be any bubonic plague outbreaks, food riots, DHS snipers, meteors, or other unpleasantness while the kids are playing today.
    But Michael…you’ll be surrounded by hundreds of wrong thinkers…..and they won’t be wearing their armbands….confusion….chaos….divergent opinions….
    ….oh noes!

    Like

  21. fish Avatar
    fish

    Walt, read your own links on voter fraud. They prove you are full of crap! That is why I love George’s site, it is basically nothing but an echo chamber for illiterate parrots.
    It makes me laugh every day.
    Sharia law in the US…I think I will laugh all the way to the shopping mall or to go see a Hollywood movie. I mean which is it George, are we countenancing a liberal society with no meaningful social values or are we welcoming Sharia? Kind of hard to do both buddy.
    My guess is Scarlett Johansson wins out over Hassan Rouhani any day!

    Well at least I’m not the only regular whose “Satire-O-Meter” was malfunctioning this week. Michael noodled it through though……(hat tip)
    Sheesh, I guess I need to set up a web site that helps you guys parse your Dear Leader. I knew this was just more of George’s sardonic nonsense before I even got to his comments. Folks, Directive 3025.18 came out in 2010, and the Washington Times is just a tiny bit less kooky than InfoWars.

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  22. Walt Avatar

    Stevie is about to blow a gasket. Voter fraud is alive and well.
    A little note from history Steve,, What Nixon said in his first run for the W.H.,, and why he didn’t contest the voter fraud back then… ” They stole it fair and square”.
    How do you think Dems got tagged with ” Vote early and often”. Dems must be the “second coming”.. Only they have been able to raise the dead.
    Now that I think of it, I better see just which party Mom is now registered to vote for.

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  23. Todd Juvinall Avatar

    Voter fraud has been a problem since voting began. Look at the Roamns when they picked the top dog every year two thousand years ago.
    Nixon lost to all those dead voters in the Chicago graveyards and even here in little Nevada County I was privy to the mass migration of people from districts that were not on the ballot to those that were so influence could ne wrought in Supe races.(primary to general elections dates)
    It is everywhere and only those with the most to lose in the end game are defending the status quo. I see Frisch is an endorser of Mr. Alkire for DA today. Bravo, you are out of the closet!

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  24. stevenfrisch Avatar
    stevenfrisch

    I must note Walt that you once again did not address the issue. Since I have completely deconstructed your claims, and demonstrated that your ‘source’ actually was also debunking your claims, what do you have to say for yourself? Yes, I know, you will merely deflect, and make excuses for your poor scholarship.

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  25. George Rebane Avatar

    Two things to note in the above comments by our leftwing readers – 1) no data I cited indicating voter fraud is shown to be in error, only the number of prosecutions are cited as noted in my commentary, and 2) the claim that requiring ID for voting denies “equal access” is on the face of it false. There is no evidence that states requiring voter ID have seen a drop in minority voting rates; in fact, it’s quite the opposite as everyone becomes more confident that their voting system is fair and that all franchised voters will actually have their one vote count once.
    But middle roaders should note that along every issue in our republic we now look at each other across a great divide. And the paucity of argument, as indicated by the onset and source of name calling, is self-evident. But the ludicrous extreme comes from the Left’s claim that requiring voter ID somehow engenders “fear” in the hearts of legitimate voters – entering many private and public buildings and government office suites requires a picture ID, but similarly confirming you identity to a poll worker is said to deny equal access and strike fear in the hearts of legitimate voters. Pushing that bullcrap is one of the more exquisite weapons of class warfare that leftists have used perennially and successfully on their low-information constituencies.

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  26. Walt Avatar

    Steve.. If voter fraud is “nonexistent” The same can be said for identity theft. Right?
    Look at it another way. Voter fraud IS identity theft.
    The only time you come after me is when your on the ropes, and start the shell game of who said what and where, and how and when.
    Voter fraud by LIBS this time around will be pretty much viral and spread from shore to shore. LIBS are in DEEP trouble come Nov. and the likes of Dirty Harry will pull out ALL
    the stops to keep their elected jobs, and keep power. Not even LIB news believes the Left will keep the Senate.
    OK,, You can panic now. ( this should be good.)

