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June 2011
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George Rebane

Mr Douglas Keachie is a loud voice in the community and on local blogs.  A man of progressive persuasion, he is also a sometime commenter on these pages.  In his latest effort he attempts to reveal “three fatal flaws” in my 11jun11 Union column ‘Entrepreneurship 2011’.  His revelation was published as an Other Voices submission in the 21jun11 Union (here).

Mr Keachie launches his piece with the devastating deduction that I claimed the tax rate to be 100% (confiscatory) for all earnings above $250,000 – “The tax on net income above $250,000 is not 100 percent.”  It is easy to verify that nowhere in my column do I make such claim or anything that remotely resembles it.  From that point of departure Mr Keachie proceeds swiftly downward in his displayed comprehension of what I wrote, and in his understanding of the entrepreneurial enterprise in general.

There are two possible explanations for such errors.  The first is that Mr Keachie is among the many who have been short-changed by our public educational system.  And that would explain why his remarkable conclusions fall into the lower categories as documented in the longitudinal National Adult Literacy Survey   that is conducted every ten years by the National Center for Educational Statistics.  As the record shows, this is not the first time that Mr Keachie has had trouble understanding what I write.  (I have reported extensively on adult numeracy and literacy on these pages – RR keywords ‘numeracy’, ‘adult literacy’.)

The other explanation is that Mr Keachie is taking a page from Saul Alinsky’s manual of political discourse, and simply fabricating a set of ‘facts’, attributes, or other characteristics that can be ascribed to a person to be denigrated.  Such characteristics, derived from whole cloth, go on to serve as the ridiculed targets for the remainder of the presentation.  The reader, unfamiliar with the original, is then at the author’s mercy.

As to why The Union so prominently published Mr Keachie’s article, one can only guess.  Perhaps, through their over-worked editorial filter, my column represented an ideological bias that had to be ‘balanced’, and the Keachie piece was the only one at hand – any port in a storm.

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187 responses to “Keachie Again Misreads Rebane”

  1. Douglas Keachie Avatar

    But Greg, you did it so well in the past, as if it was instantly available to you from that great big physics enabled brain of yours? Now is it just possible that if it missed being intuitive to you, then it might have be the same way for me? Frankly with the loss of 50% vision in one eye, I have trouble seeing both ends of a 1 followed by many many zerooooooooooooooooooooos. Quick, tell me how many “o’s” there are. Ah too bad, that takes some time, doesn’t it? It’s after all, jsut a simple mathematically operation you’re doing. It’s called, “counting.”

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  2. Douglas Keachie Avatar

    “just a simple mathematically challenging operation you’re doing”

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  3. Douglas Keachie Avatar

    Like many here, my typing has a difficult time keeping up with my thinking, ain’t it the truth, Todd?

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  4. Larry Wirth Avatar
    Larry Wirth

    Doug, it’s good that you acknowlege a small slip-up in your arithmetic. Still, you miss the larger point; for your “new tax” to get the job done, you’ll need a rate north of $12.50/$100 just to fund the current level of deficit spending. Raise it to $25 and in a mere 14 years, the debt will be gone completely. That’ll goose up the number of transactions, no?
    Sorry guys, the economy can’t be “fixed” on the revenue side revenue side alone.
    At some point, people have to decide the proper rate of taxation and the government then needs to direct those revenues to the most needed places and not just turn around and demand more. That’s what got us here, it’s not going to get us back.

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  5. Greg Goodknight Avatar
    Greg Goodknight

    In Keachie’s alternative universe, the above probably makes perfect sense.
    Doug may be available for private tutoring; any of you with kids or grandkids needing help with their gibberish from a bona fide certificated public school teacher from San Francisco, give him a ring!
    At one time, circa 2000, public school teachers in SF sent their own children to private school more often than the public as a whole. Can you blame them?

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  6. Larry Wirth Avatar
    Larry Wirth

    And for you math mavens who may be wondering why fourteen years to break-even, rather than the ten you would expect, it’s because the deficit is scheduled to go much, much higher as Obamacare kicks in and that too will need to be paid for.

