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November 2011
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[This article on Agenda 21, emphasizing its history in the US, was sent to me by Judi Caler, co-founder of Reclaiming our American Rights (ROAR!).  It was also published in the Nov 2011 edition of the CABPRO News.  gjr]

Judi Caler

Several months ago, a young Executive Director of a community nonprofit volunteered to help a Grass Valley citizens group approach our local elected officials in order to affect public policy on an important issue. Having been a lobbyist and political activist in the past, I didn’t think I would learn anything new. I was wrong.

Peoples’ lives are being hijacked, compliments of the United Nations and their Agenda 21 (AKA Sustainable Development); our young people, products of our public “educational” system, don’t understand how representative government was intended to work by the founders of our country. They have been indoctrinated to accept without question what is imposed upon them, and also to help impose that doctrine upon others.

Agenda 21 is the 1992 United Nations plan for the global elite to control every facet of our lives—what we have, what we do, where we live, where we go, what we eat, etc. President George H.W. Bush signed Agenda 21 for the United States along with the leaders of 178 other nations. It was deliberately designed as a non-binding “soft law” document, not a treaty, so as to avoid the Senate confirmation process.

President Clinton followed up by creating the President’s Council on Sustainable Development (PCSD) by Executive Order in 1993 for the purpose of implementing Agenda 21 in the United States. He thus laid the foundation to restructure our political process to conform to a one world government.

To further carry out Agenda 21, President Obama, by Executive Order in June 2011 established the White House Rural Council to exercise control over rural America in education, food supply, land use, water use, recreation, property, energy, and the lives of 16% of the U.S. population.

The PCSD produced “Toward A Sustainable America” in 1999. Among its 16 “We Believe” statements is Number 8:

“We need a new collaborative decision process that leads to better decisions; more rapid change; and more sensible use of human, natural and financial resources in achieving our goals.”

In other words, the constitution was getting in the way of their plans. The “old” political process involved private citizens lobbying their local elected officials to adopt policy; vigorous open debate on both sides; and an eventual public vote by elected officials. Sustainable Development couldn’t take hold across America if this process were allowed to continue. And so the “consensus” or “visioning” process was born.

The consensus process bypasses local government officials, and cumbersome argument and debate; early participants are handpicked and friendly. Through stakeholder meetings, the public is given the impression that a broad spectrum of the community’s citizenry is engaged.

A typical stakeholder meeting is run by a highly trained, highly paid facilitator. His or her job is to drive a consensus sympathetic to the desired outcome of the project and marginalize any opposition. Stakeholders are persons or groups with no legal interest in the property in question, such as environmental nonprofits, dictating the use of that property to the owner. Shills are sometimes hired to join in the “consensus.”

The new process is most often accompanied by a government grant that local elected officials rarely reject, especially if the local community has been told that the grant is awarded to help usher in “sustainability.” Organizations such as the American Planning Association are provided funding to produce plans and procedures that are ready-made for local governing bodies to approve.

Only after the plan is essentially developed is the governing body called upon to give it the force of law by a formal vote. If the governing bodies do not vote as expected, the threat of a lawsuit is not uncommon. Once the new decision-making process has been established, it can be used to develop policy in all areas embraced by sustainable development, i.e. economics, social justice, education and the environment.

There can be no accountability to the people when public policy is developed by government-funded advocacy groups, administrators or bureaucrats. Individual freedom is lost as property rights are eroded. Local authority is thus removed from elected officials, and control moves up to the regional or state level or higher. Top-down government management of local communities is achieved.

To find Agenda 21 operating in your community, watch for the buzzwords (partial list): sustainable, social justice, smart growth, public/private partnership, common good, collaborative, vision/visioning, affordable, livable, walkable, consensus, stakeholder, International, regional, endangered species…

Reclaiming Our American Rights (ROAR!) is a Nevada County citizens group fighting Agenda 21. We have available a new slide show presentation entitled “What Is Sustainable Development?” It is intended as an introduction to Agenda 21, a subject we need to understand if our freedoms are to survive. To join ROAR or to arrange a showing for your group, big or small, please contact us at unagenda21@hotmail.com.