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  27. Walt Avatar

    No, Steve,, you have “debunked” nothing.

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  28. stevenfrisch Avatar
    stevenfrisch

    Seriously Walt, did you not read the links? Are you THAT stupid…the link you posted was the opposite of what you claimed.
    I guess stupid is as stupid does;)

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  29. Walt Avatar

    Stupid?? That’s a good one coming from a person with a mental disorder.( terminal Liberalism) It’s time for some gene therapy Steve,, or have you forgot that the recessive “LIB Gene” was identified many years ago?
    Yup,, I may be a lowly ditch digger, but I worked for everything I have, and proud of a good days work for an honest buck. The same can’t be said for a professional beggar, being on a street corner or filling out grant paperwork.
    I will spring for your official Lefty tattoo. The DEM “mule” mascot with the words ” By any means necessary” inscribed around it.

    Like

  30. fish Avatar
    fish

    “fishy” eat your heart out:
    http://www.alexa.com/siteinfo/sierrafoothillsreport.com
    http://www.alexa.com/siteinfo/rebaneruminations.typepad.com
    LOL!

    Damn Jeffy…I had no idea your numbers were that bad.
    Really….for a guy with accomplishments like: a 30-year career as a journalist, having worked at The Chronicle for more than a decade, helped launch CNET (that was sold to CBS for $2 billion), having won a prestigious National Magazine Award, started a successful new venture up here, won work in competitive RFP process…….
    I guess I just expected more…….
    As always LOL.

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  31. Gary Smith Avatar

    I am a retired elections administrator that worked with the Diebold system for 10 years. First in California elections law and procedures are run by the state. Counties only do what the state tells them. Nevada County cannot start checking voters ID without paying a big price. Second there has never been a case of electronic vote tampering EVER proven in the United States up to 2012 when I retired. There is a lot of speculation, but no proof. I spent many hours researching this for my job. There is nothing more important to politicians than elections, and the laws and rules come hard and fast at California counties. Politicians pass laws, get their photo op, and it is up to the counties to it figure out. Do mistakes happen, you bet. California does a good job since 2000 of keeping dead wood of the books and cancelling your registration if you move. It cannot prevent you from registering in another state. There were a few cases of voter fraud every election, mostly of older people trying to vote 2 absentee ballots or go to the polls after voting absentee. Is it a memory issue or trying to vote twice, I would say a memory issue. When you sign your voter registration card you are stating the facts about your self and signing under the penalty of perjury and possible fraud. If you vote at the polls as some one else you are breaking the law. Both sides of the political spectrum have had their share of problems with groups registering people to vote and committing fraud.

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  32. Ben Emery Avatar

    George,
    I think you are conflating election fraud with voter fraud, which most definitely are not the same thing. Election Fraud has been the status quo for the Republican party for decades and voter fraud basically has been non existent for 30 years or so. Republicans can no longer win the Presidency on a true and open vote, so they have to suppress votes to give the illusion of victory. Only 27% of registered voters identify as Republican. The only way to win elections when numbers are that low are to suppress the casting of votes against your party and making the capital cities across the nation so divided people throw their hands up and say forget it.
    The fact you bring up ACORN tells us you did very little research into this post. ACORN was cleared and actually turned in the right wing douche-bag O’Keefe moments he left the building to the police. Acorn was cleared while O’Keefe was found guilty.
    James O’Keefe Pays $100,000 To ACORN Employee He Smeared-Conservative Media Yawns
    http://www.forbes.com/sites/rickungar/2013/03/08/james-okeefe-pays-100000-to-acorn-employee-he-smeared-conservative-media-yawns/
    Election Fraud
    Was the 2004 Election Stolen?
    Republicans prevented more than 350,000 voters in Ohio from casting ballots or having their votes counted — enough to have put John Kerry in the White House.
    http://www.commondreams.org/views06/0601-34.htm
    The Case for Fraud in Ohio Election 2004
    http://www.bpac.info/Votefraud/OhioFraud.html
    Gores Victory
    http://www.consortiumnews.com/2001/111201a.html
    Voter Fraud
    Comprehensive Database of U.S. Voter Fraud Uncovers No Evidence That Photo ID Is Needed
    http://votingrights.news21.com/article/election-fraud/
    In 5-Year Effort, Scant Evidence of Voter Fraud
    http://www.nytimes.com/2007/04/12/washington/12fraud.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0

