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George Rebane

The local blogs and my emails have been buzzing with questions and charges of how non-profit 501c3  organizations (like SBC) and private California corporations (like CABPRO) should deport themselves.  Apropos such organizations, attorney Barry Pruett (Inside NC Politics) has given good tutorials on the relevant sections of the tax code.  My problem with the Sierra Business Council arose during recent KVMR commentaries and on-air Prop23 discussions with Mr Steven Frisch, president and CEO of SBC.

In my mind the situation was pretty clear and simple.  SBC gets a big hunk of its funding from government grants that are dispensed from the federal government’s general fund into which all the country’s taxpayers pay.  SBC says it spends these monies in support of various federal and state environmental programs.  And it follows that the more complex and extensive the regulatory environment is for such programs, the more SBC can propose to do and then receive more funding from its government and institutional sources.

ManBehindCurtain If Prop23 fails, California will feel the full fury of AB32.  Newly minted carbon control, monitoring, and enforcement regulations will multiply like fleas and ticks after a warm summer rain.  It will be a windfall for NGOs like SBC.  As a salaried employee of SBC, it is in Mr Frisch’s self-interest to promote the continued relevance and funding of his employer and his employment.  So it is natural for Mr Frisch to appear at as many public forums and media outlets as possible speaking against Prop23 – in doing so, he is simply a professional singing for his supper.

My point here is that when he does make such statements, his audience should know his self-interests in the matter.  In my view, he should not pass himself off as just another concerned private citizen purveying debatable ‘information’ about AB32’s effect on California’s economy.  Now, our local leftwingers are opposed to Mr Frisch (and anyone else) having to make such disclosures, and KVMR has made it clear that it also felt it was wrong of me to point out SBC’s relationship to the implementation of AB32.  In fact, their position was that the money trail from the American taxpayer to the SBC coffers was only an unsubstantiated opinion that I hold.

Having said all this, the local left has countered with questions about CABPRO which is a private California corporation that espouses publicly stated conservative positions, causes, and candidates as it is allowed by law.  All this has been done in a so far successful rush to divert attention from the blatantly progressive SBC that, I believe, promotes liberal causes under the guise of a publicly funded (government and tax deferred grants, and tax-deductible contributions) non-partisan organization.  As the wizard said, ‘Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain!’ 

I suppose all this is just local politics in action.  And I again remind the reader that I am a member and former board member of CABPRO.  However, in these commentaries I speak for myself as a private citizen and without the approval and/or endorsement of CABPRO.

Posted in , ,

102 responses to “… of shoes and ships and sealing wax (and SBC)”

  1. Jeff Peline Avatar
    Jeff Peline

    George,
    That picture you’re using might be copyrighted. You might want to be careful about that.

    Like

  2. Todd Juvinall Avatar
    Todd Juvinall

    George, good article.

    Like

  3. Greg Goodknight Avatar
    Greg Goodknight

    George, what you don’t understand is that SBC income is not a factor in Steve Frisch’s activism, because his motives are pure. He just wants to do the right thing by his community.
    This was the point of an old Tom Lehrer lyric…
    We are the Folk Song Army,
    Every one of us…. Cares!
    We all hate poverty, war and destruction
    Unlike the rest of you Squares!
    Pelline just placed me on moderation at his blog with a trumped up claim of me being insulting. This was after he called me an “Arse”. Double standards at work, nothing new for Jeff.

    Like

  4. Jeff Peline Avatar
    Jeff Peline

    Greg,
    No, you made a demeaning, insulting remark about a fellow reader because you couldn’t win the argument on merits. You probably are better suited here.
    -Jeff

    Like

  5. Jeff Peline Avatar
    Jeff Peline

    BTW, John Stoos, who is more conservative than any of you, continues to comment freely on my blog. He is civil, respectful and provides intelligent insights. You should get to know John better — perhaps some of his civility will rub off.
    http://churchofthekingsacramento.com/index2.htm

    Like

  6. Greg Goodknight Avatar
    Greg Goodknight

    No, I didn’t Jeff, and your double standards were showing through.
    A poster, a Pat Wynne, I believe, was incredulous that it was 113 degrees in LA recently, and that it had never been that hot when she was living there. I made a a fairly obvious point to the effect that, well, while she might be really old (I don’t know her), human lifetimes are too short to use to make climate determinations. Maybe Jeff would post it here, I didn’t save a copy.
    Jeff has been itching to get rid of me precisely because I was making points on the merits, time after time, and couldn’t be dismissed as easily as a creationist right winger like Stoos.

