Rebane's Ruminations
November 2010
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George Rebane

Yesterday morning, while waiting on PG&E’s ‘extended outage’ line listening to elevator music, I received an email from Russ Steele that contained a copy of the latest effluent directed at me personally by Jeff Pelline and his friend Steven Frisch.  For your edification you can read the original and its comment stream on Pelline’s blog here.  The piece contained the usual characterizations that regular readers have seen many times before in these pages and, presumably elsewhere.  The added descriptors worth noting were “slimy” and “pseudo-intellectual masturbation”.

Libertarian Yet reading that screed, one comes away with the feeling that somewhere in the bowels of it there is still a desire to bring us in from the frozen world of ignorance into which we have been consigned.  I don’t know whether that is really possible in this “hyperpartisan country”, because the ‘in’ into which they want to bring us is a world of misery beyond belief.

We are now a nation with a widely recognized broken educational system whose publicly supported part is outputting its third generation of graduates in the humanities who have been grounded in the collectivist anti-American mantra.  These people open their eyes every morning and see a very different world from the one that I see.

They see themselves in a country that has been a scourge on mankind, one whose selfish consumption has deprived other peoples of their just due, and in the process visited on them all sorts of evils and bedevilments.  Also a country that generates obscene amounts of wealth which it allows to be husbanded in the most inequitable of ways.  In short, a country that needs radical social salvation possible only through a strong and thriving central authority with the wisdom to regulate and redistribute ‘fairly’ throughout the land.  And that is a land whose people are yearning for collective world order, where each will produce according to his abilities and receive according to his needs.  Of course, such abilities and needs will be determined by distant councils wherein lies all beneficial knowledge and wisdom.

Against such ‘educated’ legions of the left, there remain voices such as mine.  And no matter how insignificant, small, ignorant, evil, and irrelevant we are judged to be, somehow our very existence remains a constant irritant to those whose collectivist stratagems we reject.  As if, upon reading and meditating on our words, a person would conclude that the progressive prescriptions of the left are utterly bankrupt of what they promise.

Having seen, lived in, and studied other social orders for the many years of my life, I cannot but conclude that America, with all its warts, is an historically exceptional country that has brought to the world ideas, products, and benefices beyond all expectation.  A land that, though hobbled in many ways today, can still do that.  And those riches of body and soul were made possible by free Americans under a government restrained, with individuals making their own decisions on how to spend their energies and treasure.


Today we divide the competing ideologies along a simple one-dimensional line that looks toward its ends as leftwing, collectivist, socialist, communist, progressive, … , and the other as rightwing, conservative, libertarian, free-market, capitalist, … .  Reality, of course, is more complex than that.  Ideologies have many components or attributes, and thus are what technicians call hyper-dimensional.  A person’s real belief system at any given time can then be represented as a point in this ‘hyperspace’.  The above figure shows a now classical view of the political spectrum along the dimensions of personal liberties and economic freedom.  This is the so-called Nolan Chart.  And you can go here to see where you reside in this two-dimensional ideological space.   Its output (figure below) is a more detailed mapping of the ideological labels.  The red area indicates that I am a ‘Right-Leaning Freedom Lover’ and where my beliefs lie.  Again, please understand that even this is a simplification of a much more complex reality.

NolanDiagramGJR101126 So where are we on all this?  It seems clear that we think less and less of each other’s education, values, perception of reality, understanding of history, understanding of science, and the perception of Man’s role in this universe.

Those on the left perceive the labels – socialist, liberal, communist, progressive – associated with various aspects of their beliefs as somehow denigrating, hold them to be pejorative, and as personal attacks even when used to identify certain aspects of their thought.  Those of us on the right take exactly the opposite view when labeled as conservatives, capitalists, libertarians, free-marketers.   We are proud of such labels and want the world to understand the benefits it will accrue if more people thought and acted as we do.

In the above cited post, Steve Frisch makes a statement that clarifies many aspects of the gulf that separates us.