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  33. George Rebane Avatar

    Little Estonia is a high tech country on the Baltic that has integrated the internet maximally into its public institutions, and that includes implementing evoting nationwide. Estonia is also the only country that has suffered a nationwide cyberattack launched by another country (Russia). In response to this, the international institute for studying cyber warfare is located in Estonia’s capital Tallinn. Recently the Estonian evoting system has come under close scrutiny by many competent international technical experts, and it has been found wanting as an online system secure from hackers. The larger conclusion now is that any online or even offline computer network using current network communications and firewall protocols may be successfully breached by malevolents intending harm. In short, today’s technology does not yet support practical and secure evoting.

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  34. Walt Avatar

    Mr. Smith. “Second there has never been a case of electronic vote tampering EVER proven in the United States up to 2012”
    The best known instance is Harry Reid’s election.
    “Democrats in a rather insidious way. A collective bargaining agreement (CBA) between Clark County and SEIU Local 1107 puts the union in charge of servicing all voting machines. The agreement reads as follows:
    Page 75 of this agreement indicates “Voting Machine Technician” to be a classified SEIU position in Exhibit A. Although the CBA expired on June 30, 2010, it remains in force because of language in Article 43 that grants an indefinite year-to-year extension until one party deems it unworkable.”
    SEIU isn’t the most upstanding union in the nation. And this group is in charge of voting machines?
    Like paying top dollar to the fox to guard the chicken coup, and is held blameless when most of the chickens are gone.
    “In late October, during early balloting, for example, a number of voters in Boulder City complained Reid’s name already was checked.
    Isn’t this about the same as giving Bonnie and Clyde the keys to the bank and asking them to guard it?
    According to one eyewitness, Joyce Ferrara, the problem was rampant. “Something’s not right,” she said. “One person, that’s a fluke. Two, that’s strange, several within a five-minute period of time – that’s wrong.” ”
    We have seen how Leftist ” self investigation” has played out.

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  35. Todd Juvinall Avatar

    A couple of things. First, Canda, our pal to the north, requires a voter ID to vote and as we all know they are a fairly left of center country.
    Second, election frais, voter fraus, who cares to parse it except Clinton and liberals. I recall Tammany Hall was kind of a fraus every election and they paid money to people to vote early and often, Then more recently, the Ward system was inposed on the people of Chicago and it has proven to be a great source of multiple votes by a single person and many by dead people. Many Illinois politicians have been incarcerated for that.
    So, as usual, Walt has it right, the rent seeker from Truckee has it wrong and now we have a “elections” fellow blowing lefty smoke about the absence of fraud ever happening in the USA. Amazing!
    http://historyhalf.com/history-of-voter-fraud/
    http://query.nytimes.com/gst/abstract.html?res=F20D11F7345B127B93C6AB178BD95F428784F9
    http://blogs.villagevoice.com/runninscared/2012/11/voter_fraud_a_n.php
    Here is a partial article from the NEW AMERICAN on North Carolin’as cross checking voters with other states in 2012.
    “35,750 voters who voted in the 2012 general election in North Carolina had exact matches on first name, last name and date of birth with voters who voted in at least one other participating state in the 2012 general election.”
    So Steve Frisch, it appears you are the stupid one.

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  36. fish Avatar
    fish

    From Bens link at the Old Fey Lady
    One ex-convict was so unfamiliar with the rules that he provided his prison-issued identification card, stamped “Offender,” when he registered just before voting.
    Pity….this chap is the TEAM EVIL dream voter…..a certifiable and reliable Team D moron.

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  37. Gary Smith Avatar

    Todd: I said “electronic” voter fraud. Paper ballot box stuffing is as old as America.

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  38. Ben Emery Avatar

    Fish,
    What is your point? Is TEAM EVIL those who aren’t as extreme right wing as you? That would make about 90% of the American electorate TEAM EVIL. As I have said here many times I don’t mind a conservative government if that is what the majority of the people want but in the US conservatives are very much in the minority and yet we have one of the most conservative industrialized governments on the planet. That is where I have a problem, especially when people like you or George like to pretend the numbers are reversed. Conservatives on your level are a very small % of the electorate and unfortunately you share the idealism as those like Dick Cheney, Donald Rumsfeld, Richard Pearle, Paul Wolfawitz, and William Crystal. You know the neocons that have destroyed the US goodwill and good name around the world.

