Rebane's Ruminations
July 2010
S M T W T F S
 123
45678910
11121314151617
18192021222324
25262728293031

ARCHIVES


OUR LINKS


YubaNet
White House Blog
Watts Up With That?
The Union
Sierra Thread
RL “Bob” Crabb
Barry Pruett Blog

George Rebane

Russ Steele and I are a constant thorn in the side of local liberals.  Yesterday Russ addressed the ad hominem vitriol that comes from our neighbors on the left (here and here), and again raised some excellent points on the reception of our writings and ruminations.  As Russ points out, the overwhelming feedback from that quarter simply demonstrates the lack of reading and/or critical thinking skills of the respondents.  To that extent they provide a certain humor content to the rest of our readers.

And to be fair, there is the occasional serious comment where the liberal and collectivist views are presented to counter the point(s) made in the post.  These are appreciated in the extreme and their writers are encouraged to continue contending in the arena of ideas.

But unfortunately when a progressive knows he will be bringing a knife to a gunfight (apologies to Indiana Jones), he resorts to personal attacks on the conservative writers and worse.  The worst part is the compelling nature of the leftwinger to argue and militate for the censoring and expulsion of conservative and libertarian contributors to the public debate.

These self-aggrandized champions of personal freedoms immediately go for the First Amendment throat of their opposite numbers.  They use bizarre logic that argues for the prohibition of conservative ideas broadcast into a population that they contend is mostly liberal.  An example is the aggravation they show to my monthly column in The Union.

That newspaper publishes about 130 op-ed pieces a month of various flavors.  Most of us on the right see a bit of tilt to the left, and I’m sure that the left is convinced of the opposite.  But my little monthly screed is 1/130th of the newspaper’s commentary, yet the progressives howl at the publisher to have my column expunged with the regularity of wolves under a full moon.

This phenomenon is not peculiar only to this remote mountain county, it is a nationwide, and more accurately, an international affliction unique to the left.  How often have you read or seen a conservative columnist call for the censoring, restriction, or removal of a leftwing commentator no matter how egregious his copy?  The left responds to their lack of audience by such nostrums as the Fairness Doctrine that seeks to impose state monitored censorship on dissemination of political speech.

The right would like nothing more than the side-by-side presentation of such opposing views for better to highlight the sinister silliness of socialist solutions.  And the left knows it, hence their tack for advocating simply the removal of conservative voices from the public forum.

Gaia 

This behavior reaches heights of high comedy in Nevada County.  Here leftwing bloggers and commenters decry the right’s paucity of ideas and their negligible audiences.  Yet it is they who constantly editorialize against our ideas, revelations, and arguments.  And it is they who constantly present themselves at their ad hominem best in our comment threads.  There must be something that we are saying to enough people out there that is scaring the living bejeezus, … er, make that Gaia, out of them.

Posted in , ,

123 responses to “The Liberal Fear of Gaia”

  1. Jeff Pellne Avatar
    Jeff Pellne

    Barry,
    You sound really angry.

    Like

  2. Steven Frisch Avatar
    Steven Frisch

    I clearly stated above how you are far right radicals and instead you decided to try to focus on other issues. You are radicals because your philosophy diminishes the work and the value of others, claims to represent the founding values of tis country, but is is organized around an exclusionary principle and a narrow definition of citizenship, freedom and liberty. That is un-American. You are the foreign radicals and we are the native protectors of liberty.

    Like

  3. Todd Juvinall Avatar
    Todd Juvinall

    RL, thanks for trying to clear up where you stand on the political front. However, I am still scratching my head as to your last few posts. You seem to dislike D’s, R’s, TPP libertarians and Greens. What is left? My guess is you need to publicly stay non-aligned for the sake of fairness in your cartoon writings. I can respect that.

    Like

  4. Todd Juvinall Avatar
    Todd Juvinall

    I was reading the Sierra Business Council website to better understand Frish. It is clear now that he doesn’t have a clue about the free market. I remember the SBC and its proponents as far left, mostly grant funded and anti property rights. They have issued propaganda about growth restrictions in the Sierra’s as well as planning recommendations for housing and business. They were funded by the no growth Sunset Magazine owner if my memory serves me right. I also noticed Mr. Frish has a degree in culinary. Is that degree for a chef? My main point is experience. If a person risks their own capital, meets a payroll and has to abide by all the rules of government regulations, then I think they are prepared for serious commentary. If they receive their money from grants, or are an employee of a non profit, I think they cannot be taken seriously as to free enterprise discussions.