A prime example of George playing fast and lose (sic) with the facts would be his equation of the NAZI government of Germany with socialism. No credible historian would agree with George on this one: the name National Socialist German Workers Party was chosen before Hitler led it, the ‘socialist’ was added to the title to demonstrate that the party supported the Bismark era social welfare programs, and the NAZI party never supported state ownership of the means of production which is the definition of socialism.

This assessment is simply wrong, but necessary for the left to characterize the ‘extreme rightwing’ as the totalitarian antipode of their collectivist workers’ paradise wherein resideth the perfected Man.  Such minds do not understand that totalitarianism is the extreme end of collectivism in which all liberties are removed and everyone works within the state dictated confines determined by the ruling elite.  The Nazi Party not only supported but also implemented state ownership of the means of production.  The Nazis had the wisdom not to remove the working managements of the industrial sectors whose output they directed to the last degree as the 1930s progressed.  The state simply co-opted the owners and managers of industry.

All this, of course, has been rewritten in progressive history so as to put national socialism on the right extreme and substitute ‘totalitarianism’ for ‘socialism’.  International socialism (a la USSR) is the good kind toward which should all strive – and this time we’ll get it right.  However, the social remedies promoted by people of my ideological coloration hearken back to what our Founders originally ordained for a free people who would live in a democratic republic.

Another abyss between us is the inability to understand simple concepts of analytical dialogue as exemplified again by Mr. Frisch’s outrage over my post of the John Stossel essay on the politically incorrect Thanksgiving.  Steve confuses the notion of the failure of the Pilgrims’ first attempts at collective economy with the fact that such an economy was really imposed by the corporate charter under which that pioneer community was organized and launched.

He doesn’t seem to understand that their imperfect launch as a communist community was independent of Governor Bradford’s assessment of its subsequent failure as pointed out in Stossel’s piece.   Debating the origin of the mistake is irrelevant to the recognition that however it came about, such social orders which come embedded with the tragedies of the commons cannot and will not work.  Such analytical powers will not contribute to any dialogue seeking common ground.

Finally, simplified interpretations of early Christian history is often used by secular humanist progressives to point out to the faithful capitalists that early Christian communities often operated on a collectivist basis sharing their produce and comforts freely with each other.  While that is true, what these leftwing intellectuals fail to understand is that survival for besieged small groups always requires a collective approach whether it be a military unit in battle or a family unit surviving in trying times.

There is no doubt that for small groups, especially those beleaguered and over an anticipated short interval, a collective approach is optimal.  What those of more limited abilities can’t seem to reconcile is why collectivism in any of its various forms does not scale upward.  Why does it break down and degenerate into authoritarianism then totalitarianism when it is attempted with larger groups and over extended times?

The answer lies in how the collectivists and the capitalists understand human nature.  Those of the left unthinkingly perceive that all humans either are or can be ‘nudged’ by the collective (i.e. state) to behave altruistically.  Countless failures, ranging from the national to communal levels, will not deter their ongoing application of such reasoning.

It is for these reasons that I believe the gulf between us is too wide to negotiate.  Given that, there are a number of alternative futures available to us which is a topic I have treated here and will continue to explore in future offerings.  However, the most hopeful future lies in reforming how we educate our young.  Our generations will soon pass.  From where I sit, restoring education to local control and making it again responsive to parents’ wishes is the only hope for continuing the Republic in its intended form.  A low probability event indeed, but still worth fighting for.

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124 responses to “The Latest Volley from the Local Left”

  1. Todd Juvinall Avatar
    Todd Juvinall

    What fascinates me about the liberal is their denial of history. I have always loved history especially military history. The movement of warriors and the battles they fought have really made the planets bulk of historical record. There were always kings and the peasants were just the fodder for the kings. Along comes America and reveres the individual and removes the king. The liberal has replaced the king with an overarching government and I suppose they somehow think they would be exempt from the wall when the individual is tamed.

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  2. George Rebane Avatar

    Good thought Todd, you took the words right out of my mouth. I should have included that.