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  7. Douglas Keachie Avatar

    Our daughter attended Wee Care in Mill Valley, Kindergarten in a another private school, because the public schools would take her because of a late December birthday. From then on out it was public all the way, Alamo, Presidio, and Lowell. She also attended NU, but spent much of her time at Sierra College. Se’s turned out just fine.
    Why should the children of any of RR’s readers need a tutor, when their parents already know it all?
    My proposal was not supposed to pay off the national debt in one year, or twenty. In was just supposed to help with the problem. Bring the military home and setting them to work building solar installations would be another angle. Home grown energy is a very effective strategy for defense.

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  8. Douglas Keachie Avatar

    “she’s”

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  9. Douglas Keachie Avatar

    Is there some reason to use a template that doesn’t allow for the nesting of replies?

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  10. George Rebane Avatar

    DougK – I tried nested replies about four months ago, and they didn’t work out. Instead of finding the latest comments at the end, readers had to go search through all the reply threads to see if there was anything of interest to them. Referencing your comment with an addressee (such as this one), and using a date/time stamp to point to off-page comments turns out to be more convenient. I went through this administrivia some time ago.

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  11. Douglas Keachie Avatar

    OK, that make some sense to me, but usually I go to the most recent comments, lick on someone, and I’m taken right to the area in the thread where not only do I find their comments, I find what they are going on about.

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  12. Douglas Keachie Avatar

    Nothing uite like a sticky “c” key to provide general amusement, except for maybe a sticky “q” key.

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  13. Greg Goodknight Avatar
    Greg Goodknight

    Keach, besides you, no one here speaks gibberish as their native tongue, and there’s a market for tutors in just about everything. Just trying to help.
    I’m not surprised you’d be happy with SF public schools, but you apparently had a number of coworkers who chose not to have their own children attend their public school.

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  14. bill tozer Avatar
    bill tozer

    Ladies and gentlemen, I apologize to you because after reading all 63 comments, I plumb forgot what the topic is/was. Ain’t as sharp as I used to be, I reckon. However, let’s all take a deep breathe ( in with the good, out with the bad) and be grateful that Mr. FBAE (former Bay Area educator) is not railing and wailing about how much interest credit card companies are charging. That got old. I always said that if you do not like the interest rates, then don’t borrow money from credit card companies or ever, ever carry a balance. Always read the fine print. Think is was old Ben Franklin that said “Never a lender nor borrower be”. Could have been my Mama. To tell the truth in all this confusion, I can’t rightly recall. Count your blessings because Keachie isn’t going all ballistic on what banks should charge him and…and what was the topic??

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  15. Douglas Keachie Avatar

    And the private schools they sent them to were not the bottom three quarters cheap ones, but as a product of Berkeley schools, K-16, I had no fears, so our younger daughter sailed through, as the older daughter did before her. Tell me Greg, did not your son go to private schools? Last I heard he was doing well, so you tell me, who got the better deal $?$.
    hey Tozer, you missed out on FBAT….

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  16. Douglas Keachie Avatar

    Wake up you lazy entrepreneurs!
    Do lazy aircraft owners getting 2 million dollars for a new runway live off the government tit?
    yes or no, please…

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  17. Unlazy E Avatar
    Unlazy E

    Ironically, I am at work.
    “Wake up you lazy entrepreneurs! ” Posted by: Douglas Keachie | 23 June 2011 at 08:18 AM

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  18. Todd Juvinall Avatar
    Todd Juvinall

    Keachie, you pay a fee for airport upgrades every time you buy a ticket. Then it gets sent to airports. Are you awake man?

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  19. Greg Goodknight Avatar
    Greg Goodknight

    GA airport funds come out of the heavy taxes placed on aviation gasoline (currently averaging $5.91 a gallon in California) and jet fuel sold to private aircraft. Last I noticed, the Feds were transferring funds out of it rather than maintain the facade it was to be spend on general aviation.
    Keach, I’m sure all who were involved in the Berkeley K-16 system are proud of you.

