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George Rebane

The memory of Treyvon Martin has now been honored by everyone from the President to the punks smashing windows and setting fires to demonstrate their outrage at the acquittal of George Zimmerman and the nation’s legal system.  In doing the latter I’m tempted to join them.

TrayvonMartinAccording to our legal system as exercised in Sanford, the evidence showed that Martin was a young thug trying to bash the brains out of the man who finally shot him.  Since the shooting, both the press and the police have done their best to hide Martin’s past because he was a black minor.  Well, more than a minor.  As Zimmerman’s prosecutors characterized him, that evening Martin was an ‘apprehensive child’ trying to reach safety and the warmth of his home and family while suffering a ‘child’s worst fears’ by being ‘stalked in the night’.

Since then, a bit more has come out on the background of that child pictured nearby.  The Miami-Dade police and school authorities had to jump through hoops not to arrest the young man for burglary and possession of stolen goods.  And there’s even more coming out that you will not see in the lamestream which has spent the last year calling for Zimmerman’s head, but this blog with appropriate links is as good a place to start as any. 

So the Sanford court delivered its justice, and found that even lying down, with his head being pounded into a concrete sidewalk,  Zimmerman had every right to ‘stand’ his ground, draw his weapon, and kill Martin in order to save his own life.  But in our system of jurisprudence, one that used to eschew double jeopardy, this is not the end of it.  As we discovered in the OJ Simpson case, being acquitted of murder does not end your jeopardy.  You can be re-indicted on civil charges, just as if you had committed the act of which you were found innocent, and then be adjudicated into financial oblivion.

AntonioSantiagoBut wait, there’s more.  With the Zimmerman case we have launched into the era of triple jeopardy.  Those ever stalwart men of God and minders of the plantation, the Revs Jackson and Sharpton, have joined with the NAACP to plan a very nasty future for George Zimmerman.  First they convince Holder’s DOJ to file criminal charges against Zimmerman for violating (seat belts please) Martin’s civil rights.  And then, whether that works or not, they will go after him in a civil lawsuit a la Simpson.  And on top of that, thanks to the lamestream’s ample coverage of the acquittal and follow-on demonstrations of rage, Zimmerman will wear a bullseye on his back for a very long time.

In the meantime, Holder is pandering to the NAACP, promising to review the nation’s stand-your-ground laws as being the newly discovered basis for the (diminishing) gun violence in the land.  Oh yes, speaking of race, did anyone give a big rat’s ass for the ongoing stream of black-on-black murders in Chicago (46 blacks killed there during the trial) and other big cities in this interval.  Or did you notice all the demonstrations against the two Georgia black teen-agers who killed a baby by shooting him in the face and wounding his mother during a robbery?  Who honored the memory of 13-month-old Antonio Santiago?

I don’t think we have to look too deeply through the progressive smoke screen to see real racism practiced daily in America.

[21jul13 update – corrected]  As President Obama continues to fan the Zimmerman trial flames evident in dozens of cities across the nation, I definitely feel that he has a deeper agenda for which the trial’s verdict can serve as fuel.  Of the many statements in his “deeply personal” speech about the event that could have used a big dose of silence, he stated, “… if Trayvon Martin was of age and armed, could he have stood his ground on that sidewalk?  And do we actually think that he would have been justified in shooting Mr. Zimmerman who had followed him in a car because he felt threatened?  And if the answer to that question is at least ambiguous, then it seems to me that we might want to examine those kinds of laws.”

That he introduced the potential justification of an armed Martin shooting Zimmerman for no more than following him in a neighborhood where Zimmerman was volunteering as a member of the neighborhood watch, raises more than eyebrows.   Asking us to consider the two acts as somehow being equivalent or having an “ambiguous” answer throws the entire issue of stand your ground into a cocked hat, and goes on to support the nationwide protests already rejecting the Zimmerman verdict and looking for all manner of hypotheticals to continue focusing on race and civil rights violations as being the cause of Martin’s being shot that now requires additional judicial action.