Judi Caler lives in Nevada City. She founded AnimalSave and co-founded ROAR!

Posted in , ,

102 responses to “Local Government—An Oxymoron?!”

  1. Mike Thornton Avatar

    That’s great Judy!
    So, where are those Agenda 21 camps?
    I mean outside you’re apparently conspiracy filled mind, that is?

    Like

  2. Marillyn Ratliff Avatar
    Marillyn Ratliff

    Judi, Great article. Thank you. Agenda 21 is like the fog, it creeps in on you when you aren’t looking. Property rights are the basis to our way of life. Take that away and we no longer have a republic.

    Like

  3. George Rebane Avatar

    MikeT 443pm – You continue to ring true to form. No one has implied a conspiracy re Agenda 21. It is, after all, one of the most visibly promoted programs of collective action internationally. That this continues to elude you, as apparent from your tiresome cutesy queries, is a wonder, but further testimony to the workings of the liberal mind. Why don’t you give this tack a rest, and see if you can contribute to the pros and cons of the evidence that non-conspiratorial activism at all levels is contributing to the implementation of the documented tenets of Agenda 21. Hammering on the “Agenda 21 camps” is below you; but then again, I may be wrong.

    Like

  4. Russ Steele Avatar

    George,
    Thanks for the brain tickler, I remember hearing about Delphi, but could not put a finger on where I heard about it. Now I remember at TRW I went to a presentation on how a TRW group was using AI and Delphi to develop a method to capture all the community and public concerns about the movement of nuclear waste to a storage facility in Nevada. Of course, due to Harry Reid we do not have a storage facility. But, at the time TRW wanted do figure out how to get the communities, that the waste would pass through, to agree on the process, procedures and safety method to be used to prevent protests. The slick part was the use of AI to mine the data collected under Delphi.

    Like

  5. Scott Obermuller Avatar

    Land zoning and land use is fine in theory, but is now nothing more than a racket wherein the powers that be can, with the pen, reduce your holdings to nothing or make you a millionaire. A good friend of mine bought 2 lots for a total of about 5 acres just outside of Elk Grove around 1976. One of the houses on the other parcel was a wreck and it took them 6 months to get rid of the dead beat renters. Those scum never paid him a dime in rent, but were happy to make use of the legal aid he had to pay for to fight him in court over their “rights” to live for free in his house. He then obtained a permit and had the fire department do a training burn to get rid of the main structure. After a couple of years, he and his wife had saved enough to build a house on the other parcel. When he tried to obtain a permit, the county worker told him there was already a house on that parcel, and he would not be able to build another house there. He showed her the permit to raze the existing structure as well as the copies of the deeds to 2 separate parcels. “Oh – well, there’s the problem” she said. “Once you got rid of the house on that parcel, we combined the two parcels as you didn’t petition us to do otherwise”. That’s right, folks. The govt – without notice or warning – screwed him over and his lawyer told him there was nothing he could do. The county didn’t have to tell him what they were going to do or provide him with any warning. After a few years went by, there were subdivisions everywhere around his property, but he was told that his land was “rural” and he could not subdivide at all. He gave up and moved. You know the rest of the story. A look at Google Earth now shows a shopping center where his home and “rural” property was. It went from rural to shopping center right after he sold and the new owner displayed the proper “paperwork” to those in power. Govt control of land use is nothing more than a scam and a con. It’s all crooked as far as I can tell. The old Bohemia Mill is industrial, but the owners can’t actually do any industry there because the home owners nearby don’t want any noise or activity, even though they knew they were moving next to an industrial area. Land use decisions are all payola or politics. There is no due process or property rights of any kind.
    Remember- smart growth is my house – urban sprawl is your house. And I decide which is which.

    Like

  6. Greg Goodknight Avatar
    Greg Goodknight

    Csn someone tell me what the local, state, US and international enviros would be doing regarding “sustainability” if Agenda 21 didn’t exist?
    Sorry, I just don’t get where Agenda 21 is anything other than the usual suspects doing their usual thing. Sustainability should disappear as a motive force once ‘global warming’ disappears as a political issue. All we need is the current trajectory of the science to continue and the temps to continue trending lower.