    Like

  7. Jeff Peline Avatar
    Jeff Peline

    Greg,
    You bore me. But if you prove to be civil in your moderated posts, I’m happy to let you comment freely again. I’ve already cleared one of them.

    Like

  8. Greg Goodknight Avatar
    Greg Goodknight

    Jeff, I’ve been remarkably civil in an incredibly hostile and insulting environment, your blog. I sincerely doubt it’s “boredom” that drives you to allow that, and I’m not doing it for your entertainment.

    Like

  9. Jeff Peline Avatar
    Jeff Peline

    Greg,
    John Stoos enjoys the environment and holds up fine.

    Like

  10. Paul Emery Avatar
    Paul Emery

    “KVMR has made it clear that it also felt it was wrong of me to point out SBC’s relationship to the implementation of AB32. In fact, their position was that the money trail from the American taxpayer to the SBC coffers was only an unsubstantiated opinion that I hold.”
    Do we have to go over this again. It is very frustrating trying to carry on a meaningful discussion on these pages when deep, thoughtful and detailed discussions are dismissed whenever convenient to make a point. What was wrong George is that you completely disregarded the protocol that I established for the show. Hopefully it was your inexperience in media forums that led you to disregard my instructions.
    Rather than rewrite I will repost an earlier piece I wrote from “AB32/Prop23 is Very Relevant to Nevada County”
    “I am profoundly disappointed that I have to respond to the characterization of my “instructions” concerning the discussion of Prop 23 that I hosted for KVMR radio on Wed Sept 1 between George Rebane and Steve Frisch.
    My biggest concern when I proposed the conversation was that it turn into a debate about other issues rather than the pro’s and con’s of prop 23 and I had a particular concern that callers would engage in personal attacks on my guests. In order to address that question I made it clear in all advanced promotion and description of the show that questions be general in nature for both guests and not directed to an individual guest. Also, in my conversations with my guests prior to the show I made it clear that this was not a debate but a discussion and that the program was about Prop 23 and that personal agenda’s and opinions my guests have of each other was not relevant to the topic. Protecting the dignity and opinions of the guests from unfair hit and run attacks is a top priority when I do a radio show..
    So when George asked if he could read an opening statement, which was not discussed as part of the format, I reluctantly, with Steve’s consent, allowed. I thought that my desire for this radio show not to be confrontational was very clear. I was extremely disappointed when in George’s introduction statements he launched into his characterization that Steve was a ” pro-government lobbyist” among other descriptions that I won’t repeat since they are already part of this blog.
    That was absolutely what I was trying to avoid. It was completely unfair to Steve because he was not expecting a direct confrontation in an intro statement that was not part of the original concept. To be fair I should have stopped the show at that time and gone off air to straighten up the situation.
    In all my years in radio I don’t recall a guest being put to such a disadvantage and I apologized later to Steve about my lack of control in allowing this to happen.
    The bottom line is that calling Steve “pro-government lobbyist” was a characterization that could not be accepted as fact and demanded a response from Steve So there we go right at the start we’re off topic and engaging in a two way confrontation, which is exactly what I was trying to avoid.”

    Like

  11. Todd Juvinall Avatar
    Todd Juvinall

    I have read Pelline’s blog and read as he caves to the really far lefty nuts there in their desire to cleanse themselves of conservatives. I read his threats to Greg, Stoos, Mike and the rest. I never see any threats to his buds. He is a hypocrite simple as that. He “may” let Greg post. Well isn’t that special? Sorry, the left is intolerant of dissent and always looking for excuses to shut off anyone who doesn’t agree. Pelline is just a run of the mill liberal, hubris abounding.

    Like

  12. Greg Goodknight Avatar
    Greg Goodknight

    Pelline, Stoos is a born again creationist preacher, unable to sway anyone on matters of science. Nor has he had any village idiot turned loose against him and allowed to post lies in order to defame him.
    One specific lie by Doug Keachie was that I had in the past claimed there would be no sunspots in the current cycle, made specifically to try to damage my credibility on climate matters. You’ve allowed him and others to Troll on your watch.