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  20. Larry Wirth Avatar
    Larry Wirth

    Some intelligent children do just fine in public schools, notwithstanding the odds. In most cases,
    the quality of parenting is the key consideration, not the quality of teaching.
    Doug, your question as to “value recieved” is meaningless, inasmuch as those who opt for private schools still have to pay for the public option as well- those who you say get “no money.” So, if youre going to fight, fight fair and compare the per pupil expenses of public vs. private schools, then make a second comparison of the respective outcomes.

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  21. Greg Goodknight Avatar
    Greg Goodknight

    The problem with “do just fine” in the public schools is one of definition of “just fine”. Any kid who tests basic, graduates from high school and enrolls in a community college is doing ‘just fine’, but what would they be doing if they had been challenged in school rather than bored stiff, day after day? Harvard maybe?
    While student achievement is well correlated with parental socioeconomic status, incompetent schools trump all. Half of the middle class kids at Hennessey Elementary in my son’s cohort tested in the bottom 25% when the first state STAR exam was given, while in neighboring Alta Sierra Elementary IIRC non of the kids tested in the bottom half. The difference was the whole language, whole math focus in the GVSD and the purge of teachers who didn’t believe in constructivist dogma. Unfocused, scattershot teaching claiming to be focused on “critical thinking” skills has been the rage in ed circles for years. Induction can be useful, but logical deduction is a key skill that isn’t being taught.
    But, as Will Rogers said, “You can’t teach what you don’t know any more than you can come back from where you ain’t been.”

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  22. Douglas Keachie Avatar

    MS in Journalism from UC Berkeley I suppose is not quite fine enough for you, but then she’s a SAHM with Internet based business, and probably didn’t really need the degrees.
    That’s the older daughter.
    Now the younger daughter on the other hand???
    Resident neurosurgeon “just fine” enough for you?

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  23. Douglas Keachie Avatar

    And I’m sure there are enough landings by commercial passenger aircraft at Grass Valley to cover for the private pilots there? That’s the two million I’m talking about. Or do the private pilots pool their money for the tab? I’m sure CALFIRE helps you out…
    Are you asleep?

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  24. Greg Goodknight Avatar
    Greg Goodknight

    Keachie, you’re the one who is asleep here. As I have already written, improvements to airports like the Nevada County Airpark are paid for from the fund that receives the taxes on fuel, and, in addition, both aircraft and hangars are assessed property taxes by the County based on their value, and the cheapest one can get away with storing an airplane in Grass Valley is a small tie down spot suitable for the smallest Cessna for $660 a year.
    Calfire buys tax laden fuels, but I expect neither their property or aircraft gets taxed.
    I realize your scattershots are intended to weed out some sort of hypocrisy on the part of aviation in Nevada County, but you should learn something from your mistakes.

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  25. Greg Goodknight Avatar
    Greg Goodknight

    Regarding brain surgery, it isn’t rocket science. And that is a more serious comment than it might seem; in order to start college ready to study math, physics, chemistry or engineering requires a great deal of mathematics, and the standard pre-Med curriculums at even the UC Berkeleys of the world avoid the solid math, the solid chemistry and the solid physics that students of the physical sciences take. It is rare for graduates of California public high schools to be prepared for the mathematics they’ll be expected to master their freshman year if they choose a hard core science major.

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  26. Douglas Keachie Avatar

    How many aircraft at GV airport?
    100 – 200, max.
    How much fuel so they buy in a year, at what taxation rate?
    Does that add up to $1,900,000 the Feds are pumping into the airport?
    Please do the math.
    And BTW, if you need brain surgery, be sure to find the finest mathematician you can. I’m sure he’ll do a much better job on your mind than a neurosurgeon can! You make this too easy!

