Rebane's Ruminations
October 2013
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George Rebane

This piece of legislation is turning out to be horrible beyond prediction and measure, and we are nowhere near discovering or experiencing the full extent of the damage that it will do to our republic.  I just want this dated post to become a matter of record on RR, one that joins its precursor forebodings that have populated these pages for some years now.  Every assessment and prediction here has been short of the mark.  The cynically named Affordable Care Act is much worse than anyone who understands a smidgeon of things Austrian, to things bureaucratic, to things about systems design could have imagined.  In short, Obamacare is a disaster already made and still in the making – the ‘best’ is yet to come.

But what the saga to date has corroborated is the absolute depths of hubris, pandering, opacity, and corruption that this administration, along with its congressional minions, has perpetrated.  Every beneficent claim for that abhorrent attack on our healthcare system and economy has been shown to be a purposive lie.  For this, HHS Secretary Kathleen Sebelius should be impeached and then criminally prosecuted.  Assuming that she is not stupid beyond belief, she did indeed know her errors and omissions over the last three years, and she most certainly knew the lies she streamed out during this interval.  And if she told the truth to the President, then he is at least equally guilty.

The tragi-comedy for our nation is how many of the ignorant and informationally deprived this administration has still been able to bamboozle.  The only real benefit to its perpetrators that all this has brought about is the disarray into which the affair has thrown the Republicans.  But they are recovering, and given the stream of horrors that Obamacare is generating by the day, the GOP might even come out of this smelling like a rose as the putrid mess begins to sink under its own weight.  Its prescient opponents need only remind people that not only did they tell us so, but they also proposed alternative approaches to improve our healthcare system that were rejected in toto by an all progressive government.  As someone said, ‘Elections have consequences.’

[24oct13 update] The abbreviated criticism above is meant to draw attention to the congressional hearings corroborating the nation’s concerns about the dire straits of Obamacare, and to invite some typical responses from the Left claiming that things are running normally and pretty much as expected (by technically knowledgeable people) in the fielding of the ACA.  Mr Michael Anderson, who runs a computer services business in Nevada County, was able to supply such an assessment in his 928pm comment below.  My response to that is in the sequel.

[26oct13 update] Has everyone googled the growing litany of ‘admissions’ by the terminally incompetent Sebelius.  The one that really drew some belly laughs was AP’s quote that she “admitted” to the President that she has to now fix the website – ‘admitted’!!??  I have changed my mind and agree fully with those calling for her to stay until  she again pronounces healthcare.gov ready for prime time.  I do believe that the President deserves the full measure of her services.  We already paid for that entertainment once, so let’s now enjoy it.  (The following was sent to me by a reader who admitted pilfereing it from ZeroHedge.)

Obamacare4

Posted in , ,

109 responses to “Obamacare – legis horriblis (updated 26oct13)”

  1. Gregory Avatar

    “Seriously Greg? This is where you want to go? I have a dossier on your work history in Nevada County since you first arrived”
    Oh, really? Do tell. A dossier? And you claimed to have erased your folders on me… so you’re either lying now, or then. Which is it?
    “as well as a detailed account of your pilot doings over the years. Remember, it ain’t libel if it’s true. Right?”
    My pilot doings include never breaking a regulation, never being cited by the FAA or the NTSB, never being reprimanded by anyone. You won’t find anything to the contrary and your innuendo really is libelous.

    Like

  2. Bill Tozer Avatar
    Bill Tozer

    Best quote of yesterday:
    Rep. Rick Nolan (D-Minn.) told reporters Wednesday that heads should roll and people should be fired because of the horrendous rollout. He also called on Obama to “man up” and explain to Americans who’s responsible for the mess.
    Read more: http://www.businessinsider.com/obamacare-website-rollout-democrats-joe-manchin-mandate-delay-2013-10#ixzz2inrIGDYG

    Like

  3. Gregory Avatar

    My pilot doings in and around the local airport also include a couple years as a command pilot for Angel Flight, a charity that flies people in need, typically from a remote location to the big city for medical care, and back. I remember one was a young dreadlocked mother whose newborn baby was taken by air ambulance from Arcata to San Francisco, and her only option without an Angel Flight to reunite with her baby was to take an 11 hour bus ride, which she was in no condition to make. So I volunteered to fly her from Arcata to Oakland.
    Other flights included a Grass Valley man getting cancer treatments at Stanford, and a woman from the Eureka area who needed a round trip to an ear specialist in Sacramento. And there were others.