    Like

  7. Todd Juvinall Avatar
    Todd Juvinall

    Back in the mid 90’s when I was running CABPRO there came into being a federal program about forests. Now we all know the feds have a lot of forests but this was a new and additional program for forests. They were trying to foist an additional level of scrutiny and permitting and “connectivity” on all the forests since I guess they didn’t believe all the rules and regulations already in existence were enough. anyway they, to their credit held workshops all over the state and I went to two. There was me and 20 Sierra Clubbers and some other eco’s. I asked the feds why they were doing this and it was apparent in their discussion they were trying to implement some international program for forests. Well, I put up a lot of protests and so did the Blue Ribbon Coalition and many others from the Wise Use Movement (We were not a member but the local eco nuts thought we were) and the feds decided to kill it. They were shocked there was opposition. We know the program is on some shelf to this day and will be resurrected when no one is looking. Anyway, the world belongs to those that turn out.

    Like

  8. Mike Thornton Avatar

    George:
    You guys (rightwing regressives) have been using the same tired “conspiracy” theories for over a hundred years, to frighten and organize the troops. Any good conspiracy has enough true in it to make is (somewhat) plausible. It’s just tiring to see the same old $!#+ recycled over and over and over, with only the names changed.
    You guys will be on to another conspiracy when this one plays out and then another one after that.
    It’s what you do!

    Like

  9. Todd Juvinall Avatar
    Todd Juvinall

    George it appears MikeT doesn’t believe there was a life of=r death struggle between America and communism in the last century. I would appear he would have never defensed this country against those threats because he seems to think it was all a conspiracy of rightwing extremists! Amazing.

    Like

  10. George Rebane Avatar

    MikeT 806am – I do believe that your comment has now completely confirmed your reading skills and will remain as testimony to same. (For the casual reader, MikeT is responding to my 603pm.)
    GregG 854pm – Actually Agenda 21 calls for surprisingly more ‘smart growth’ and restrictions of liberties, lands access, and economic activity than is usually perceived or attributed by the wo/man-in-the-street to the garden variety environmental movement in the US. But yes, the “international enviros” have been at it for a long time since Agenda 21 is about 20 years old. That’s why one might confuse it with the same old same old. And in the final analysis, it’s not the age of the effort that matters, but what it is doing to us. So you don’t have to see these things under a unifying umbrella, but just resist them individually.

    Like

  11. Todd Juvinall Avatar
    Todd Juvinall

    I am surprised that GregG would pooh-pooh Agenda 21 which is an actual Resolution of action by the UN and then overlook the IPCC conclusions which have driven AGW from the confines of the UN. One is no different than the other. Both activities have wormed there way into even the General Plans of out little county.