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  27. Douglas Keachie Avatar

    “Regarding brain surgery, it isn’t rocket science. And that is a more serious comment than it might seem; in order to start college ready to study math, physics, chemistry or engineering requires a great deal of mathematics, and the standard pre-Med curriculums at even the UC Berkeleys of the world avoid the solid math, the solid chemistry and the solid physics that students of the physical sciences take. It is rare for graduates of California public high schools to be prepared for the mathematics they’ll be expected to master their freshman year if they choose a hard core science major.”
    Seems to me, you might also want to consider having a PhD in Petroleum Engineering mix up the next prescription you need from a pharmacy, as they are obviously much better qualified than your local pharmacist to do so. Besides, your mental gears seem a little rusty these days…
    Again I notice your typical bypass, by completely ignoring questions you don’t want to answer, in your lack of response to the airport questions posed above. Hardening of the mental arteries? Or is Estonia such a much more fascinating topic?
    BTW, don’t get me wrong about socialism for the airport. I strongly support it, as I use it myself and depend on it for CALFIRE.

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  28. Douglas Keachie Avatar

    “and the cheapest one can get away with storing an airplane in Grass Valley is a small tie down spot suitable for the smallest Cessna for $660 a year”
    Does the $660 go to the county, or to the Feds?
    Let’s ask Dr. Hard Science!

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  29. Douglas Keachie Avatar

    While you’re at it, compare the $660 to the anchor out buoys at Scotts Flat, which I believe run $200 -$300 per season. Who is subsidized more?

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  30. Douglas Keachie Avatar

    In summation Greg, maybe the following set of questions will illustrate to you how you come off to other members of the communtiy,in regards your feelings/opinions about the superiority of physicists/engineers over the rest of humanity:
    Is a trumpet the superior instrument over the trombones, French horns, tubas, and drums?
    Are Concert Bands superior to symphony orchestras, ensembles, trios and quartets?
    Are pilots of Cessna aircraft superior to captains of ocean liners?
    And so on. Do you get it now?
    We will leave you and your obsessions over “hard” and “solid” sciences to you and your therapists.

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  31. Douglas Keachie Avatar

    GA airport funds come out of the heavy taxes placed on aviation gasoline (currently averaging $5.91 a gallon in California) and jet fuel sold to private aircraft. Last I noticed, the Feds were transferring funds out of it rather than maintain the facade it was to be spend on general aviation.
    Posted by: Greg Goodknight | 23 June 2011 at 10:25 AM
    So Greg has stated:
    “GA airport funds come out of the heavy taxes placed on aviation gasoline (currently averaging $5.91 a gallon in California)”
    Some people might read this as the taxes on aviation gasoline as being $5.91 a gallon, but of course Greg knows that the feds get roughly 18 cent per gallon nad the state gets a similar amount. Greg certainly wouldn’t want to mislead anyone, now would he?
    42007-08 19.1 79.9 $3,657,000 $3,574,000 $7,231,000
    Current Fuel Tax Rates: 1$0.18/gallon. 2$0.02/gallon
    1&2Source: The Board of Equalization (BOE) Tax Division: Taxable Aviation Gasoline Gallons 10-Year Report
    So statewide, general aviation generated how much in total from aviation fuel, Mr.Goodknight?

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  32. Douglas Keachie Avatar

    For the mathematically challenged, at roughly 20 cents per gallon, to generate the two million dollars from the Feds for the airport upgrades, the airport would have had to have pumped 10 million gallons of av fuel, or roughly 27397.26027 gallon per day in a 365 day year. Can Greg document anything even vaguely close to this?

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  33. Douglas Keachie Avatar

    Roughly speaking, that would be a 1,000 gallons of av fuel leaving the airport every hour, 24/7/365 Need I say more?

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  34. Greg Goodknight Avatar
    Greg Goodknight

    Keach, you aren’t right enough to just be wrong. Are your taxes high enough to buy you a new street to your house every year?
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Airport_and_Airway_Trust_Fund
    The county makes a big profit on all the fuel they sell, a big profit on the rents they collect, and the Feds have kept a surplus in the Airport trust fund.
    George, you might consider that Keachie is just interested in a forum to make attacks, and eventually do what The Union was forced to do, over and over.