    Like

  4. Michael Anderson Avatar
    Michael Anderson

    “…and Al Gore fans just can’t get over losing.”
    Yeah, not an Al Gore fan. Just someone who believes that the popular vote of the total electorate should decide presidential elections. One man, one vote. And that federal elections will someday soon have election standards that will keep corrupt counties, like those in Florida in 2000, from screwing up the entire country.
    George W. Bush was the worst president in the history of the United States. A lot of people paid the ultimate price for his illegitimacy, and so many others were economically destroyed. I was not personally destroyed, but I took some pretty significant hits, and I look at the census blocks of those who put him into office as enemies of the United States of America. These people are not patriots, they are not good citizens, and we need to be aware of the damage they are doing to this great country.
    The good news is that the demographic is changing rapidly, and all of the old battle guards who are still fighting the rift created by the Vietnam War are dying off. This country, under the rules of a living and breathing Constitution, will become more socialist, and fairness of opportunity will flourish. The old fascist guard, the same people who thought the Nazis kinda had the right idea but they just handled it very poorly, will be dead in the ground soon.
    The largely libertarian and progressive Millennials know this deep in their souls. For me, the battle has been won. Recalcitrants like GG can hang on to their Dreg Scott decisions, but 50 or 100 years from now, they will be reviled for their hateful positions.
    See you on the History Channel, buddy. Goodbye, Electoral College.

    Like

  5. Michael Anderson Avatar
    Michael Anderson

    “A dossier?”
    Total recall, it’s memorized. Doesn’t live and breathe, just an historical artifact.
    Like an old fossil. In a drawer somewhere. Whatever.

    Like

  6. Gregory Avatar

    Regarding CGI Federal, there’s this tidbit in the news today:
    “First Lady Michelle Obama’s Princeton classmate is a top executive at the company that earned the contract to build the failed Obamacare website.
    Toni Townes-Whitley, Princeton class of ’85, is senior vice president at CGI Federal, which earned the no-bid contract…”
    Just a coincidence…?

    Like

  7. Gregory Avatar

    ” I look at the census blocks of those who put [George Bush] into office as enemies of the United States of America. These people are not patriots, they are not good citizens, and we need to be aware of the damage they are doing to this great country.”
    So, Michael Anderson, do you refuse to take Republicans as clients?

    Like

  8. Michael Anderson Avatar
    Michael Anderson

    “Just a coincidence…?”
    Yeah, impeachment for sure.
    Is another Vince Foster moment waiting in the wings?
    The point I made the other day still has not been addressed. George chose to put his CV on his chest instead of dealing with the fact that the blue states are rolling in money as the economy improves, and the red states are suffering.
    Me? Not a big fan of the red states, being a California west coast kinda guy. I like vibrant business, and I love growing economies. I also like capitalism. What I don’t like are red state tards trying to destroy the recovery, and trying to destroy health care reform, and just generally whining and complaining whenever there is a Democrat in office. If you don’t like it here, move the fuck away.
    America, Love It Or Leave It.

    Like

  9. Gregory Avatar

    Regarding Florida and the Bush-Gore election, had the election tally not been falsely called for Gore by the TV networks while polls were still open in west Florida, Bush II would have cleanly won Florida. That has been estimated as a 10,000 vote hit as people stopped going to the polls after being told their vote didn’t count.

    Like

  10. Michael Anderson Avatar
    Michael Anderson

    Greg wrote: “That has been estimated as a 10,000 vote hit as people stopped going to the polls after being told their vote didn’t count.”
    Fair enough. Still doesn’t address the fact that Gore won the popular vote. One man, one vote. Electoral College is going down, probably even in our lifetimes. Sooner rather than later if the Tea Party continues with its nonsense.
    The big news in the coming two years will be how the deep Republican Party fracture plays out.

    Like

  11. Todd Juvinall Avatar

    Greg I went to MA’s website and there seems to only be three employees. Nice pictures of the three but looking at MA’s mug, I shuddered with dread. He reminds me of the movie I saw part of today. Boris Karloff played a zombie in the “Walking Dead” of 1936. MA, has a real close resemblance. I feel bad for his progeny. Shunning will be rampant. (except at Burning Man, perv heaven)
    Gore lost the Electoral vote as the Founders set it up. MA doesn’t like that apparently so he would rather have California and New Yoprk pick the Prez and Vice for the other states. Totally moronic.
    But what can we do with a moronic IT guy? Oh, have him hired to do government work then no one will ever get something that works. Russ’s info was superb. IT guys like MA have now become the baseball players on steroids. Everyone will hate them.
    So, when I read moronic tripe by MA I am able to visualize those three employees, all white, hard at work trying to please the unpleasant boss of of a three employee biz. Too funny. BTW. I probably put many more dollars and had a lot more employees in the local economy than some lib posters here.