The immediate beneficiaries of the President’s hypothetical are the attorneys for Dunn, who from his car gunned down a black teenager in another car, an unarmed teenager who had no physical contact with Dunn or made no move to threaten him (here).  Dunn’s defense before the President’s remarks was tenuous if it existed at all.  After that presidential demagoguery I can see Dunn’s attorneys dropping to their knees, raising their hands in gratitude, and shouting ‘Thank you, thank you Lord!!’

The facts of the matter, that no one wants to address about Zimmerman’s actions or that of Jesse Jackson’s equivalent assessment, are that according to DoJ statistics –
•    Blacks make up 13% of the population,
•    Since 1975 blacks have committed more than half of ALL the nation’s murders;
•    And 93% of murdered blacks were killed by blacks.

Now I know that progressives have had more than a little trouble reasoning, especially when it involves elements of numeracy – that has been academically corroborated (more here and here).  I challenge a liberal to draw the Venn diagram for that situation without first going back to ding-dong school.  Of course a few rightwingers may also struggle 😉  But if you brought the teachings of the good Reverend Bayes to bear on these statistics, then it becomes apparent that beating the drums on the Zimmerman case is an ongoing smokescreen raised by the liberal elites to hide their massive failures in social policies (economic and educational) that for the last 40 years have been promoted to help the black population.  Their effect has been exactly the opposite, beginning with the destruction of the strong black family ethic in the 1960s.

Now we holler and wail about ‘stereotyping’ and the injustice it causes.  It does no such thing when considered on an individual decision level.  As I have attempted to illuminate in these pages, stereotyping (intuiting the correct Bayesian conditional posterior probability) is one of the most powerful survival mechanisms that humans and ALL critters have evolved over the eons.  What we pejoratively label as stereotyping is fundamental to Bayesian decision making, which is demonstrably the most powerful and effective approach to dealing with problems in an uncertain environment.  And without going into the numerical weeds that surround the above quoted statistics, those numbers themselves advise an extra dose of caution when encountering a young black male on a lonely dark street, whether he be an opportunistic thug or a young neurosurgeon like Dr Ben Carson (by his own report).

Were you asked to bet you assets on the intentions of such a black man, you would wisely vote with the Rev Jesse Jackson.  Were you instead asked to bet your ass, you would definitely make a run for it before seeking any more edifying information.  And starting with the numbers, that sad state of affairs is what underlies the entire problem of racist stereotyping.  The real crime is that the national black leadership refuses to address the existential problem of the behavior of young black men staring them in the face for the last several decades.   (I was heartened to again hear Jason Riley of WSJ eloquently agree with these conclusions.)

[26jul13 update]  Bill Whittle of PJMedia presents an excellent summary of the Trayvon Martin case in this video, and contrasts it with the reprehensible ‘coverage’ given in the lamestream.

Posted in , , ,

211 responses to ““… honor the memory of Treyvon Martin.” (updated 26jul13)”

  1. George Rebane Avatar

    stevenfrisch 619pm – actually, upon further reflection, I am more convinced than ever that America’s black leadership is guilty of bestowing a horrific legacy of murder, mayhem, and utter destitution of wealth and education upon the very people that have been their charge to benefit. No progressives want to address the stats I have summarized, the killings that go on day after day and year after year. They instead focus their public outcry on a relatively insignificant case that did not even involve racism or SYG, an incident where our justice system found the charged party innocent of any crime.
    And President Obama is leading the pack of Holders, Sharptons and Jacksons, and other demagogues in bringing up racism and SYG, apparently finally in his element as a community activist. I join with those who believe it to be the latest sad chapter in what has become a perennial national disgrace.

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  2. Ben Emery Avatar
    Ben Emery

    Here is Brother Cornel West telling it the way it is. Once again a progressive is much different than a liberal democrat.
    I agree with West that Obama is talking out both sides of his mouth when talking about innocent civilians.
    Cornel West: Obama’s Response to Trayvon Martin Case Belies Failure to Challenge “New Jim Crow”
    http://www.democracynow.org/2013/7/22/cornel_west_obamas_response_to_trayvon

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  3. Ben Emery Avatar
    Ben Emery

    Here is Malcolm X thoughts on house vs field slaves. It seems like many here want people of color to happy with being a house slave/ negro.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=znQe9nUKzvQ