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  3. Paul Emery Avatar
    Paul Emery

    George
    Before you start casting judgments of the tactics and language used by your critics I would like to know your opinion of the language and style used by people you seem to admire such as Rush Linbaugh, Glen Beck, Slime Master Andrew Breitbart and Carl Rove. I can bring up endless examples of them using the same tactics that you claim Pelline and Frisch use. By your apparently condoning the tactics of your fellow travelers it removes any moral justification for your critiques of verbosity of those who oppose you. Can I provide you with some examples for your comment?

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  4. D. King Avatar
    D. King

    “…and I suppose they somehow think they would be exempt from the wall when the individual is tamed.”
    That, is where the term “useful idiot”
    comes from.

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  5. Mike Sherman Avatar

    I am having a difficult time seeing “Rush Limbaugh, Glen Beck, Slime Master Andrew Breitbart and…..” in George’s posts, unless you are referring to a like-minded ability to extrapolate on truth.
    What is truth? Well, that seems to be different for many people this day and age. However, when the rubber meets the road, there are absolutely absolutes, thus you can actually discover the truth.
    “The truth of the matter is”….how many times do we hear that every time a talking head is given the microphone? What is the truth……of a particular subject for debate? For most it seems to be what boils down to a heart-felt ‘feeling”. However, truth can come forward based on the accumulation of facts.
    And the fact of the matter is Rush, Glen, Sarah, Bill, Carl, Ann, Charles……they all have a knowledge and ability that far exceeds anyone on the left, thus the reason for the ratings. It’s a now-brainer……it is the actual truth of the matter.

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  6. George Rebane Avatar

    Paul, unfortunately and unintentionally I have again eluded you. I cast no judgements save the attempt to illuminate the vast barricades between our widely divergent views of reality. However, your comment indicates that you are quite sanguine with the cited Pelline post. Perhaps I err.

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  7. Paul Emery Avatar
    Paul Emery

    George
    For the record, I don’t appreciate or support the type of language you refer to. However you consistently characterize the “left” in a demeaning manner that would justify the same level or response.
    However, the rhetoric used in the post that you refer to is mild compared to Glen Beck.
    “I’m thinking about killing Michael Moore, and I’m wondering if I could kill him myself, or if I would need to hire somebody to do it. … No, I think I could.”
    or Rush Linbaugh
    “You know who deserves a posthumous Medal of Honor? James Earl Ray. We miss you, James. Godspeed.”
    I can go on and on. Why not condemn all language of that kind and maintain a civil dialogue. As much as I didn’t support most of Ronald Reagan’s policies I appreciated his style which was always respectful but very direct.
    Mike Sherman
    Somehow I never equated television ratings with intelligence.

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  8. Todd Juvinall Avatar
    Todd Juvinall

    I always give Paul a break because he is an unabashed liberal and he has strong opinions about the right. He does use code words to describe his derision. He uses “developer” “slimeball” and many other colorful terms to describe the right. He does refrain from using those terms on people like Ed Schultz, Maddow, Matthews and Dean among others. So, I usually don’t take it too seriously when Paul or other liberals make requests from conservatives for some sort of comparisons.

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  9. Greg Goodknight Avatar
    Greg Goodknight

    “And the fact of the matter is Rush, Glen, Sarah, Bill, Carl, Ann, Charles……they all have a knowledge and ability that far exceeds anyone on the left, thus the reason for the ratings.”
    -Mike Sherman, even though I’m not sure who your Charles or Carl are, I’m afraid that’s as silly as anything I’ve heard from the loony left who think Olberman and Maddow are just speaking truth to power.
    -Paul Emery, you seem to be saying, ‘well, yes, Pelline and Frisch pull the same crap as Beck and Company, but George can’t call Jeff and Steve on it until he denounces those national figures’.
    For one thing, none of the right wing pundits and media figures register as decline-to-state and proclaim themselves part of the great middle.
    Pelline, in particular, has spectacularly double standards for his friends on the left vs. what he’ll allow the folks who aren’t his friends on the left. And he’ll not follow his own claimed standards when he posts on this and on Steele’s blog.
    In short, both Pelline and Frisch can dish it out, but they can’t take it.

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  10. Paul Emery Avatar
    Paul Emery

    Todd
    I didn’t realize “developer” was a derogatory word…

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  11. Greg Goodknight Avatar
    Greg Goodknight

    Paul, do you think the average KVMR listener thinks “developer” is a positive or neutral word?