    Like

  12. Todd Juvinall Avatar

    Oh, one last thing. I watched and listened to Ted Cruz speaking to the Iowa Republicans today. He is a hit. Full of common sense and able to articulate his thoughts. The liberals and their press stenographers are quaking in their Birkenstock because Cruz is not stoppable in the quest for the truth. It was a good speech. Lots of applause. The left’s polls are bullshit about him.

    Like

  13. Michael Anderson Avatar
    Michael Anderson

    Greg asked: “So, Michael Anderson, do you refuse to take Republicans as clients?”
    Wow, more boundary crossings. Greg, as I noted before, you are the one who continues to try to stop me from commenting by bringing my personal business into the discussion. This is why I brought up the issue of bad manners. You are basically pulling your pants down and shitting on my doorstep. And the site of your tiny little white ass on my doorstep, with runny poops from a bad diet brought on by poverty, is my worst Halloween nightmare.
    Now, while I find this behavior to be rude and abusive, I also understand that it is a result of some sort of unfortunate medical condition, over which I have no control.
    I also no longer care if you cease and desist, but I will not have any problem continuing to point out to the RR readers that there is something wrong with you.
    Have a nice day tomorrow. It should be glorious, with highs in the mid-70s, and mostly open sunshine as we’ve been graced with the past couple of weeks.

    Like

  14. Gregory Avatar

    “Just someone who believes that the popular vote of the total electorate should decide presidential elections.”
    mandersonation, perhaps you should move to a country that has such a system. The Electoral College will not be going away as long as the country remains intact.
    “”A dossier?”
    Total recall, it’s memorized.”
    I really am in your head and I can’t get out. Amazing. And this from a fellow who has never met me but thinks he knows my “sordid” doings in Nevada County. You really do need help, Mike.

    Like

  15. Michael Anderson Avatar
    Michael Anderson

    I am really sorry that I ever commented on this really rude and evil website. Todd, my business has never been a part of this discussion until you and Greg brought it up. I have a fiduciary responsibility to my employees and other stakeholders to not allow your libel and slander to affect my bottom line. Thus, I must regretfully exit.
    I do feel that I have now done my duty at this site in identifying people in this county who are antithetical to forward progress, and we’ll just have to leave it at that.
    I bid my adieu. Farewell fond friends, you will not have MA to kick around anymore.

    Like

  16. Michael Anderson Avatar
    Michael Anderson

    One last comment: Even though this website is truly rude and evil, at least when it comes to politics [I am sure I will still read and enjoy George’s movie reviews, and tech analysis, etc.], it is still one of the top comedy websites on the tubes. Just had to get that in. Keep on keepin’ on, you rascally comedians you.

    Like

  17. Michael Anderson Avatar
    Michael Anderson

    One last comment: Even though this website is truly rude and evil, at least when it comes to politics, it is still one of the top comedy websites on the tubes. Just had to get that in. Keep on keepin’ on, you rascally comedians you.

    Like

  18. L Avatar
    L

    MA, please stop characterizing yourself as some odd species of Republican. As someone once said, your reasoning is so far off base that it doesn’t even rise to the (rather low) level of being wrong. Say and do whaterver you like, but a Republican? L.

    Like

  19. Gregory Avatar

    Mike, there’s a great narrative to be told about the intersection of your politics, your threats, and your business.
    <i?”Greg asked: “So, Michael Anderson, do you refuse to take Republicans as clients?”
    Wow, more boundary crossings. Greg, as I noted before, you are the one who continues to try to stop me from commenting by bringing my personal business into the discussion.
    Wow, this after your libelous threats of 10:04PM? You finally went over the bright line of a “libel per se” with that one. Ask that lawyer of yours to explain it to you.
    The best thing about an Obamacare meltdown will be watching you, Mike, and we don’t have to wait until 2016. The campaign of 2014 is the show. Republicans have a knack for pulling defeat from the jaws of victory (a great laugh line I had with my fellow parade goers as the jubilant Tea Party truck inched along the 2012 4th of July Parade in GV), but they will be helped along by the quaint historical fact that the President’s party has always taken a hit at the 6 year mark.
    And today we have the likes of Kirsten Powers, stating “The argument Obama won in 2012 about the role of government has already been squandered. The Obamacare rollout is a disaster for progressive politics”
    Great stuff. You might want to get that Haldol script filled, Mike, it’s going to be a bumpy 2014 for “Republicans” like yourself.