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  4. Todd Juvinall Avatar

    If Obama and the race hustlers like Sharpton wanted to stop black on black violence they would simply start saying so. Then they could take all that extorted money they receive for “labor peace” in major corporations (also just hush money), and start using it for inner city work. But, Jesse Jackson is too busy boinking his staff and having kids out of wedlock to have any moral grounds to tell those 13 year old girls not to have sex.
    We can get along but the attempts of government to force the races to get along have failed. I believe it is the lefty policies on welfare and the thousands of other handouts that have wrecked the black family. There are examples of black men and women making it out of the ghetto and into the suburbs but their brethren in the ghetto call them “uncle toms” and worse. Just read Clarence Thomas or Thomas Sowell and get a taste of what ignorant blacks in the hood do to the successful blacks of America. It will take a lot of work by the successful blacks to convince the hoodie blacks that selling meth and crack are not the way to success and long life.

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  5. George Rebane Avatar

    ToddJ 909am – Well said Todd.

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  6. Gregory Avatar

    So Ben, how can one be an “innocent civilian” while committing a felonious assault and battery? Innocence is also usually not connected with multiple school suspensions.
    West claims “George Zimmerman is a criminal”, which is quite literally false. Zimmerman was being battered by West’s “innocent civilian” and it was evidence of that battery that kept Zimmerman out of prison.

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  7. George Rebane Avatar

    I do believe that this dialogue has now robustly overstepped the reasonable bounds of assessing justice, guilt, innocense, …, and resides firmly in the domain of progressive politics. There the Zimmerman case is the latest piece of obfuscating fodder for the leftwing elites to distract the nation from the real problems of what creates and preserves the black underclass among whose dominant statistics are those cited in this post. Rehearsing versions and interpretations of the Zimmerman-Martin scenario is to avoid the real issue, and its potential solutions which lie far from realms such as ‘racism’ or ‘stand your ground’. It is a pointless side show.

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  8. Todd Juvinall Avatar

    George you are truly right. There is nothing in the facts that will ever change the mind of people like BenE. He is an ideologue of the liberal left and they have their own Bible of truth. That Bible is based on emotion and has nothing to do with reality.
    Zimmerman was a “neighborhood watch” volunteer whose job was to tour his area,report and assist in the protection of his neighborhood. He was wholly within his rights to walk in his neighborhood looking for those that do not belong there. He was just doing his volunteer job. I would suppose BenE might become a volunteer watch fellow if his neighborhood was getting burgled and theft was rampant. Well, err, maybe not. He would just call those hated officers of the law. Ya think?

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  9. Ben Emery Avatar
    Ben Emery

    Greg,
    Ok, your understanding of the bigger issue is extremely retarded. So yes greg in the way the laws that are set up today Zimmerman was within the law especially when the other party is dead and cannot give a different perspective of the events that took place that deadly night. The problem lie in the way the laws and public policies are written and for whom they benefit. All the statistics in the world cannot dispute that 100% of the laws and policies that have been passed at the state and federal since the ratification of the US Constitution are passed by white male majority therefore having a white male perspective on every law. This doesn’t mean all white males are bigots or racists it means they can only perceive the world as a white male. Just as West, Jackson, and Sharpton can only have the perception of a black male. The one thing I do notice is that these figures are all male as well, which comes to another topic of media coverage and women representation in the world of power. The first US Senator of color is a perfect example of law doesn’t equate to justice, equality, or morality. He was from Mississippi and it turned out it was against Mississippi law for blacks to hold public office and his term lasted just over a year.
    How can President Obama claim to be on the side of justice when he commits crimes of epic proportions on a weekly basis? That is the point and the point of my putting forward Cornel West is to expose the difference between progressives and liberals, which there are great differences. Just as there are in conservative and libertarian. Some agreements but just as many disagreements so to broad brush everybody as progressive or conservative is playing right into the game of we have two choices. Right now we have conservatives and corporatists in our federal government and very few true liberal and even less progressives. The corporatists are using the tool of obstruction to destroy any public good or trust so the alternative is diving head first into fascism/ corporatism. It is working very well I might add.

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  10. George Rebane Avatar

    BenE 1235pm – who in your political menagerie supports “fascism”? And what is “corporatism”?