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  35. Greg Goodknight Avatar
    Greg Goodknight

    Keachie, you’re a possibly former public school teacher with a history of creating anonymous sock puppets in order to defame others online. Do you have any idea how, as you put it, “you come off to other members of the communtiy[sic]”?
    One by one:
    “in regards your feelings/opinions about the superiority of physicists/engineers over the rest of humanity”
    Never happened, except in matters of physics and engineering.
    “Is a trumpet the superior instrument over the trombones, French horns, tubas, and drums?”
    Never made the claim.
    “Are Concert Bands superior to symphony orchestras, ensembles, trios and quartets?”
    I’m partial to quintets and symphonies myself. You?
    “Are pilots of Cessna aircraft superior to captains of ocean liners? And so on. Do you get it now?”
    I got it a long time ago, Keach, about when you demonstrated you couldn’t divide 3/2 by 1/2 on the NC Forum list ten years ago. You’re a fool.

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  36. Douglas Keachie Avatar

    Only a fool would suggest that petroleum engineers study harder or work harder than brain surgeons.
    Only a sly cunning fool would suggest that the taxes on aviation fuel paid at GV airport come anywhere near close to paying for the repaving, even over a 20 year collection period.
    And only a completely un-selfaware fool would fail to realize what a snob he comes across as.
    And only a total ass measures other people by slight lapses in math or spelling.
    I did my best, but since you long ago decided that I was beneath contempt, you are not listening, but other people are. And they can decide for themselves who is the conceited fool here.

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  37. Douglas Keachie Avatar

    Further reading Fed funding history can be found here:
    http://www.tcpilots.org/resource/fund_history.html

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  38. Douglas Keachie Avatar

    “Last I noticed, the Feds were transferring funds out of it rather than maintain the facade it was to be spend on general aviation”
    No Greg, the monies collected also go to commercial aviation. General aviation, for those unaware, is everything left over after the Big Boys of commercial aviation leave.

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  39. Douglas Keachie Avatar

    What’s more, 80% of the monies collected from all sources go to fix commercially served airports. This information is from the article cited above. So 20% of all the loot goes to “General Aviation.” Commercial airliners keep 5,000 planes in the air during most day time hours. It would seem to me that the passengers on those commercial flights burn up far more than 80% of the fuel used every day, and that therefore commercial airports should be getting a much larger share of the pie than they do. I would offer this as further proof that the “general aviation” portion of the flying spectrum is heavily subsidized. From the end of that article:
    “Around the world, today’s airports may be operated by a national airport authority or transportation department, local authorities, airlines, private owners, or contractors. In the United States, most funds for new airports come from the sale of bonds managed by a local authority or sponsor. In the last decade, about $45 billion of AIP money has been spent with about 80 percent going to airports with scheduled air service, though like earlier programs, there continues to be disagreements and even lawsuits over how to spend the aviation trust fund.”

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  40. Greg Goodknight Avatar
    Greg Goodknight

    “Only a fool would suggest that petroleum engineers study harder or work harder than brain surgeons.”
    I never did that, Keach. Like so many of your imagined ‘insinuations’ it was entirely in your mind, and, since I’ve never even spoken with a petroleum engineer or written about one it seems strange you’d bring up that specialty as an example.
    Let’s get back to that point you were missing, and let me use a young man I know to illustrate it. Smart guy, a lawyer. Clerked for a state Supreme Court Chief Justice. Young family.
    He started his frosh year at a University of California wanting to study Computer Science, but he couldn’t keep up and compete with the mathematics required, so he changed to Econ and later, law school. His high school proudly used the wretched CPM program from Davis.
    Did he turn out OK? Well, he’s doing OK, but had his California public K-12 system been competently teaching mathematics, he’d have had different choices, and California won’t be able to support lawyers or brain surgeons in the lifestyles they expect without the scientists and engineers that drive innovation.
    BTW nice to see you’ve bothered to learn something about GA, but again, you’ve read between my lines to fabricate claims I never made.