    Like

  20. Gregory Avatar


    Damn, italics didn’t work on my last post. This is a test.

    Like

  21. Michael Anderson Avatar
    Michael Anderson

    Fuck you, “L.” Petty coward with no name, drive by asshole. Epitomizing why this website is pestilence.
    And Greg, did you get the last lick in? Didja?
    If you respond again to me, I won’t. When we meet, which we eventually will, it will be a joyous day for me. For you, not so much.

    Like

  22. Gregory Avatar

    “The liberals and their press stenographers are quaking in their Birkenstock because Cruz is not stoppable in the quest for the truth.”
    Todd, I wear Birkies all the time and remain a non-progressive, non-Democrat liberal… and Cruz is one of the worst to come onto the stage in a long time. While no doubt exceedingly bright, he strikes me as an inauthentic opportunist with delusions of grandeur, with the same lack of across the aisle negotiation skills as Obama. Or even negotiations in his own party.
    In 2016 I think the country will not be of a mind to elect a one term Senator to be President, especially with a spouse who is a Goldman Sachs executive.

    Like

  23. Gregory Avatar

    “If you respond again to me, I won’t. When we meet, which we eventually will, it will be a joyous day for me. For you, not so much.”
    Mike, we already have been face to face; you missed it. And thank you for yet another empty threat; yes, I know, you just can’t help yourself.

    Like

  24. George Rebane Avatar

    Well, we are thankful that this informative and revealing exchange is over, and from the sound of it, will not be repeated. I hope that all will recall that the Internet is forever. As certain readers of progressive bent before him, Mr Anderson has also erected quite an edifice to memorialize his thought. This corpus is remarkable when we consider that he is a family man and runs a business in this community. Nevertheless, may it continue to bring him joy.

    Like

  25. Barry Pruett Avatar
    Barry Pruett

    Today I read that Sebelius blamed Republicans for failure of Obamacare website. Priceless.

    Like

  26. stevenfrisch Avatar
    stevenfrisch

    You guys be sure to hold that “running a business” sword over everyone’s head. It means only retirees with long and dated resumes and true believers will post.
    I am not commenting here anymore [except for this brief repost] for the same reason Michael is not commenting anymore; clearly there are no comments too beyond the pale, nothing beyond the protocols of polite human behavior, no innuendo, no threat too over the top, and no libel too despicable to be un-allowed here.
    One reaps what one sows George. I really think you originally wanted to empower an intelligent discussion of topical issues. By not supporting higher standards you have enabled the lowest standards and diminished both the usefulness and the intent of your own efforts. You have created a cesspool, a place where the worst of human nature resides.
    You have a great big Haldol laced chunk of excrement in your pool and until it is removed no one of merit will swim here.

    Like

  27. Todd Juvinall Avatar

    SteveF and MichaelA. One thing about you liberals posting here is you really stick together and no matter how nasty and mean you are to others of a opposite bent, you never criticize that behavior. That is why no one will miss you here.

    Like

  28. Gregory Avatar

    Todd, it isn’t an issue of “you liberals” sticking together, it’s just Steve and Michael.

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  29. fish Avatar
    fish

    I am not commenting here anymore [except for this brief repost] for the same reason Michael is not commenting anymore; clearly there are no comments too beyond the pale, nothing beyond the protocols of polite human behavior, no innuendo, no threat too over the top, and no libel too despicable to be un-allowed here.
    It’s called free speech not polite speech.
    God but you’re a whiny tit!

    Like

  30. Todd Juvinall Avatar

    fish, you are back! Missed you posts.
    Greg, I have yet to meet any liberals who are not like them. Therefore, my opinion is valid for me.

    Like

  31. Ryan Mount Avatar

    Wow, this clip is useful on every Nevada County blog:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uh7tgX_Uaqs
    “Brick killed a guy.”