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  11. Todd Juvinall Avatar

    I would suggest BenE do some digging into Stand Your Ground laws and he might find a passel of black legislators voted for it in their states. What a hoot!

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  12. Russ Steele Avatar

    Zimmerman Backlash Continues Thanks to Media Misinformation
    Cathy Young writing at Reason.com:
    This narrative has transformed Zimmerman, a man of racially mixed heritage that included white, Hispanic and black roots (a grandmother who helped raise him had an Afro-Peruvian father), into an honorary white male steeped in white privilege. It has cast him as a virulent racist even though he once had a black business partner, mentored African-American kids, lived in a neighborhood about 20 percent black, and participated in complaints about a white police lieutenant’s son getting away with beating a homeless black man.
    This narrative has perpetuated the lie that Zimmerman’s history of calls to the police indicates obsessive racial paranoia. Thus, discussing the verdict on the PBS NewsHour, University of Connecticut professor and New Yorker contributor Jelani Cobb asserted that “Zimmerman had called the police 46 times in previous six years, only for African-Americans, only for African-American men.” Actually, prior to the call about Martin, only four of Zimmerman’s calls had to do with African-American men or teenage boys (and two of them were about individuals who Zimmerman thought matched the specific description of burglary suspects). Five involved complaints about whites, and one about two Hispanics and a white male; others were about such issues as a fire alarm going off, a reckless driver of unknown race, or an aggressive dog.
    In this narrative, even Zimmerman’s concern for a black child—a 2011 call to report a young African-American boy walking unsupervised on a busy street, on which the police record notes, “compl[ainant] concerned for well-being”—has been twisted into crazed racism. Writing on the website of The New Republic, Stanford University law professor Richard Thompson Ford describes Zimmerman as “an edgy basket case” who called 911 about “the suspicious activities of a seven year old black boy.” This slander turns up in other left-of-center sources, such as ThinkProgress.org.

    It appears some of the progressives commenting here have been reading the lefty blogs, which are distrorting the facts.

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  13. Ben Emery Avatar
    Ben Emery

    George,
    I will take your question as rhetorical.
    Russ,
    You better watch out Greg G is going to point out how you don’t understand the proper definition of “spam”.

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  14. Ben Emery Avatar
    Ben Emery

    Todd,
    I suggest you look into where/ who outlined the model legislation? NRA and ALEC.
    How the NRA and Its Allies Helped Spread a Radical Gun Law Nationwide
    http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2012/06/nra-alec-stand-your-ground

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  15. stevenfrisch Avatar
    stevenfrisch

    Dear Ben, I am seriously considering forming a Nevada County Neighborhood Watch (NCNW) program. You see I am increasingly concerned about the rising crime rate, and a loss of local constitutional authority, particularly about the enforcement of local laws like the Nevada County marijuana cultivation laws, that I believe are in conflict with state laws. In addition, the incidents of civil rights violations, voting rights violations, violations of California’s Fair Political Practices Act. Cases of libel, and intimidation of public bodies appears to be rising as well. Since we the people are sovereign we have a right to protect our rights. Now although many of these things may have national causes, I believe the only way to counter them is for empowered citizens to exercise their right to keep and bear arms in armed neighborhood watch programs. This NCNW program would use only legal methods of following, tracking and recording activities of subversive right wing elements in Nevada County who are the group most likely to engage in these nefarious activities. We would scrupulously follow the letter of the law; but if these elements object and confront us over perceived invasions of their privacy and profiling, and we feel threatened, we could just shoot them with the Kel-Tec PF-9 9mm pistol that each neighborhood watch participant would be trained to use and carry legally.
    After all, all we need is a few good volunteers to enforce the laws. There is no need to consider proportional response to a perceived threat!
    [This is of course an entirely hypothetical entreaty….I in no way support armed neighborhood watch programs]
    There is a reason we have police officers, and a reason when they say, no, do not follow, stay in your car, we are supposed to follow their instructions.