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  39. Walt Avatar

    This just keeps getting better and better. Now Ca. pot shops are getting in on the action.
    ” Vote and get free weed”… A tad illegal actually…But who cares??
    ” The group’s voter guide, which focuses mostly on local races and backs Democratic candidates, promotes politicians who director John Lee describes as “friendly to the cannabis movement or at least better than the alternatives.”
    http://news.yahoo.com/san-jose-pot-clubs-offer-voters-free-weed-215503568.html;_ylt=AwrBEiRnB4lTZiYAeVHQtDMD
    That’s right,, toke up before casting the ballot. At least it would create the excuse when the “wrong guy” wins. ” Uh,, dude… I think I checked the wrong box… Uh,, can I have, uh, a do over? ” WOW Mannn,,,, a bong hit when you enter the voting booth?
    Yaaaa… I’ll cast a vote for some free weed,,, Bitch’n! OH.. My MMJ card? Yup, I got it right here.. It helps with my allergies…. Uh,, who am I voting for BTW??”

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  40. Ben Emery Avatar

    Republicrats
    http://www.occucards.com/republicrats/
    The two-party duopoly is a common term used to describe the political system in the U.S., in which two political parties—the Republicans and Democrats—dominate government while holding virtually identical positions on most economic and foreign policy issues. Funded by the same corporate interests, these two parties are sometimes together referred to as “Republicrats” because they resemble two wings of a single party whose policies benefit large corporations and the super rich against the interests of the vast majority (despite holding very different positions on cultural issues in which corporations have little or no interest).
    Within the two-party duopoly, third parties are shut out of the political process altogether. For example, restrictive ballot access laws require third party candidates to collect tens of thousands of signatures. In addition, they are systematically ignored by the corporate media and excluded from the Presidential debates. (The Commission on Presidential Debates is a private corporation headed by former Republican and Democratic leaders, and funded by big corporate interests.) The “winner take all” voting system used in congressional and state legislative elections also precludes third-party representation, as runners-up get nothing, even when the margin of victory is narrow. Because of this, the vast majority of democracies in the world—including all European countries—use “proportional representation” (PR) voting systems, in which legislative seats are divided proportionally based on the percentage of votes each party receives. Such voting systems give voters more choice, produce multi-party legislatures, and reduce the ability of monied interests to control the political process.
    In the U.S., however, the two-party system easily lends itself to corporate manipulation and control. This is particularly true when neither party holds a wide majority, as small margins ensure that lobbyists need only convince a few legislators from one party to vote with their opposition. By funding candidates from both parties, therefore, corporations do not simply purchase loyalty, but they prevent either party from obtaining a continuous, popular majority that might challenge corporate interests. Also, the culture wars between “liberal” and “conservative” value systems conveniently divide the voters between the two parties by providing them with real yet economically insignificant reasons to prefer one party over the other. As political philosopher Sheldon Wolin writes in his book, Democracy Incorporated, “The point about [these cultural] disputes is that they are not framed to be resolved. Their political function is to divide the citizenry while obscuring class differences and diverting the voters’ attention from the social and economic concerns of the general populace.”
    The proliferation of corporate-funded “Super PACs” (a result of the 2010 Supreme Court decision, Citizens United, which allows corporations unlimited funding of political campaigns) is only the most recent example of corruption within the U.S. electoral system. Elections have long been rigged in favor of the two corporate parties. For third parties to have any real chance of adequate representation, major, systemic reforms are necessary. These include breaking up media monopolies, having purely publicly funded campaigns, instituting PR voting systems, adding a binding “none of the above” option on all ballots, establishing universal voter registration, and much more. Such reforms would weaken if not destroy the two-party duopoly, and will therefore be strongly resisted by current Republicrats and the powerful interests that back them. Only a mass movement of education, protest and civil disobedience that puts tremendous outside pressure upon the corporate state will be capable of bringing about such a fundamental transformation of the electoral system.