    Like

  12. Judi Caler Avatar
    Judi Caler

    Good questions, Greg 11/6, 8:54 PM. Agenda 21 is a synonym for Sustainable Development and was written in order to advance the cause of a one world government run by a ruling elite. It purports to affect every facet of our lives, and it cannot coexist with our Constitution and freedom. The plan has been around for a very long time (which is WHY the story doesn’t change, Mike). The global elite created the League of Nations and, when that failed, the United Nations to do their bidding. The first time the term ‘Sustainable Development’ was used was in another UN document, Our Common Future, released in 1987.
    Yes, “sustainable” (i.e. government-approved everything) should disappear if man-made global warming is exposed as the hoax that it is. That’s why they won’t drop the façade. They all know it is a hoax (see quotes below). Using their usual semantic tricks, they changed the name to ‘climate change,’ as it became apparent the earth might be cooling. In the early 1960’s, the global elite tried to unite everyone under the banner of “disarmament” for the same purpose. That didn’t work out well because of the cold war. They needed another excuse for a one world government, and thus the environmental movement was co-opted. It isn’t about the environment; it is about control. H.L. Mencken said “the urge to save humanity is almost always a false front for the urge to rule.” This is exactly the case here.
    All this would be laughable if they weren’t so close to achieving their goal by implementing sustainable development locally in every county in America. Through the consensus and visioning processes, our representative form of government has been undermined. Add to this, Obama’s Executive Order #13575 which created the White House Rural Council (June 9, 2011) to exercise control over rural America in education, food supply, land use, water use, recreation, property, energy, and the lives of 16% of the U.S. population. The most significant tools for taking our land and property rights to date have been the Endangered Species Act, conservation easements and land acquisitions from so-called “willing” sellers, as referenced in the sad comment by Scott Obermuller. Other means are through road closings, the destruction of dams and the UN World Heritage Sites. The Forest Service is helping with much of this, Todd.
    Without the climate change “catastrophe” there would be no excuse to steal our freedom in the name of saving humanity. So don’t think it will fall apart when temperatures cool.
    Check out these quotes:
    “…In searching for a new enemy to unite us, we came up with the idea that pollution, the threat of global warming, water shortages, famine and the like would fit the bill. All these dangers are caused by human intervention, and it is only through changed attitudes and behavior that they can be overcome. The real enemy then, is humanity itself.” –Club of Rome, premier environmental think-tank, consultants to the UN.
    “We need to get some broad based support to capture the public’s imagination…So we have to offer up scary scenarios, make simplified, dramatic statements and make little mention of any doubts…Each of us has to decide what the right balance is between being effective and being honest.” –Prof. Stephen Schneider, Stanford Professor of Climatology, lead author of many IPCC reports.
    “We’ve got to ride this global warming issue. Even if the theory of global warming is wrong, we will be doing the right thing in terms of economic and environmental policy.” –Timothy Wirth, President of the UN Foundation.
    “No matter if the science of global warming is all phony…climate change provides the greatest opportunity to bring about justice and equality in the world.” –Christine Stewart, former Canadian Minister of the Environment.
    “It doesn’t matter what is true, it only matters what people believe is true.” –Paul Watson, co-founder of Greenpeace.

    Like

  13. Paul Emery Avatar
    Paul Emery

    What about the new land use restrictions to be discussed tomorrow by our Board of Supervisors about zoning what plants you can grow in your backyard or garage?
    http://www.theunion.com/article/20111104/NEWS/111109894&parentprofile=search

    Like

  14. D. King Avatar
    D. King

    Judi Caler | 07 November 2011 at 09:37 AM
    And all funded by a tax on evil, evil carbon.
    That is why they have a Pitbull grip on Climate Change.

    Like

  15. mike thornton Avatar

    First off, George, the idea that somehow or another “smart growth” is an international communist plot, shows the shallowness and backwardness of your thinking. Nevertheless, the fact still remains that rightwing regressives have a long history of conspiracy laden fear mongering. I refer to to the work of Dr. Sara Diamond, who shows that the “Agenda 21” type scare tactics have been used repeatedly to rally the troops. You guys always need an “enemy”, because you have nothing positive to offer.
    All you have to do is read Judi’s fear mongering essay (above) TJ’s statements about “life and death” struggle and your constant use of lables like “communist” as examples of the fact that what I’m saying is correct.
    I think part of the issue is that (here) you have the “Gang of Eight” constantly reinforcing each others paranoia and prejudice, so it seems (to you guys) like what you’re saying makes sense. In the wider world, however, it just sounds like so much paranoid ranting.
    Now that I think about it, I think you, Todd and Judi would have been happy being part of the group putting Galileo on trial for daring to say that the Earth revolved around the Sun.

    Like

  16. mike thornton Avatar

    Let’s add King to the Galileo list

    Like

  17. D. King Avatar
    D. King

    I was feeling left out!

    Like

  18. Todd Juvinall Avatar
    Todd Juvinall

    When someone gets educated (something MikeT needs terribly) on these issues perhaps they will have a different view. Naw, there are no intelligent folks on the left but they are fun to read. What is apparent is the left, the hidden socialists/communists, are now the “pushers” of the extremist rules on our private property and the attack on our Constitution. MikeT is the latest example of one of them.
    Regarding the right doing nothing according to MikeT. Perhaps the right is too busy creating jobs and making the planet’s economy work and it is the left trying to stop them. It is simply amusing to read the childish gibberish of such a ill-informed member of the extreme left. What a hoot!