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  12. Steven Frisch Avatar
    Steven Frisch

    If I couldn’t take it I would not be here. I think I’ve proved I can take it. The reality is if you are going to dish it out we are not going to sit back without countering your crap.
    In a previous post I recommended a truce—a real truce not a bullshyte one where you go back to titling posts with my name, reposting from Jeff’s blog, or allowing your posters to make personal attacks.
    If Rebane and Steele are game, I am.
    If not–I will keep attacking their ideas by name at every possible opportunity.

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  13. Greg Goodknight Avatar
    Greg Goodknight

    George, it isn’t the “so-called Nolan Chart”. David Nolan, co-founder of the Libertarian Party, really was the one who refined and popularized this two dimensional model to displace the polarizing, one dimensional left-right model. The Nolan Chart gives form to an otherwise difficult to explain concept.
    You may remember Carl Sagan’s explanation of living in Flatland as an exercise for understanding how difficult it is to imagine more than 3 physical dimensions… It turns out getting Left-Right partisans to grok the Nolan Chart is similar to the problem of getting Flatlanders to look UP.
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flatland
    David Nolan died of a stroke in Tucson last week, on Nov 21, two days shy of his 67th birthday.

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  14. George Rebane Avatar

    Paul, I characterize the local left’s promotion of its ideology as being in hubristic error. I have explained the source of my perception, we live in different universes. They no doubt view me and mine similarly. If you judge their rhetoric to be equivalent to mine, then you have illustrated yet another aspect of our division which derails dialogue.
    Greg, yes, that’s the correct Nolan of the chart fame. Sorry to hear of his death. And I fully agree with your Flatlander analogy.

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  15. George Rebane Avatar

    SteveF, whatever makes you think that I would want you to stop posting your counterpoints. For my readers of all persuasions they serve as visible, constant, and substantiating memorials to the differences between our philosophies and powers of your argument. If you’re happy, I’m happy.
    I will continue referring to what I believe to be the errors of the multifariously labeled leftists. You will only feel my repartees to the extent that you identify with the referenced political classes. In receiving your counters, I am relieved of such secondary labors.
    That you attack me personally indicates that you believe I am the lone holder of such beliefs, and have been able to garner a large and ignorant audience. As hard as that may be to believe, neither is the case.

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  16. Greg Goodknight Avatar
    Greg Goodknight

    George, if you’ve not read Thomas Sowell’s “A Conflict of Visions”, you should. We live in the same universe, but Sowell makes a case for two dominant visions of human nature which he calls constrained and unconstrained. Pelline and Co. would call these “idiots and the enlightened”. So might Todd J., but Todd (no offence intended,Todd) would have the categories reversed from Jeff’s.
    The unconstrained vision of the anointed is where our coercive Utopians’s hope springs eternal. The constrained or tragic view would rather trust to freedom of choice and the rule of law that doesn’t bend with the wind to minimize the unintended side effects of the latest harebrained scheme gone wild.
    By the way, Sowell doesn’t divide these into left and right. There are examples of both in each of those camps, though the left is typically unconstrained, and vice versa.
    The unconstrained among us might be more receptive to the same basic ideas from George Lakoff’s “Moral Politics: How Liberals and Conservatives Think”.

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  17. George Rebane Avatar

    Thanks Greg for those references. As I have tried to point out, I also am not comfortable with the single dimensional version of the political spectrum. For example, for at least a century there have been progressives in both parties.
    And the Nolan chart is also a mighty attempt that falls short. But in its study, I have to conclude that today’s liberals etc are operating in disguise. They are actually authoritarians as indicated on the Nolan chart. Their continual constraints on personal liberties separates them even from the liberals of the Woodstock age. Today’s left unabashedly wants to control both our economic and personal behaviors.
    Such people have every right to promote that. My bone with them is that their rhetoric is at odds with the laws and regulations that they pass. They don’t fess up to the truth of their beliefs and therefore bamboozle the electorate.