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  41. stevenfrisch Avatar
    stevenfrisch

    I think Michael has the entire approach right—Todd and Walt are so stupid that the only thing to do is shake your head and swear at them for their ignorance—as opposed to George, who knows exactly what he is doing.

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  42. Todd Juvinall Avatar

    Smith, are you saying the North Carolina 35,000 in 2012 were not electronic?

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  43. Todd Juvinall Avatar

    Steve Frisch cracks me up. The self proclaimed “smartest guy” always name calls. Fantastic! You lefty readers out there pay attention now. Steve Frisch is the best you have. I feel deeply sorry for you and the country.What a hoot!

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  44. fish Avatar
    fish

    Is TEAM EVIL those who aren’t as extreme right wing as you?
    Remember Ben I’m Georges pet libertarian…..I’m not a republican….and as far as assigning terms, TEAM EVIL serves a shorthand for the troglodyte democrat ever growing state left. You’ve never bothered documenting your FACIST/CORPORATIST?AUTHORITARIAN charges because you can’t. You’re a fabulous proggie chanter but after the echoes fade you really got nothing.
    As I have said here many times I don’t mind a conservative government if that is what the majority of the people want but in the US conservatives are very much in the minority and yet we have one of the most conservative industrialized governments on the planet.
    I’m perfectly happy seeing TEAM STUPID go down in flames as well Ben…as I said I’m a libertarian…..I really have no dog in the fight. Interested to know if you will have an explanation if the republicans retake the senate. One would think that as inept as our affirmative action president has been, the swelling ranks of your army of true believers would put the legislative branch solidly in the TEAM D camp. I’m actually puzzled because I think that you are correct…..your numbers seem to be growing.
    I only hope I live long enough to see TEAM EVIL present their empty headed followers with the bill. Everybody is a progressive until they see just how much it costs.
    Conservatives on your level are a very small % of the electorate and unfortunately you share the idealism as those like Dick Cheney, Donald Rumsfeld, Richard Pearle, Paul Wolfawitz, and William Crystal. You know the neocons that have destroyed the US goodwill and good name around the world.
    This is how I know you really have nothing…..you have to fall back on lefty platitudes and DailyKos talking points. I’ve stated publicly that I was initially and remain opposed now to both the Iraq and Afganistan wars as well as all the other proposed middle east fun and games. I’ve stated that I thought cutting back on defense spending severely not only necessary but inevitable….even when it will likely hurt me personally. So no Ben, as usual you’re wrong. I don’t share the same ideologies as the Cheneys, Rumsfelds, and Wolfowitzs of this world.
    Is there anything else I can help you with today?

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  45. Ben Emery Avatar

    No Fish,
    You have never identified yourself as a libertarian to me or while I was posting here previously. Good to know that you get the leadership of the R’s and D’s are the enemy of the people.
    If the libertarian identification is true then you and I have a lot in common when it comes to governance. Personally I am more libertarian than anything else but politically I am more in the progressive camp because I believe all government isn’t bad but rather believe in representative government. Representative governance is what the colonists practiced for centuries and then held the crown accountable when the laws were being forced upon the colonists without any representation. At the moment we (average people) have virtually no representation in our state and federal government due to the fact the republicrats have controlled our state/ federal government for over 150 years. It is the republicrats that are holding our nation hostage with their fear based propaganda and smear campaigns.
    Institutions are about self preservation and the two largest institutions in America are the Republican and Democratic Party’s. Good governance is very low on the priority list of our two institutions and winning the next election is everything.

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  46. fish Avatar
    fish

    I think Michael has the entire approach right—Todd and Walt are so stupid that the only thing to do is shake your head and swear at them for their ignorance—as opposed to George, who knows exactly what he is doing.
    Yes Steve….who could forget the nefarious Dr. G….directing his evil, yet empty headed minions to do his evil bidding in the Sierra Foothills…..oooohh….evil!
    http://tinyurl.com/Ultimate-Evil
    You really are a menopausal woman.