    Like

  19. Todd Juvinall Avatar
    Todd Juvinall

    Actually regarding Galileo. The R’s would be helping him (trying to turn gravity into a product to make life better) and the left would be burning him at the stake (since they couldn’t figure out how to get a government handout from gravity). Isn’t it interesting how extremist lefty’s try and reverse reality?

    Like

  20. D. King Avatar
    D. King

    mike thornton | 07 November 2011 at 10:26 AM
    Oh Mr. Thornton, oracle of the left, please tell us how changing the patent laws from “First to Invent” to “First to Publish” will make America more competitive. Or was it just the name of the bill that convinced you…”The America Invents Act”-(with free Candy). Please elaborate!

    Like

  21. Greg Goodknight Avatar
    Greg Goodknight

    Judi, “global warming” isn’t a hoax. It really has gotten warmer since the end of the little ice age… and a good case can be made that mankind has affected climate now and in the past. The question is how, and how much, and the answers are the problem.
    There is no doubt that many, if not all, of the senior scientists involved in the IPCC process believe CO2 (and any other greenhouse gas) really is a key driver of unstable positive feedbacks. They theorize these can cause a temperature spike in much the same way a bad public address system can screech an eardrum-damaging feedback spike. It isn’t a hoax; they really believe it.
    The main not-quite-physical evidence for it is that their computer models balance when they include this positive feedback (involving the additional production of the dominant greenhouse gas, water vapor, from evaporation when the temp goes up). The existing models don’t balance without this, but those models also lack good ocean and cloud modeling, and they have been kicking and screaming in tantrums to keep excluding solar-magnetic cloud forcings out of their models.
    Global warming isn’t a hoax, and neither is catastrophic Anthropogenic Global Warming (cAGW). It’s just bad groupthink science, and the pols who have grabbed it as convenient cudgel aren’t perpetrating a hoax (not being science minded, they wouldn’t know a hoax if they saw it), they’re just doing what pols do, use any excuse to grab power.
    The cAGW scare is currently in a slow-mo implosion. This Agenda 21 thing (and the entire sustainability movement) that has you exercised is secondary BS to the cAGW issue. Nor will there be money to pour into these efforts in the new world disorder that’s on its way courtesy of the welfare state contractions starting right about now, with Greece leading the way and California not being too far behind.
    Don’t worry, be happy. Keep the 1st and 2nd Amendments intact and all will be fine while the cAGW scare subsides, “sustainability” disappears as a political force and is eventually replaced with another global cooling scare, which, unlike runaway warming, really does happen on a regular basis and will happen again. Any millennium now.

    Like

  22. mike thornton Avatar

    TJ writes”
    “Perhaps the right is too busy creating jobs and making the planet’s economy work”
    Not doing such a good job or it!
    Oh Great God King: “Please tell us how continuing to deny something that is accepted fact helps move humanity and society forward?

    Like

  23. D. King Avatar
    D. King

    Mike T.
    “…helps move humanity and society forward?”
    Well, we should move forward, towards the candy!

    Like

  24. Greg Goodknight Avatar
    Greg Goodknight

    “But yes, the “international enviros” have been at it for a long time since Agenda 21 is about 20 years old. That’s why one might confuse it with the same old same old.” George R
    George, the IPCC is 23 years old, dating from 1988. Agenda 21 is just an offshoot that started in ’92; fighting Agenda 21 is like trimming back the Kudzu. Kill the rootstock, stop the trimming.
    The Thorntons and Frischs of the world will just have ammo to make you look silly to the unwashed as long as you insist on fighting UN conspiracies. The issue is CO2, take that away as a motive force and you’re most of the way home.

    Like

  25. Todd Juvinall Avatar
    Todd Juvinall

    If we hadn’t had the League of Nations debacle, then I think Greg would have a valid point. Unfortunately, he doesn’t regarding the AGW issue. It is true the planet has gotten warmer since the Little Ice Age but that is like saying I turned off the juice to the ice box and the milk got warmer.

    Like

  26. D. King Avatar
    D. King

    Control of energy is the end game.
    That’s what you have to take away.