    Like

  13. Who Cares Avatar
    Who Cares

    calling Steve “pro-government lobbyist” was a characterization that could be accepted as fact

    Like

  14. Todd Juvinall Avatar
    Todd Juvinall

    Pelline, you need to stop threatening folks man. Grow up.

    Like

  15. Jeff Peline Avatar
    Jeff Peline

    Todd,
    Here’s an analogy you can understand: A person’s blog is like their living room. You can decide whether you want to come over and poop there — or not.

    Like

  16. George Rebane Avatar
    George Rebane

    No Paul, we don’t have to go over the whole thing. Please reread my post, I did not contradict anything you claimed. Even though I remember only your exhortation not to inject personally directed remarks during the discussion, I recall no requirement not to state what we believe to be fact during our turn to speak, and especially facts that would properly frame the program for the listener.
    You quote me twice as having called SteveF a “government lobbyist”. Could you please point me to where I did that?
    To this day I disagree with the KVMR policy of denying their listeners such data. However, in the unlikely event that the occasion should again arise, I will explicitly clarify my remarks beforehand.

    Like

  17. Greg Goodknight Avatar
    Greg Goodknight

    Jeff. you’ve allowed Doug Keachie to stand in your living room and make, time after time, personal attacks against another ‘guest’ in your living room.
    I suspect you were doing the same in TheUnion’s living room.
    What does that say about your living room and how you allow your guests to conduct themselves?

    Like

  18. Jeff Peline Avatar
    Jeff Peline

    Paul,
    Why don’t you see if George Foster is up to some commentary on KVMR? Though of the same political stripe as “the other George,” I promise you’ll find it more enlightening.

    Like

  19. Paul Emery Avatar
    Paul Emery

    George
    Since you asked from “AB32/Prop23 is Very Relevant to Nevada County”
    “In short, I welcome the opportunity to discuss the Prop23 issue with Mr Frisch, whom I consider to be a pro-government lobbyist appearing here in his professional capacity.”

    Like

  20. Steve Enos Avatar
    Steve Enos

    Speaking of not-for-profits and their political actions, how about this, how about the National Organization for Marriage and what they have been up to?
    Here’s a link to the story ans some additinal information about this:
    http://yubanet.com/california/NOM-Charitable-Organization-Violates-Tax-Exempt-Status-by-Campaigning-for-Senate-Candidate.php

    Like

  21. George Rebane Avatar
    George Rebane

    Thanks Paul, for some reason my text search did not pick that up.
    JeffP, please behave yourself.

    Like

  22. Todd Juvinall Avatar
    Todd Juvinall

    JeffP, based on your statement about living rooms, I suspect you have fecal matter all over the internet. You are just a hypocrite man. Fess up, it is cathartic to let it out. Go ahead, we won’t laugh. Snickering.

    Like

  23. Steven Frisch Avatar
    Steven Frisch

    I’m sorry George but could you clear something up for me? Is CABPRO a “private California corporation” or is it a 501c4 organization as has been claimed by Martin Light and Barry Pruitt?

    Like

  24. Steve Enos Avatar
    Steve Enos

    From the latest CABPRO newsletter:
    “While CABPRO is a not-for-profit organization, we have deliberately declined the 501c3 status for two reasons. The private corporation designation allows us to keep our membership confidential, and it frees us from unnecessary outside controls”.

    Like

  25. Steve Enos Avatar
    Steve Enos

    Barry Pruett posted on his blog the following:
    “As we all know CABPRO is a corporation formed under 501(c)(4) of the Internal Revenue Code.”

    Like

  26. George Rebane Avatar
    George Rebane

    SteveF – I think as a private California corporation, it’s up to its management and board to decide what information about itself it would want to reveal.

    Like

  27. Steven Frisch Avatar
    Steven Frisch

    Actually George about the last point, I totally agree with you. If CABPRO is a private, for profit, California corporation it is entirely up to them to decide when and to whom they wish to disclose information.
    If that is the case they should stop lying about who they are. And they should have correct Mr. Pruett when he provided false information on THEIR BLOG.