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  18. Greg Goodknight Avatar
    Greg Goodknight

    Steve, you seem to have a hard time posting without resorting to expletives or crude caricatures, misspelled or not, or translated into another language, though I will agree you do have thicker skin than Pelline.
    I can’t be interested in your so-called truce while I am barred from Pelline’s blog for posting more respectfully than Pelline ever does here or at Steele’s. I believe you took a special dislike to me when I didn’t let you get away with describing yourself on The Union blogs as just a regular guy without conflicts of interest while, on Prop 23 and AB32, you were (and are) a walking, talking conflict of interest as President of the truly misleadingly named Sierra Business Council.

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  19. Greg Goodknight Avatar
    Greg Goodknight

    George, any simplified reference frame will fall short of reality; maybe someday a usable three dimensional representation for all political thought will be developed, but with so many choking on just two dimensions, this should be it for now.
    The left-right paradigm is about two centuries old. Paradigm shifts take time and good luck.

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  20. Greg Goodknight Avatar
    Greg Goodknight

    George, one more before I give it a rest… the site you found with this version of The Quiz is interesting…
    http://www.quiz2d.com/quiz/quiz.php
    As usual, the shadings of the questions I find a bit constraining, but this one has me on the Left-Leaning Freedom Lover chunk of the Libertarian quadrant, close to the Radical Libertarian section.
    I’m guessing Pelline would still say Extreme Right Wing, but one should consider the source. The farther to the left, the more anything not Left is indistinguishable from Right.

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  21. Jeff Pelline Avatar
    Jeff Pelline

    Greg,
    You’ve been talking to yourself in the last three posts here. Why not give it a rest? LOL.

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  22. Barry Pruett Avatar

    Moderation in the protection of liberty is no virtue; extremism in the defense of freedom is no vice.
    Keep going Greg…I am enjoying the read as I watch OSU thump Michigan.

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  23. Barry Pruett Avatar

    The extreme leftist in Nevada County (Pelline, NCDCC, Frisch, et al.) need the conservatives in California to behave like liberals. The fact of the matter is that our extreme leftists statewide need to moderate in the defense of freedom. The rest of the country has realized this…along with Germany, France, and England…California will follow (most likely kicking and screaming like babies). LOL.

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  24. Todd Juvinall Avatar
    Todd Juvinall

    Greg keep it up, you are so much smarter than Pelline etal and I enjoy reading your stuff.

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  25. Barry Pruett Avatar

    Let us remember that it is leftists who support convicted cop-killers, organize to prevent other Americans from exercising their constitutionally guaranteed rights, consistently threaten violence, and otherwise have a long history of supporting foreign powers who wish our nation and its freedoms harm.
    For many years, the anti-American culture of the extreme left has been largely ignored. Like a cancer running through the body politic, the culture of hating America has metasticised. It is now “uncool” to have a flag in the yard, support our troops or believe in American exceptionalism.
    http://biggovernment.com/bdarby/2010/05/03/the-extreme-left-a-ticking-time-bomb/

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  26. Jeff Pelline Avatar
    Jeff Pelline

    Be careful of your extremist labeling of us moderates. We have a flag in our yard(s) too. Always have.

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  27. Russ Steele Avatar

    Keep going Greg . . .
    I think that readers will note that you have contributed to the discussion, while Jeff P could only summoned up his superior intellectual capacity to chide you for your contributions. Most revealing!

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  28. George Rebane Avatar

    Greg, you and we all can be thankful that they are constantly watching us. Fortunately, we are never without an audience, especially when certain buttons get pushed. Stand by for the next post.

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  29. Greg Goodknight Avatar
    Greg Goodknight

    Jeff, I’ve apparently been talking to you, Barry, Todd and probably others, along with answering George and Steve.
    Barry, Jeff just thinks if you Republicans were more like Democrats he’d like you more. It’s similar to Pelosi, as the current Congress was seated after the whomping Dems gave R’s two years ago (a love tap compared to the thumping three weeks ago), claiming the lopsided numbers meant there’d be more bipartisanship, not less.
    Meaning, of course, that bipartisanship for Democrats really does refer to Republicans caving and agreeing with Democrats. No need for that in California now, Dems own the place. Lock, stock and barrel. We’ll see how well that’s working out in 2012 and 2014.