    Like

  27. Paul Emery Avatar
    Paul Emery

    Those of you that are concerned about zoning regs should check out tomorrows Board of Supervisors meeting where they will discuss what plants you can grow in your backyard and even in your house. Does this come from Agenda 21 and the UN or from the Socialist Communist conspiracy?
    http://www.theunion.com/article/20111104/NEWS/111109894&parentprofile=search

    Like

  28. Douglas Keachie Avatar
    Douglas Keachie

    “Isn’t it interesting how extremist lefty’s try and reverse reality?”
    The reason the Republican House can never jumpstart the economy successfully is that they are forever getting the positive [JOBS] mixed up with the negative [less taxes and regulations] and thus shorting out (and short changing) the electorate.

    Like

  29. D. King Avatar
    D. King

    That was good Doug.

    Like

  30. Mike Thornton Avatar

    OMG!
    I agree with GG!!!
    Well, almost….
    I believe we should have a definitive, science based debate as compared to trumped up “UN conspiracies”. Frankly, I believe the science is in and the issue is settled, but if GG wants to let the science rule and then move forward, I agree!

    Like

  31. Greg Goodknight Avatar
    Greg Goodknight

    Thornton, heed the words of Richard Feynmann… “Science is the belief in the ignorance of the experts”. The fundamental science really is pretty much in and settling down, but it isn’t what Al Gore told you to think.
    Even the oft-misquoted cowboy physicist in Berkeley, Richard Muller, who remains a CO2 alarmist (‘very probably true’) of many years standing , wrote in a recent paper he coauthored with Dr. Judith Curry, “The human component of global warming may be somewhat overestimated.” This was a result of a fairly clear indication from the prelimary Berkeley EST dataset and investigations that the warming of the latter 20th century pretty well tracked oceanic surface temperature trends that were unknown until the last decade.
    Really, Thornton, the IPCC and the UN have been trying to prove CO2 is the bogeyman in modern climate for 23 years in order to shake the 1st world down for imagined reparations to the 3rd world and tax energy producers. While it was on a roll and hitting a political zenith in 2006, the wheels are now falling off. Get used to losing; the faster you jump off the bandwagon the better off we’ll all be.

    Like

  32. Mike Thornton Avatar

    GG, you were doing fine and then you had to go off into “imagined reparations for the 3rd world” You guys just can’t help throwing out the race card can ya?
    Do you really want to talk about what the so-called “First World” has done (and continues to do) to the so-called “Third World”?

    Like

  33. George Rebane Avatar

    GregG – didn’t mean to rank Agenda21 type legislation with AGW legislation. To me they’re both important, and they fly in tight formation in the minds of those are putting us into smaller and smaller boxes.
    re MikeT 1020am – “First off, George, the idea that somehow or another “smart growth” is an international communist plot, shows the shallowness and backwardness of your thinking.” Wow! you just continue to make this crap up, paint a bullseye on it, and then start blasting away. When you people get into a room by yourselves, how do you manage a conversation that goes anywhere when they all have your skills? Who claimed that smart growth is “an international communist plat”? In fact, I’m not aware that international communism exists – are you claiming it does?

    Like

  34. Mike Thornton Avatar

    As near as I can tell, George, pretty much as far as you’re concerned everything is an international communist plot. Except, that is, when it’s part of the international Muslim plot!

    Like

  35. Paul Emery Avatar
    Paul Emery

    So are the Commies responsible for laws that send you to jail for growing illegal plants?

    Like

  36. Todd Juvinall Avatar
    Todd Juvinall

    Greg your response regarding the third world was spot on. The laws on cap and trade were that very thing. The trading of carbon credits from the first world to the third world so they could have an industrial base instead of being shortchanged according to the C and T proponents. I am surprised the resident lefty poster MT didn’t know that. If he had remembered, the Kyoto Treaty was where it began and why it was defeated 99-0 when Clinton/Gore sent it to the Senate for ratification. The Senators, all of them, knew the treaty was transfer of our wealth to the third world.
    So, Greg smacks down the MT once again. I would think he being destroyed in debate so much would make him start paying attention a bit more.

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  37. Todd Juvinall Avatar
    Todd Juvinall

    Paul is the plant a legal or illegal plant? Is it heroin poppies?

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  38. George Rebane Avatar

    MikeT 556pm – I will take you at your word about your ability to “tell” what is written and being debated in these pages. The admission does explain a lot.