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  16. stevenfrisch Avatar
    stevenfrisch

    By the way, what all of this discussion seems to miss is the fact that there is absolutely no evidence that Mr. Martin was up to anything nefarious, or was doing anything other than walking back to his fathers house, when Mr. Zimmerman began following him. Even if it was true that Mr. Zimmerman suspected him of something else, how could any rational observer say that the Florida law that allows an armed neighborhood watch volunteer to confront Mr. Martin, and resort to deadly force when he perceives threat, worked out they way it was supposed to, or led to a reasonable outcome?
    At a minimum this event should cause any rational person to question whether the law and the legal system supporting it worked. It clearly did not. A teenager was killed carrying iced tea and skittles. That is not a reasonable outcome as a result of the law. Thus, even if we accept the verdict, the law clearly allows for this sort of ‘mistake’. The law itself (both the law that allows carry by someone like Zimmerman and the law that allows for ‘stand your ground’) should now be the issue under question.

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  17. George Rebane Avatar

    stevenfrisch 911am++ – Thanks again for that excellent rendition of Exhibit A showcasing the utter disconnect between the liberal version of what happened, and how you and the nation’s lamestream want to represent the Florida tragedy. The discussion of the case in these pages has missed none of what you claim, which again highlights the disconnect.
    You reject the court’s verdict, the fact that SYG was not a factor (and neither was any tinge of racism), and that no police officer gave Zimmerman any order at any time before Martin confronted Zimmerman. You clearly are the local lackey singing the song composed by the Jacksons and Sharptons of the land. Your ‘facts’ on the matter are ones freshly minted to fit the progressive narrative.

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  18. stevenfrisch Avatar
    stevenfrisch

    Posted by: George Rebane | 28 July 2013 at 09:42 AM
    All one has to do to realize that ‘stand your ground’ played a role in this case is read the jury instructions George.
    I don’t have to have an opinion on the verdict to understand that the law as enforced did not work the way it was intended to.
    And of course you are correct, no ‘police officer’ told Zimmerman to stay in his car, a 911 dispatcher did. I guess we can just disregard those instructions if we are carrying a weapon and decide we want to act on our own volition.

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  19. George Rebane Avatar

    stevenfrisch 951am – you continue to amaze but not surprise. There were no “instructions” given to Zimmerman by 911, as revealed during the trial. From the 911 transcript –
    Dispatcher: Are you following him?
    Zimmerman: Yeah
    Dispatcher: Ok, we don’t need you to do that.

    http://pdf.911dispatch.com.s3.amazonaws.com/zimmerman_call_affidavit.pdf

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  20. stevenfrisch Avatar
    stevenfrisch

    Man kills boy after being told by 911 dispatcher not to follow him… I don’t know how much clearer it could be.
    Armed neighborhood watch kills unarmed teenager with skittles and iced tea. I don’t know how much clearer it could be.
    Any rational person would ask themselves, “Did the law work as intended here?”
    We will never agree on this, but you should be ashamed of your inability to question whether or not this was a reasonable outcome.

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  21. Ben Emery Avatar
    Ben Emery

    To my over all point on this thread, we don’t sit in a vacuum but rather stand on the shoulders of those who came before us. It doesn’t matter whether the shoulders were good or bad. History effects the present and as white males the history of the United States has very much benefited white males in every aspect of life.
    Here is some context of the Silent Protest on 1917. 28 July 2013 at 10:12 AM
    Even if those who have white privilege don’t want to admit it this kind of events that happened on a daily basis, which assured them that privilege.
    http://gworksharlem.blogspot.com/2007/10/silent-protest-of-1917.html
    Excerpt
    “The riot in East St. Louis began when white men , angry because African Americans were employed by a factory holding government contracts, went on a rampage. Over $400,000. worth of property was destroyed. At least 40 African American were killed; and men, women and children were beaten, stabbed, hung and burned. Almost 6,000 African American were driven from their homes.”