    Like

  32. fish Avatar
    fish

    fish, you are back! Missed you posts.
    Nahh…not really Todd. My last post was pretty much it. All that remains now is to see who is right…..Michael and his claims of a “radiant socialist future” or we reactionary throwbacks. I just found it ironic that the guy who I believe was the first to start flinging the Haldol references and was never one to shrink from using STFU in his comments would drop in “Miss Manners” like to scold us for our incivility.
    As you are fond of saying…..Too Funny.

    Like

  33. Todd Juvinall Avatar

    That is why it is hard to debate them from a civility standpoint. I debated them in public forums over the years, also on radio and TV. They always go personal then when we fight back they cry like MA and BenE and take their skirts home.
    Some things never change and their “progressive” attitudes are to me quite retro.

    Like

  34. Scott Obermuller Avatar

    Wow – I’ve been a bit busy lately and missed all the fun. Don’t be too hard on Michael. He crows about how socialism is winning in this country (correct observation) yet the very folks that socialism is supposed to help are sinking deeper. The left is getting what it wanted and the sunshine and roses aren’t there. Must be the evil conservatives mucking it all up somehow. And so it descends into hate filled rants and childish insults. As we become more socialist, the poor will become more violent, as all the promises crumble. History is filled with examples of govts that try to provide for the volk what the volk should be providing for themselves.

    Like

  35. fish Avatar
    fish

    Must be the evil conservatives mucking it all up somehow.
    Don’t think that the lefty excuse factory isn’t running three shifts, 7 days a week working on this right now!

    Like

  36. Gregory Avatar

    fish, hello.
    I do apologize, I picked up Keach, Anderson and Frisch at the old TheUnion blog in discussions (a polite word for it) over global warming; it is amazing how low the discourse is over that issue. No pressure.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h8EUtB45RvE
    There is a good chance that both Obamacare and global warming will be smoldering political wrecks this time next year. The Dem faithful (who see both as the key to moral authority to get what the leftmost have always wanted) will get ever more shrill, and the GOP will do their best to overreach and lose the mushy middle.

    Like

  37. Paul Emery Avatar

    Gregory writes: “GOP will do their best to overreach and lose the mushy middle.”
    Good look at the demise of the Pubsters. Even genetic Republicans like Todd are all gooey over the Cruze types which are exactly the disease the Dems need to take the middle and reinforce their structure. Support for congress is at historic lows with dog poop even surpassing them in popularity. “What a hoot”
    “But it isn’t all bad news for the legislative body responsible for the government shutdown. American voters still hold Congress in higher esteem than the Ebola virus (by 19 percent), twerking (by only 4 percent, inside the margin of error), Anthony Weiner (27 percent) and heroin (29 percent).
    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/10/08/congress-dog-poop-hipsters-popularity_n_4065586.html

    Like

  38. Paul Emery Avatar

    More for the Toddster
    “Republicans in Congress also got record-low marks in the poll. Just 17 percent of Americans approved of the job GOP lawmakers were doing, and 74 percent disapproved. That’s the lowest approval ever in Quinnipiac’s polling, and is down from August and July this summer.
    Those surveyed also disapproved of Democrats in Congress, 60 percent to 32 percent, but that was the best approval rating Democrats have seen since May.”
    Read more: http://www.politico.com/story/2013/10/congress-approval-government-shutdown-2013-97617.html#ixzz2irG0wU2u

    Like

  39. Todd Juvinall Avatar
    Todd Juvinall

    Sp ley me get this straight Paulster. The “Congress” is both houses so I would guess you are predicting the people of America will boot the dems asses out too? My guess is you are only focused on the R’s.

    Like

  40. Todd Juvinall Avatar

    Here is question 58. and the percentahes. I think the poll is a bit flawed.
    58. Do you consider yourself part of the Tea Party movement or not?
    Tot Rep Dem Ind Men Wom Wht Blk Hsp
    Yes 12% 26% 1%
    12% 15% 10% 14% 4% 8%
    No 83 68 95 85 81 86 83 92 76
    DK/NA 4 5 4 3 4 5 4 4 16
    Wll the copy/paste doesn’t work too well on a PDF. Anyway, the TP elected 63 new people to Congress and this poll totals seem odd to me.