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  41. Douglas Keachie Avatar

    Greg, you can pretend to not insinuate, and I suppose it is wildly possible you are so un-self aware that you do not realize you are doing it,but you do an excellent job of it, on a daily basis. Your aviation gas statement is just the latest in a long line of similar statements.
    You want an “A” in clever and vague plausibly deniable insinuations? You’ve got it!
    I would submit that the reason people find math difficult is two-fold:
    It is difficult.
    Those that have figured it out have failed to figure out ways of transmitting the information clearly, and take the easy way out. They blame the pupil.
    Teaching binary used to be a real drag,but I took the time to figure out an explanation and exercises such that my wife, an artist, can understand them, and teach them to her kids, in art classes.
    On teachers and CPM, who set the prices, and who did the purchasing? Teachers? FAIL!
    On teachers get paid for what they do, try this:
    http://front.moveon.org/where-in-the-world-can-teachers-get-paid-what-they-deserve/?rc=fb.fan

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  42. Greg Goodknight Avatar
    Greg Goodknight

    Keachie Again Misreads Goodknight. Not a surprise.
    Constructivism, the birthplace of whole math and whole language, remains a darling of the colleges of Education, Keach. Not the math and science departments. Here’s what professional Educators think of the high grades given the weakest students in most colleges:
    “It makes perfect sense to me that students in the Education Department of a university would have the highest GPAs because they are being taught by trained educators. I would expect the lowest GPAs to be among the math and engineering students because mathematicians have still not figured out how to teach math.” – Educator and author Nancy Illing, commenting on a story about grade inflation at teachers’ colleges.
    (June 10 Teacher Beat <“>http://blogs.edweek.org/edweek/teacherbeat/2011/06/do_education_schools_give_too.html?plckFindCommentKey=CommentKey:e6ab78fa-620f-465c-a511-e408072d86c0&gt; )
    Keach, answer this… you seem to understand that math is difficult. Do you think a freshman year class in multivariable calculus, and it’s companion classes in physics and chemistry (the ones meant for science majors, not pre-Med or other biology), are more, less or the same difficulty as the lower division classes a history major might take?

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  43. Greg Goodknight Avatar
    Greg Goodknight

    “Those that have figured [math] out have failed to figure out ways of transmitting the information clearly, and take the easy way out. They blame the pupil.”
    Actually, Keach, mathematicians have figured out “ways of transmitting the information clearly”. A problem in K-12 is that many, if not most, teaching arithmetic are not qualified to do so. They lack the profound knowledge of elementary mathematics that one needs to clearly understand the subject in order to teach it, and a student lacking an understanding of the arithmetic of fractions and decimal operations is going to be lost studying Algebra, and without a solid foundation in Algebra any academic or professional career in math and the sciences is unattainable. Yes, at any time one can start from scratch and get that profound understanding of the basics, but most of us don’t have unlimited time or money.

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  44. Douglas Keachie Avatar

    It’ much easier to bullshit in the social sciences, and get a passing grade, I grant you that. Since moving on in math requires accurate comprehension of what was taught before, and since most of the stuff is NOT open to different interpretations, you are stuck with being able to replicate logic of the stuff and work with the stuff precisely
    Geometry was the big surprise in high school. It was quickly obvious that detour had nothing much at all to do with the second year of algebra.
    Does taking social science courses indicate that you have an inferior brain, not necessarily so at all.
    I did not taake a single course in the Ed dept before getting my BA. I left that to graduate school, and very little of what was taught was very useful. Working with top notch teachers and observing how they worked helped more than anything. It was the dawn of the video age, and I got paid to film and analyze master teachers at work. I learn more from that than the classes I was in most instances, forced to endure. Since most Ed Dept are upper division or graduate oriented, I’m not surprised to see higher GPA’s.
    Did you know that staying current is a really big challenge?
    Try this: http://www.wired.com/wiredscience/2011/06/how-static-electricity-works

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  45. George Rebane Avatar

    GregG, the revealing Nancy Illig comment that you cite in your 0937 comment is beyond mind boggling. (This woman deserves a full tuition refund from her schools, for they taught her nothing.) And is there a shred of evidence that graduates of Ed schools can teach one iota better than those who are expert in their subject matter and pick up some basic principles of instruction from an Army field manual on the subject?