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  22. Ben Emery Avatar
    Ben Emery

    George, 28 July 2013 at 10:06 AM
    Dispatcher: Are you following him?
    Zimmerman: Yeah
    Dispatcher: Ok, we don’t need you to do that.
    Did Zimmerman stop following him or did he ignore the dispatch and continue stalking the unarmed teenager who was doing nothing wrong?
    This is where racism plays a huge role in this case. To a person prejudice against people of color a black teenager walking down the street is suspicious but if it were a white women doing the exact same thing nothing would have been suspected. As far as I know 100% of Zimmerman’s calls to 911 in his time as a self appointed neighborhood watch captain were about people of color.
    Also, have you found that Zimmerman was registered and part of a legitimate neighborhood watch? I have not and stick with my description of self appointed neighborhood watch captain. This self appointed neighborhood watch captain took the law into his unqualified hands and an innocent civilian is now dead.

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  23. George Rebane Avatar

    stevenfrisch 1021am – the beat goes on. The case was not made during the trial that 911 “told” Zimmerman not to follow Martin for the simple reason that prosecution could not claim from either the audio or the transcript that any explicit ‘instruction’ had been given to Zimmerman.
    This was corroborated numerous times in the media citing 911 officials explaining that 911 policy prohibits dispatchers from explicitly instructing callers at the other end for the simple reasons that they don’t know the full situation, and that they become liable when callers claim to have followed instructions and the outcome was bad.
    In this case, it is only the vapid narrative promoted by the left that requires the inclusion of ‘911 instructions’, and then add a dollop of gratuitous shame on those who don’t see it their way. BTW, you missed my explicit views on the “reasonable outcome” of this encounter. Given that when shot Martin was in the process of killing Zimmerman, the outcome was tragic yet most reasonable, as I have maintained here and elsewhere. There is no “inability to question” involved on my part.

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  24. Ben Emery Avatar
    Ben Emery

    George, 28 July 2013 at 10:40 AM
    This self appointed neighborhood watch captain took the law into his unqualified hands and an innocent civilian is now dead.

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  25. Ken Jones Avatar
    Ken Jones

    George you make the claim that Martin was in the process of killing Zimmerman. This is not true because the only individual making this claim ended up killing the other individual that could counter this argument. Zimmerman didn’t need stitches, didn’t even go to the hospital until the next day. All Zimmerman had to do was let the police do their jobs and take the advice of the 911 dispatcher. Hardly reasonable, just irrational logic from both George’s.
    What needed to happen was for both individuals to call 911 and heed the instructions allowing law enforcement to resolve the issue. I would expect an adult to use better judgement than a teenager, in this case a couple bad decisions proved fatal to a kid.

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  26. George Rebane Avatar

    KenJ 1129am – the court did not agree with you.

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  27. Ken Jones Avatar
    Ken Jones

    The court didn’t find Zimmerman guilty due to a lack of evidence on murder or manslaughter. The court never stated that Martin was in the “process of killing Zimmerman” that is your contention. The evidence only showed that the two men were engaged in some type of altercation and during this time Zimmerman killed Martin. The jury believed that Zimmerman felt he was in immediate danger. That is a huge difference than being in the process of killing. Just a specious argument on your behalf.

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  28. George Rebane Avatar

    KenJ 102pm – Wrong again. Zimmerman claimed that Martin was in the process of killing him. The jury agreed with Zimmerman, and definitely would not have condoned the killing of Martin if they believed that the two were just “engaged in some type of altercation”. The evidence presented was sufficient to corroborate Zimmerman’s claim, warrant the jury’s conclusion and the follow-on finding. That is the record of jurisprudence in the manner – the add on here and in the lamestream is simply ideology driven progressive claptrap. (Also see the 28jul13 update to ‘Atheists need …’)

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  29. Todd Juvinall Avatar

    Ken Jones says above “The jury believed that Zimmerman felt he was in immediate danger.”
    Yes immediate danger of being killed. It amazes me how far the liberal parses things for some emotional advantage. Frisch, BenE and now Ken Jones must be truly slow on the uptake. It appears according to the article Russ Steele cited earlier that Zimmenrman’s Grandma was 1/2 black so all you libs can now disregard the whole thing and concentrate on the 36 black on black murders in Chicago in the week of the trial.

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  30. stevenfrisch Avatar
    stevenfrisch

    Wow Todd, If I had known George Zimmerman is an Octoroon (a term still in legal use in my lifetime) my entire opinion of this case would have been different.