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  30. Jeff Pelline Avatar
    Jeff Pelline

    The “we” you refer to is being marginalized by the day. Your “fellow” Republicans in our county don’t even post here. Why not? Stay tuned for more of the same.

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  31. Michael Anderson Avatar
    Michael Anderson

    I have been in Southern California since the beginning of the week, but catching snippets from the ongoing Nevada County Left v. Right Blog War with some dismay.
    While staying with my in-laws I was perusing their library and came across Mortimer J. Adler’s “Six Great Ideas.” I have described my political position as Libertarian Progressive and I am quite comfortable with how this fits with those ideas.
    Truth. Goodness. Beauty.
    Justice. Equality. Liberty.
    Two triads: one dependent on Truth and the other dependent on Justice. For the Libertarian Progressive, Justice is the Prime Directive.
    For the unabashed liberal, egalitarianism is the pivot for justice and liberty. For the unabashed libertarian, liberty is the pivot for equality and justice.
    I don’t have time to find a liberal quote that exemplifies this, but Barry above provides the example for libertarianism: “Moderation in the protection of liberty is no virtue; extremism in the defense of freedom is no vice.”
    Extreme equality stamps out liberty, and extreme liberty stamps out equality. Without justice, neither equality nor liberty is possible.

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  32. Greg Goodknight Avatar
    Greg Goodknight

    No, the “we” I was referring to is the entire country, and they can’t be my “fellow” Republicans because I’ve never been a Republican, nor do I have any desire to be. Left-Libertarian and Republican doesn’t mix well except over wine and cheese.
    I’d rather be a Democrat again but I doubt the party will return to its anti-Federalist roots in my lifetime. However, stranger things have happened.
    C’mon, Jeff. Take the test:
    http://www.quiz2d.com/quiz/quiz.php

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  33. Jeff Pelline Avatar
    Jeff Pelline

    Michael,
    This blog is extreme right, not “right.”

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  34. Jeff Pelline Avatar
    Jeff Pelline

    I also LOL at this “test.” It’s so old. Dick Phillips brought it to The Union a long time ago, jumping up and down insisting we run it. We did, on the opinion page. NC is stuck in a time warp. Sometimes that’s quaint, sometimes it not.

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  35. Greg Goodknight Avatar
    Greg Goodknight

    There are multiple versions; this is one of many. Give it a try, Jeff. It’s fun and it’s free! 😉

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  36. Barry Pruett Avatar

    Jeff: You profess to be middle of the road…yet your handful of admirers represent the extreme leftists in Nevada County? Does that not tell you anything?

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  37. Scott Obermuller Avatar

    Michael, the maxim at the end of your last post is interesting and I get the gist. But the trouble is that if you and I (and others) were to write down what we believe are the meanings of the key words, we would have a few different ideas. Also, when using a word like ‘equality’, The meaning in terms of how it relates to our American govt. and it’s citizens is a totally different story from one person to the next. As an example, I believe that following the Constitution and the Bill Of Rights leads to full equality (extreme, if you wish) without impinging on anyones liberties.

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  38. Jeff Pelline Avatar
    Jeff Pelline

    Barry,
    These “talking points” of yours are an old saw. Don’t worry about my “admirers.” They are diverse, growing and hardly “a handful.” In our county, moderates and the Left are getting together. Our county is changing, and you are on the wrong side of change for whatever reason. When it comes to “admirers,” you lost every percent in our county when you ran for clerk recorder, one of the biggest local political drubbings in history! You are marginalizing yourself more every day, too. Why don’t any “fellow” Republicans post on your blog or this blog? What does that tell you?