    Like

  41. fish Avatar
    fish

    Jeez I can’t believe I’m back to this….and in just under a week…..even Ben held out longer than that!
    Todd,
    I think what Paul is getting at is that his reading of the polls leads him to believe that the republicans are due for a slaughter in the 2014 midterms! I desperately hope he is right…so we can get something like this!
    http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2013-10-26/boldly-go-where-no-socialist-has-gone-venezuela-creates-ministry-supreme-happiness
    No toilet paper to be found anywhere…but all the feelings of “Supreme Happiness” you can swallow as dictated by the department (really….ministry….that’s so foreign) that goes by the same name! Don’t you dare be glum or you can expect a “door kicking” visit from your body armor wearing betters!

    Like

  42. rlcrabb Avatar

    I didn’t know that fish used toilet paper. You learn something new every day.

    Like

  43. Todd Juvinall Avatar

    Either I missed it or there was no breakout in the poll for location, party and gender. I’ll look again.
    Anyway, reading a lot of the questions I would suggest that both parties are held to blame by the respondents to the poll. I don’t see much of a problem for the R’s at all. The poll guy, Swartz, tries to compare the R’s with Obam,a in many of the questions and that is a foolish journey. Obama is not running, and if there is any indicator one way or the other, the people will not listen to Obama as they did not listen in 2010 and 2012 when he stumped for the D’s and they were defeated in the House and lost Senate seats.

    Like

  44. Todd Juvinall Avatar

    fish, I have a friend who is from Russia. She is 56 and grew up under the commies. She is an American citizen. I took her to her swearing in in Sac ten or so years ago. She told me they had the same problem with the lack of TP and when they got some the sandpapered their arse with it. Sort of a Sheryl Crow, one tissue country if that!

    Like

  45. fish Avatar
    fish

    I didn’t know that fish used toilet paper.
    In prosperous countries we are generally wrapped in newsprint!
    And RL really….? I post something about the establishment of a “Ministry of Supreme Happiness” and you focus solely on the toilet paper angle…..interesting.

    Like

  46. Walt Avatar

    Come on Fish,, do you need to Wiki ” sense of humor” ? I say you walked right into that one. Better check the back of your shirt while your at it. RL may have
    slipped a note through the screen when your back was turned.
    BTW Doc,, Nice bit it the local fish wrap.

    Like

  47. fish Avatar
    fish

    fish, I have a friend who is from Russia. She is 56 and grew up under the commies. She is an American citizen. I took her to her swearing in in Sac ten or so years ago. She told me they had the same problem with the lack of TP and when they got some the sandpapered their arse with it. Sort of a Sheryl Crow, one tissue country if that!
    Not familiar with the Sheryl Crow angle…..
    The whole socialist situation reminds me of the Russian Hell/American Hell joke . Two friends, one Russian, one American are killed on the same day. Not being the most upstanding individuals they both wind up in line for eternal torment and when they meet Old Scratch each are given a choice…Russian Hell or American Hell. Both men regardless of their misdeeds are patriots so the Russian guy chooses Russian hell and the American chooses American hell. They bump into each other a few weeks later and compare notes. “So, how’s American hell”? the American is asked. “Well I certainly don’t enjoy it much”, says the American. “Every morning we get up and for breakfast we have to eat a garden shovel full of shit…..but after that the rest of the day isn’t too bad……How about Russian hell”? “It’s very similar”, says the Russian….. “except we have to eat two shovels full for breakfast”! “Wow, that’s twice as bad as we’ve got it in American hell”, says the American who is secretly thrilled that his former compatriot has it worse than he does. “Yes, but remember” says the Russian….”it’s Russian hell so they are almost always out of shit or somebody forgets to bring the shovels”!
    (Thanks….I’m here all week….don’t forget to tip your waitresses!)

    Like

  48. fish Avatar
    fish

    Come on Fish,, do you need to Wiki ” sense of humor” ?
    I probably do Walt!

    Like

  49. Todd Juvinall Avatar

    fish, Sheryl Crow got on a eco trip and was chastising the country about the use of toilet paper and how it was not a good thing in the eco system. She said one tissue square was enough to wipe. She became the butt of many jokes and those that tried her advice got dirty hands. Just like JP on the nasty blog.

    Like

  50. fish Avatar
    fish

    Sheryl Crow got on a eco trip and was chastising the country about the use of toilet paper and how it was not a good thing in the eco system. She said one tissue square was enough to wipe. She became the butt of many jokes and those that tried her advice got dirty hands. Just like JP on the nasty blog.
    Ah….yeah now I vaguely remember something about this….lets just hop she is a compulsive hand washer then!

    Like

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