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  31. Ken Jones Avatar
    Ken Jones

    All you have is Zimmerman’s testimony, because Martin was killed and thus unable to testify. You have no idea the intentions of Martin, just as I have no idea of Zimmerman’s intentions. The jury acquitted Zimmerman of murder and manslaughter, the jury never agreed tha Martin was in the process of killing Zimmerman.
    Todd anything you said is just moot, I don’ t have speck of respect for you and your screwed up mind.

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  32. George Rebane Avatar

    KenJ 514pm – You apparently have refused to address my 223pm nor accept the court’s verdict. Specifically, on what basis did the jury acquit Zimmerman other than he killed Martin to save his own life? Most certainly he was not acquitted from taking another’s life for any reason less than that.

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  33. Russ Steele Avatar

    Ken J @05:14
    According Martin’s girl friend he was going to give Zimmerman some “whoop ass”, in other words a beating. According to the girl friend, it was all Zimmerman’s fault because he did not know that “whoop ass” was just a beating, not a killing. I am wondering if you were in Zimmerman’s place would you know the difference between just being “whooped ass” vs killed? How would you have responded with your head being banged on the concrete in just some whooped ass-ing? Really?

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  34. Ben Emery Avatar
    Ben Emery

    Boys, the bottom line is Zimmerman profiled Martin because he was a black male in the neighborhood. If a blonde 17 year young woman was walking in the neighborhood dressed the same way Zimmerman would have not found her suspicious enough to follow her or call 9/11. Did Zimmerman have intent on killing Martin, I don’t think so. Did Zimmerman have intent of intimidating and bullying Martin, you better believe he did.

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  35. Ken Jones Avatar
    Ken Jones

    George I addressed your 2:23, the jury found Zimmerman innocent of murder and manslaughter, just as I stated. The jury did not state that Martin was in the process of killing Zimmerman, you made that statement. There wasn’t sufficient evidence to convict Zimmerman. I do accept the verdict George, the prosecution did a dismal job of proving their case. That is the system of due process.
    Russ ever stop to think that if Zimmerman stayed in his car and heeded the advice to not follow Martin then this would have never happened? No whup ass needed if George would have made a better decision. Martin made an equally stupid decision as well. The difference, one is a kid the other an adult. Root cause would place the blame squarely on Zimmerman Russ.
    If I saw a individual that was suspect I would call the police and let them do their job and not play wannabe cop. Much safer and smarter.

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  36. stevenfrisch Avatar
    stevenfrisch

    Posted by: Ken Jones | 28 July 2013 at 06:24 PM
    Ah, Ken the handwriting is on the wall. You just make too much sense for this locale. Next you will be labeled a stupid, collectivist, Sheeple, with no sense of what it means to preserve Amerikan culture.
    That’s just how they roll here!

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  37. Todd Juvinall Avatar

    The resident liberals are truly hopeless. BenE says Zimmerman profiled Martin. Though I could care less if he did (I think the cops need to profile) profile him there is no proof and BenE cannot supply any. So, just another lefty liar.
    Jones refuses to accept that Martin was acquitted of shooting the fellow in self defense. That shows me he should never serve on an American jury.
    SteveF is simply the same old bozo we all know.

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  38. George Rebane Avatar

    It is hopeless indeed (sigh).

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  39. Todd Juvinall Avatar

    Read this news story and tell us the race of the victim. Well, you have to guess because it is nowhere to be found. The perps in Baltimore are all of the black race and I wonder if BenE and the other libs here will have the same outrage as they do for Martin. My guess is probably not.
    http://baltimore.cbslocal.com/2013/07/26/mob-of-teens-brutally-attack-man-in-heart-of-little-italy/

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  40. Ben Emery Avatar
    Ben Emery