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  46. Greg Goodknight Avatar
    Greg Goodknight

    “It’ much easier to bullshit in the social sciences, and get a passing grade, I grant you that.”
    Keach, the essence of the issue continues to escape you. Let’s focus: It’s Impossible to BullS*** in multivariable calculus, linear algebra, and the chemistry and physics taken for credit by math, physics, chemistry and engineering majors. Impossible. There is a huge base of knowledge that needs to be acquired, and there is no getting around it. And no, not everybody succeeds. It’s difficult “stuff” and frankly, the average K-12 teacher doesn’t have a bloody clue what goes on there. Your Stanford BSEE brother does, talk to him about it someday.
    You blame mathematicians for not being able to think clearly about mathematics while being an apologist for incompetent teachers. I know one California State University math professor who described the students he got who were planning on becoming a certificated California public schoolteacher thusly: fourth grade level, barely, when they’d come in to his ‘methods of teaching elementary arithmetic’ class, and it was his job to get them to a 7th grade level. Even so, he (and the other math professors) felt a need to fail the ones who couldn’t get to a 7th grade level of math by the end of the class, so the Ed department ended up creating their own class that would have a higher ‘success’ rate.
    Any teacher who received 18 years of free or subsidized education who can’t manage a 7th grade level understanding of math doesn’t need a raise, they need to be shown the door. No matter how hard they work.

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  47. Douglas Keachie Avatar

    There is one aspect of teaching and learning that neither of you seem to be aware of:
    A given student is predisposed to learn from different sources at different rates. Therefore, if you know of only one way to teach something, and you insist on teaching it that way, some of your students will fail. The art of teaching is the art of studying your students closely, as you are teaching, and picking up on voids as they occur, and repeating concepts in new ways until you hit upon the combination that works for them.
    I found for myself that often the best lecturer would have a crappy textbook,and vs versa. Accordingly I would preview all professors in advance for lecture style for a given course, and do the same with the textbooks. I then took the course from the best lecturer, and used both their book(s) and the ones I could understand easily.
    Of course this take a large university, to offer multiple teachers for the same courses. I suspect the profs at the Claremont Colleges get around this,by practicing my original statement about teaching and learning, and they can do so, because of the small class sizes afforded by the high tuitions. CA K-12 teachers do not have such luxury. In high school a teacher deals with 180 different personalities ever day of the school week. Rather hard to offer much in the way of quality education, especially when you throw in all the language problems.
    “You blame mathematicians for not being able to think clearly about mathematics ” I made no such statement. I did say that they are unable to teach their concepts well. Being able to think clearly is not the same as being able to transmit and teach information well. It does help, but if you are clueless as to the mindsets of your students, you will shoot well over their heads, and then wonder why they don’t “get it.”

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  48. Douglas Keachie Avatar

    One final note on teaching math. If you don’t regularly do math involving decimals and fractions, you do get rusty. I’m quite certain this probably explains most of what you and others like you decry as, “They can’t do math!”
    They did learn it once, but if they haven’t used it for 10 years, it is probably as fresh in their minds as a similarly unused foreign language is in yours.

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  49. Greg Goodknight Avatar
    Greg Goodknight

    Keach, if a college student is in a class on how to teach elementary math, there’s no good reason to not expect they be able to handle elementary math FIRST. Not fire the math professors for not being able to get them to learn it. In fact, teaching bonehead math was my first wife’s first job as an adjunct at Sierra College, and she had students she couldn’t reach, usually the fresh grads from NUHS who weren’t motivated. The adults grasping for a second chance at a better life were more attentive.
    All I hear from you are excuses why teacher’s can’t be held responsible for teaching (unless they are a math professor), and no, your guesses about classes at colleges you’ve never been to and subjects you are ignorant of are as wild as most of your guesses.
    I never had a math professor unable to explain the concepts well. If you did, it might not have been the professor’s fault.

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  50. Greg Goodknight Avatar
    Greg Goodknight

    George, I’m afraid you misunderstand the commenter, Nancy Illing, who expected education classes to have higher grades because Ed profs are better at teaching. She isn’t a schoolteacher:
    http://nancyilling.com/
    http://www.creategenius.com/

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