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  47. fish Avatar
    fish

    You have never identified yourself as a libertarian to me or while I was posting here previously.
    Yes I have…as recently as:
    http://rebaneruminations.typepad.com/rebanes_ruminations/2014/05/the-va-fiasco-some-thoughts.html#comments
    at Posted by: fish | 28 May 2014 at 09:52 PM
    If the libertarian identification is true then you and I have a lot in common when it comes to governance.
    Hardly…progressivism is absolutely incompatible with libertarianism. Progressivism requires coercion….which is why I find myself laughing out loud when whine about others being “authoritarian”. You don’t have a clue as to what you are politically and what your positions demand. Progressivism sounds benign….lets give the people programs, lets give the people safety, lets give the people security……while you steal their liberties and ruin their intellects. It’s why you guys must have control of the education establishment. It’s crucial to narrow the range of acceptable thought…..indoctrination not education. Russ Steele posted a link to new history curriculum…. half a page for George Washington but I’m guessing there’s a shitload on how it really sucked to be a negro, and while that certainly requires attention it’s hardly central to this nations history…..unless you need it as a cudgel to guilt people into puking up more taxes for the victims. I recall with much glee your complaining to Gregory about his desire to maintain rigorous math standards….‘You do realize that k-12 is much much more than proficiency in math or any one subject, correct? All around are the students at Bear River proficient at being decent humans beings? Teaching students to follow their passion and to critically think are the way the US will begin to start competing in education once again internationally, not standardized testing.’…you better hope those kids don’t start thinking critically or you proggies are out of business.
    Good governance is very low on the priority list of our two institutions and winning the next election is everything.
    And yet I state that I’m perfectly happy to see both the established parties burn while you still seem compelled to defend the democrats and their policies.

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  48. Walt Avatar

    One thing is for sure where LIBS and Progressives are concerned. They are great at revisionism, and all suffer from selective memory loss.
    It seems Progressives and people that have Alzheimer’s have plenty in common.

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  49. Gary Smith Avatar

    Todd:
    I don’t research the 2012 North Carolina case, I retired at the start of 2012. Up to 2012 there was never a proven case of a electronic voting machine that was tampered with to fix an election. There were cases of machines that malfunctioned but they were not programmed to count votes for the wrong guy. From what I did read in the North Carolina case I believe that when they voted for Romney it switched to Obama. This can happen to machines that I worked on if they are not calibrated. You could touch to vote for Obama it would register for someone else. If it was programmed wrong you probably would not see it on the screen. If you were going to fix an election why would someone choose the lowest level, the voting machine. Why not fix the computer that counts the voting machines? Hell why not hack the states central computer? Time and time again the candidate lost and people would look for some other reason besides he did not get more votes than the other guy. Bush stole the election from Kerry, Obama stole the election from Romney. I spent a lot of hours researching Bush vs Kerry and voting machines did not play significant role IMO. There were other factors, like not enough ballots, understaffed polling places, etc. This is the best way if you wanted effect the outcome. No jail time there, gee I guess I didn’t provide enough ballots, or I am sorry there is a one hour line at this polling place and 2 minute line at this polling place. You can have poorly designed ballots that effect the outcome, is that on purpose or is it an accident?

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  50. Ben Emery Avatar

    Well Fish,
    I reached out an olive branch and you smack it away with searching for differences instead accepting the commonalities. So be it, it shows how little you actually understand the different types of political stripes. Progressives and libertarians find differences in economics and that is about it. Personal freedom and liberty we are on the same page. Low government interference with our personal lives, end war on drugs, end our interventions in sovereign nations, equal access and opportunity for all not just some, equality in our justice system/ due process, no bank or big business bailouts, no corporate welfare, and a big one ending the private reign and secrecy of the Federal Reserve.
    “And yet I state that I’m perfectly happy to see both the established parties burn while you still seem compelled to defend the democrats and their policies.”
    Don’t mistake my disgust of the Republican Party as a vote of confidence of the Democratic Party. My biggest arguments are with Democrats not Republicans and I am actively trying to get labor and environmental groups to come together and oust the Democratic Party from the horrible representation of the interests of the left side of the political aisle. I am just a grunt guy but definitely not alone. A new labor/ progressive party. Democratic Insiders and sympathizers and I go at it all the time.
    Take the test, Personal Issues I fall 100% into the libertarian category and on Economic Issues I am about 50/50.
    http://theadvocates.org/quiz/quiz.php#

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