    Todd,
    You have no clue what the objections are in the Martin case do you? Zimmerman isn’t a cop he just likes playing one. He was a self appointed neighborhood watch captain vigilante who has proven in the worst possible way that neighborhood watches around the US should not be armed.
    George Zimmerman not a member of recognized neighborhood watch organization
    by Alexis Garrett Stodghill
    “When 28-year-old George Zimmerman was discovered by Sanford, Florida police standing over the body of 17-year-old Trayvon Martin, they accepted Zimmerman’s claim that he killed in self-defense as a neighborhood watch captain. Now, through a statement released by the National Sheriffs’ Association (NSA) — the parent organization of USAonWatch-Neighborhood Watch — it has been revealed that Zimmerman was not a member of any group recognized by the organization. Zimmerman violated the central tenets of Neighborhood Watch by following Martin, confronting him and carrying a concealed weapon.
    “In no program that I have ever heard of does someone patrol with a gun in their pocket,” Carmen Caldwell, the Executive Director of Citizens’ Crime Watch of Miami-Dade, told theGrio. “Every city and municipality has their own policies. Here in Miami-Dade we train people only to be the eyes and ears of their communities. Not to follow and most definitely not to carry a weapon.”
    Despite this, Zimmerman admitted that he had fired a weapon on the night of the incident. In addition, the non-emergency call Zimmerman placed on February 26 before the shooting revealed he had been pursuing Martin by car before accosting the youth on foot — all direct violations of Neighborhood Watch policies.”
    Zimmerman isn’t a cop he just likes playing one. He was a self appointed neighborhood watch captain vigilante who proves that neighborhood watches around the US should not be armed.”

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  41. Ben Emery Avatar
    Ben Emery

    George, spam filtered once again. Greg that one is for you. [Hauled out your 810am from the spam bucket, hope that covers it. gjr]

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  42. stevenfrisch Avatar
    stevenfrisch

    Posted by: Todd Juvinall | 29 July 2013 at 07:53 AM
    Total bullcrap Todd, and by extension George for his ‘update’. Just because some of us believe that the Martin case had racial overtones, and that race played a part in the verdict, does not mean that any of us are any less mindful or repulsed by senseless crime against anybody. This is a red herring argument intended to spread ‘guilt by association’. All crimes are crimes; all are bad; all are equally repulsive; regardless of the race of the perpetrators or the victims; and nothing anyone here has said diminishes that.

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  43. George Rebane Avatar

    stevenfrisch 816am – Z kills M in self defense = managed nationwide rage; 13 illegals rape little girl = managed crickets. “All crimes are crimes; all are bad; all are equally repulsive;…”, my, my, are they now? No Steve, in my book you and yours do stand guilty by association.

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  44. Ben Emery Avatar
    Ben Emery

    George,
    I will sum it up in a sentence of the divide we are having. We are talking about Justice and you guys are talking about the Law.
    Laws aren’t always Just.

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  45. Todd Juvinall Avatar

    Excellent points George. SteveF and BenE are simply lackeys for the race hustlers. There is no extended rage in this posts for black on white crime. None for latino on anyone crime. They are simply fools and their protestations about equal opportunity crime is hokum.
    BenE, you simply have it all wrong. The DailyKos and its literary pals are just stirring up your inner passions to hate yourself because you are a white person. You should practice what I do and that is love for all mankind. BenE you should not be such a self hating Caucasian. You either Stevie Boy. All races are human beings, even you two (well almost) yet you live in the cesspool of self hate. I would suggest BenE that you read other information sources on the Z/M case. You are sure stuck in the mire of ignorance about it and perhaps a good dose of National Review would help in you malaise of intelligent discourse.

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  46. Todd Juvinall Avatar

    Oh and Stevie Boy, what is your opinion on the attack in Baltimore regarding the racial aspect? 10 “children” attacking and all against one “victim”

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  47. George Rebane Avatar

    BenE 907am – Good summary of what has powered the divide in our Z/M views. The complicating reality is that justice is neither empirical nor absolute; its statement and interpretation are subjective. While agreeing with your general tenet that the lawful and just don’t always fly in tight formation, in this case easily half of America (including me) thought that they did. Can we leave it there?

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  48. Ben Emery Avatar
    Ben Emery

    Todd,
    You have no idea what you saying? You like to believe, when convenient to your argument, that everything is a single issue separate from other factors. You couldn’t be more wrong. George should know better as a person who is very familiar with variables. Outcomes aren’t a single product but many variables that lead to the outcome.

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  49. George Rebane Avatar

    BenE 1027am – “George should know better…” Huh? Is this a gratuitous slap, or are you off the rails again?

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