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  39. Barry Pruett Avatar

    Jeff: I do not profess to be “middle of the road.” I am an unabashed fiscal conservative and social moderate. That is who I am and I am not trying to mislead anyone. Unlike you who is dishonest intellectually with regards to your poltical leanings, I am comfortable with myself. Nobody in this community believes that you are a moderate…it is however funny to hear you say it. Only in the eyes of Jeff Pelline (our local “middle of the roader”) is it marginalizing to defend liberty! LOL.
    So do you care to answer the question posed? No, of course not. You have not written an article in support of any conservative…even one’s with moderate views such as Fiorina and Whitman. “The lady doth protest too much.”
    Far from moderation, you are a lefty extremist…just embrace it and make your life more tolerable. LOL

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  40. Jeff Pelline Avatar
    Jeff Pelline

    Barry,
    You do not “know” this community. You are holed up with like-minded people. Your idea of diversity is a trip to SPD in Nevada City. LOL.

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  41. Sarah H Avatar
    Sarah H

    It must be noted, again, that Steve Frisch has promised on multiple occasions to “leave rebane’s blog and never return” only to show his lack of integrity by returning time and time again. He has proven himself not worthy of another man’s trust.

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  42. Barry Pruett Avatar

    Thank you for making my point Jeff.

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  43. Barry Pruett Avatar

    Classi John Stoos –
    “Imagine if folks had told the Republicans after the 1852 and 1856 elections that they needed to drop this whole opposition to slavery talk if they wanted to ever be a major national party.”
    Moderation would have destroyed liberty…I love Stoos.

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  44. Greg Goodknight Avatar
    Greg Goodknight

    Pelline is just trying the classic “bandwagon” propaganda line. Empty rhetoric to try to convince others of the popularity of his favorite politics, and anyone not following that parade is missing out on the future.
    Nationally, the left got whipped at the polls a few weeks ago. California’s gone to the dogs, or at least the Unions, on it’s way to bankruptcy. Dems will be the only ones holding the bag when the bell tolls.

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  45. Barry Pruett Avatar

    …with no bailout from the feds.

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  46. Nuff said Avatar
    Nuff said

    “Imagine if folks had told the Republicans after the 1852 and 1856 elections that they needed to drop this whole opposition to slavery talk if they wanted to ever be a major national party.”
    Let’s see … in one case, the Republican political leaders were fighting for people of color. In the other case, they fighting against it … Yeah, Barry, Stoos is a genius. LOL.
    It’s also funny to listen to you and Pelline argue over who best knows this community, considering neither of you have been around here for much more than decade. One of you is removed as editor of the local paper and the other gets beat in a landslide election. Doesn’t seem like either of you have a good grasp, or good reputation around here.
    BTW … “leftists who support convicted cop-killers, organize to prevent other Americans from exercising their constitutionally guaranteed rights, consistently threaten violence, and otherwise have a long history of supporting foreign powers who wish our nation and its freedoms harm.”
    This is the hateful, labeling kind back & forth BS between the dems and repubs that we Americans are so sick and tired of (as you found out in your campaign). Apparently you don’t get that, so we’ll assume you’ve hung up your political aspirations.

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  47. Barry Pruett Avatar

    Nuff said: First, I know who you are. Second, I have never been a politician, nor will I ever be. My views will be expressed without regards to political concerns. I am only concerned about the truth. Sorry the truth hurts your feelings. LOL.

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  48. Dixon Cruickshank Avatar
    Dixon Cruickshank

    and otherwise have a long history of supporting foreign powers who wish our nation and its freedoms harm.”
    Let me see here, which of our recent Speakers of the House visited Syria – against everyones else’s wishes and to what end ??
    To whom do we owe the brillence of giving the Palistinions another $150M on top of the $400M we just gave them ??
    PS – Gaza is much better off economically than the US, their economy is booming

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  49. Greg Goodknight Avatar
    Greg Goodknight

    “Be careful of your extremist labeling of us moderates.” – Pelline
    Jeff, never has a statement of yours needed a smiley more than this one. Might there be anyone you worked with at The Union that could stand behind this claim of yours? I can’t remember anyone standing up for this moderation claim of yours… actually having an obvious moderate claim you as a fellow traveler would do wonders to make this claim credible.
    Remember, a “moderate” in San Francisco is different than a moderate elsewhere. I think just knowing a Republican makes one a moderate when in Baghdad by the Bay.

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