    Like

  39. Steve Enos Avatar
    Steve Enos

    Are there two sets of standards for non-profits?
    What about the non-profits funded by the Koch Brothers that have just been caught providing money to the Cain campaign?
    Will conservatives speak out against this?
    Here’s a link to a story that covers the basics of this:
    http://articles.latimes.com/2011/oct/31/news/la-pn-cain-charity-debt-20111031

    Like

  40. George Rebane Avatar

    SteveE – thanks for the heads up on this. Now that this has been discovered, I’m more than sure that the media will buzz it out thoroughly – no rock shall be left unturned. Cain is not above the law.

    Like

  41. Todd Juvinall Avatar
    Todd Juvinall

    Maybe SteveE could get the skinny for us all on the trip SteveF took to Mongolia and China. Who paid for it? That sure would help us understand his concerns a bit more since it has been alleged that SteveF used non profit money to campaign against Prop23. .

    Like

  42. Mike Thornton Avatar

    George, if you ever had to go a week without using the words; communist, Muslim or socialist, you’d be mute and unable to write.
    You’re pretty much a “one trick pony”, guy

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  43. Todd Juvinall Avatar
    Todd Juvinall

    George, do you here those crickets?

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  44. Paul Emery Avatar
    Paul Emery

    Todd
    Any plant. Who makes those laws?

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  45. Greg Goodknight Avatar
    Greg Goodknight

    “GG, you were doing fine and then you had to go off into “imagined reparations for the 3rd world” You guys just can’t help throwing out the race card can ya?
    Do you really want to talk about what the so-called “First World” has done (and continues to do) to the so-called “Third World”?”
    To quote a dead politician who I never voted for, “there you go again!”. Sorry Thornton, but when I say “third world” it isn’t code for brown people, it’s code for 3rd world. The IPCC really was formed to find out how bad CO2 was, and to have the 1st world countries who have burned most of the oil since they started “pumping ethyl” pay reparations to the countries who wish they’d been rich and productive enough to burn as much, aka the 3rd world. It was always about massive transfer payments from the US and Europe to everyone else. Mostly from the US.
    Does the IPCC have a wealthy Indian chairman with a railway engineering degree from India and a PhD in Econ from a lower tier Southern US college because of his expertise in climate science?
    Thornton, this is about CO2, not retributions for all insults, real and imagined, inflicted upon the 3rd world since the beginning of time. Try to stay on topic.

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  46. Greg Goodknight Avatar
    Greg Goodknight

    “GregG – didn’t mean to rank Agenda21 type legislation with AGW legislation.”
    George, you didn’t, and I didn’t. The “Agenda21 type legislation” was started because of the imagined threat from runaway warming triggered by anthropogenic CO2. That was the key part of “unsustainable” that was to be reformed. Proximate cause, not equal ranking.
    There is plenty of collectivist rot in the world government types, but the non-existent upcoming climate catastrophe is the excuse for much of it, including “Agenda 21”.

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  47. George Rebane Avatar

    GregG – AGW and Agenda 21 are both political issues. Agenda 21 started as a political issue and was formally acknowledged as such by heads of state. Agreed that they’re related. But I believe that both should also be opposed, no matter where their now considerable tendrils poke up. While AGW is an element of A21, the latter still has a wider scope of public policy desiderata to inhibit freedoms and reduce quality of life. Please excuse my continuing to harp on both.

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  48. Greg Goodknight Avatar
    Greg Goodknight

    George, take away the AGW scientific underpinnings and the wind is removed from all of the ‘one world government’ sails. It is the key issue.
    There will still be folks rowing towards their collective one world government dream but they won’t have the wind at their backs.

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  49. George Rebane Avatar

    GregG – Agreed. But since they still “have the wind at their backs”, they continue sailing toward that global governance by putting in place all the supporting strictures on the Bastiat Triangle. When they get close enough, no doubt AGW will be dispensed with, and replaced with a more existential and forceful push to that benighted shore.

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  50. Douglas Keachie Avatar
    Douglas Keachie

    Cain ai able to make pizza and try to put the make on women and that’s about it.

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