    Like

  28. Steven Frisch Avatar
    Steven Frisch

    [Unfortunately SteveF posted a comment here that displayed his faulty ability to reason, and concluded with a tirade of calling me names. Consequently, for losing his cool, he has earned a time out. gjr]

    Like

  29. Steven Frisch Avatar
    Steven Frisch

    By the way, if CABPRO is a private for profit corporation then be honest about why they are in business and what they are advocating for, their own individual businesses ability to make a profit. Not some non-profit mission or some arcane social good or special interpretation of economics. They formed an organization to advance their own profit.
    Do you even know the meaning of the word HYPOCRITE?
    Don’t you realize that is EXACTLY what you are charging me with above?

    Like

  30. Bob Hobert Avatar
    Bob Hobert

    I’ve learned from the tirades above that A. Mr. Frisch is a taxpayer funded pro-government environmental lobbyist and B. KVMR has a policy of denying their listeners such information. What takes you fellows so many words? Oh well, back to reading Atlas Shrugged. Ayn Rand was so perceptive…

    Like

  31. Steven Frisch Avatar
    Steven Frisch

    OK Bob lets see If I have this straight.
    CABPRO should be able to lie the the public about their tax status and I follow the rule and I am the bad guy?
    You guys are just stooopid.

    Like

  32. Bob Hobert Avatar
    Bob Hobert

    I think this whole page is stupid. The discussion could have been about AB32 and Prop23.

    Like

  33. Steven Frisch Avatar
    Steven Frisch

    George picked the topic, George allowed CABPRO, an organization he is a former board member of, links to, and is supportive of, to misrepresent themselves to the community.
    George si the one who is morally challenged here.

    Like

  34. Jeff Peline Avatar
    Jeff Peline

    Also, CABPRO’s newsletter states:
    “While CABPRO is a not-for-profit organization, we have deliberately declined the 501c3 status for two reasons.”
    So Barry Pruett said the group is 501c4 nonprofit, George said it is a “private California corporation,” and the newsletter said it is a “not-for-profit” corporation.
    Which is it? Don’t people who are donating to CABPRO deserve to know?

    Like

  35. George Rebane Avatar
    George Rebane

    SteveF – you are accusing of CABPRO lying to “the public about their tax status”. Can you point to where such lies were advanced? You also use the word IF, and then reason as if you had not used that conditional. For the record, I have never misrepresented CABPRO nor allowed them to be misrepresented on RR. Nor have I ever seen CABPRO misrepresent themselves in any public statement or forum. Again, please substantiate your charges. Your assessment of their status is in error.
    And your charge of hypocrite is curious. I have not accused you of wrong doing in your advocacy of issues that benefit SBC. But because you are a taxpayer funded 501c3, I believe it proper that you declare your professional status when you’re advocating issues that would directly benefit SBC at taxpayer cost. When I was in corporate life and a major rainmaker, my affiliations and benefits were always known whether I spoke to the media, at a conference, school, or customer presentation.
    An example of a proper statement for you to make in your introductory remarks on issues such as AB32 is, “Apropos to what I’m about to say, I want you to know that SBC receives a major part of its funding from various government agencies and tax preferred institutions. My successful advocacy for (insert issue/cause) may well contribute to the future funding of SBC.” Then go ahead and sing your heart out.
    Finally, yes this piece is about you and your role in promoting AB32. And you get credit for using words such as “morally challenged” instead of some of that other stuff. Now if you could only explain to the readers the line of reasoning that makes you identify such a challenge for me.

    Like

  36. George Rebane Avatar
    George Rebane

    JeffP – You unfortunately reason as if those descriptors are somehow mutually contradictory. This may explain why you have other problems with what people say and write, and explains some of the obvious frustrations that you express.
    Rest assured that CABPRO members and benefactors know exactly the kind of organization they are supporting. Their deserts are fully met.

    Like

  37. Jeff Peline Avatar
    Jeff Peline

    George,
    Why doesn’t CABPRO just publicly confirm its status for members, benefactors and the community at large?

    Like

  38. Steven Frisch Avatar
    Steven Frisch

    Just answer the question George. Is CABPRO a non-profit or a private for profit corporation?
    Spare me the other bull hockey. Every time I speak on behalf of my organization I identify myself as the President of the Sierra Business Council, which is a 501 c 3 non profit.
    The evidence of CABPRO’s claims of being a non-profit are all over the place for the public to see. It is in their membership letter, on their web site, in a blog post on their web site, and in blog posts on your site and Russ’s site, which Martin light, the ED of CABPRO reads and comments on. I have repeatedly substantiated my claim.
    There is nothing wrong with CABPRO being a for profit corporation. Over on Pelline’s site I clearly stated they should have a perfect right to state their case proudly, a right which all of us as Americans share.
    There is something wrong when two former directors of CABPRO have such substantially different explanations of their corporate status and the ED will not even answer the question.
    There is something wrong when a former ED of the organization says they are not a non-profit and the current ED allows that claim to sit on their web site.
    There is something wrong when CABPRO questions my right to speak out on public issues, and then endorses candidates.
    By the way much of the things you state as fact about SBC above are wrong, but there is no point in even discussing that with you and your ilk.

    Like

  39. Michael Anderson Avatar
    Michael Anderson

    Wow. Just came into this circus after working all day. Seems like everyone needs to take a powder.
    The laws are very clear. This will work itself out according to what is required by law. If everyone would just focus on that for a moment we could get to the crux, and then move on to things more substantial.

    Like

  40. George Rebane Avatar
    George Rebane

    JeffP and SteveF – I am not an agent of or for CABPRO, just a member. As a private corporation CABPRO will disclose information about itself as appropriate through its board and/or management. (This apparently is a difficult point for you both.) Its ED is your proper source of that informaton.
    “By the way much of the things you state as fact about SBC above are wrong, but there is no point in even discussing that with you and your ilk.” I have tried to be meticulously accurate within the scope of my description of SBC. I would appreciate it if you would correct my errors. (My ilk would be equally appreciative.)
    For lack of a better course, I will ascribe your silence on my other requests/points as falling in my favor until you choose to append the record.

    Like

  41. Steven Frisch Avatar
    Steven Frisch

    Lets see how this works….talk smack….. get called on it….pass the buck…..deny responsibility.
    You are one stand up guy!

    Like

  42. Jeff Peline Avatar
    Jeff Peline

    George,
    “Just a member”? You also have said you are a former CABPRO board member. This feels very “balk balk balk balk!” But maybe it’s just me.

    Like

  43. Paul Emery Avatar
    Paul Emery

    Even by George’s admission CABPRO is a lobby, (When asked if they were a Lobby George responded “Paul, Todd will speak for himself, but again the answer to your CABPRO query is a resounding YES.”) Shouldn’t they be registered as such?

    Like

  44. Todd Juvinall Avatar
    Todd Juvinall

    George, these guys are floundering. This read is great. Keep asking them for the truth and they run for cover. The FUE and rent seeker don’t even know the law. Very good, your ilk salutes you George!

    Like

  45. Steve Enos Avatar
    Steve Enos

    It is really simple isn’t it?
    From the CABPRO website:
    “While CABPRO is a not-for-profit organization, we have deliberately declined the 501c3 status for two reasons. The private corporation designation allows us to keep our membership confidential, and it frees us from unnecessary outside controls”.
    CABPRO promotes and states they are a “not-for-profit”, then states they are a “private corporation”.
    So CABPRO is a “not-for-profit” “private corporation”?
    Barry Pruett posted on his blog the following:
    “As we all know CABPRO is a corporation formed under 501(c)(4) of the Internal Revenue Code.”

    Like

  46. Todd Juvinall Avatar
    Todd Juvinall

    Does that mean it is a corp that makes no money? Tell us Steveie.

    Like

  47. Anna Haynes Avatar

    George, is CABPRO a nonprofit organization, as they claim to be?

    Like

  48. Anna Haynes Avatar

    Martin Light said CABPRO was a 501(c)(4) when I interviewed him back in March:
    http://ncfocus.blogspot.com/2010/03/q-with-martin-light-executive-director.html

    Like

  49. Steve Enos Avatar
    Steve Enos

    I do believe that 501(c)(4)’s have spending reporting requirments and limits on the amount of their money they can spend on campaign efforts.
    So… Barry says CABPRO is a 501(c)(4)… the CABPRO website states CABPRO is “a not-for-profit organization”.
    Can this simple question be answered with a simple yes or no?… is CABPRO a 501(c)(4) or not?

    Like

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