    Like

  5. Mikey McD Avatar
    Mikey McD

    Frisch, we clearly have a different definition of liberty. We only look far right because you are so very far left. I will await your answers to Rebane’s credential questions asked earlier. You have never posted comments which reflect you as a “protector of liberty”, fiscally responsible or a fan of free markets…right now you just read like a hateful politician.

    Like

  6. Barry Pruett Avatar

    Like I said, Mr. Pelline is always good for a morning laugh!

    Like

  7. RL Crabb Avatar

    You’re right, Todd. I don’t trust any of the parties now vying for influence in American politics. The party I’d endorse doesn’t exist. I’ve followed politics since I was a teenager and all I’ve seen is demagogery,partisanship, and now endless gridlock which has reached the point where the opposing factions are unable to govern even when they have a majority.
    And my stand on the issues doesn’t have anything to do with how I put together a cartoon. I’d do much better in this business if I marched to the beat of a particular drum. Guess I’m just too dumb to follow orders.

    Like

  8. D. King Avatar
    D. King

    “…organized around an exclusionary principle and a narrow definition of citizenship,…”
    Well Steven, as a member of the Galactic Federation
    of Everything, I can see where you might have that
    opinion.
    Are all your posts progressive talking points?

    Like

  9. Todd Juvinall Avatar
    Todd Juvinall

    RL, unfortunately the world belongs to those that show up. Meetings, party’s and other forms of people coming together with common ideals. I do agree that there are issues which should bring us all together but for whatever reason they get gamed for political advantage. That is what makes it interesting to me. It is a chess game. When I was elected in 1984, I worked very hard to gain name recognition. I was an unknown, having not been in politics before. Though I grew up here I was busy working and not paying much attention. I always voted but not until the left and their no-growth policies started to become a possibility did I really get involved. I guess you would feel the same way if someone wanted to deprive you of your livelihood. So I ran for Supervisor and knocked on a gazillion doors. I won by 150 votes or so. Even then, after I won, the liberals in Nevada City came after me with a vengeance. I was shocked because I was never attacked so viciously, as were my family. The liberals set the playing field and tried to rig it with lies and hate. I have been unable to agree with them ever since. So, I took a side which reflected my values most closely. I picked a side and though I don’t always agree with the R’s, they are a darn cite better than a liberal.

    Like

  10. RL Crabb Avatar

    And as for the Constitution, I believe that it is the greatest document ever devised by human hands. It is a living constitution, in that the framers realized that it would have to change with the times, that there is no such animal as “three fifths of a person” in a free nation. Black people and women would tend to agree with that notion, I’m sure. It was designed to guarantee the rights of minorities against the government and monied interests. It is there to expand freedom, not stifle it.

    Like

  11. George Rebane Avatar
    George Rebane

    Bob, a careful read of your recent comments on the TPP seems to indicate that you consider TPP members to be far right radicals, not for what they believe or do, but for what you fear they may become at some point in the future. I’m not sure how that kind of anticipative branding differs from that by HSA chief Napolitano when she sent out that confidential memo about the tea party to police chiefs around the country (published on RR). Perhaps she had a more immediate picture of us in mind as those ready to start blowing up bridges and power mains.
    The best I can tell, the debate here is between what I might term ‘classical mainstream Americans’ and the new centrists. BTW, I don’t argue that the American center has not moved toward collectivism; democracies that lose their republican underpinnings always do that.
    But I will gladly admit that my socio-political ideology is anchored on the seminal rights of the Bastiat Triangle and the fiscal responsibility, adherence to the Constitution, and maintenance of free markets tenets of governance. My life experiences have demonstrated to me the folly of the now socialist Democratic party, and I can no longer say that the progressive path of recent Republicans attracts my loyalty – I believe I am one of their most constant and strongest critics (e.g. ask any NC RCC member to whom I have been invited to speak twice). I am no fan of big corporations that totter onward bolstered by the splints and braces of a colluding government.
    All of that makes me a ‘radical rightwinger’ to our neighbors on the left. And from the distance that they view me, they are undoubtedly right.

    Like

  12. D. King Avatar
    D. King

    Maybe this will help you Steven…maybe not?
    I recommend you watch the series.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O_vsaPEajh0
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i3gwwWbinDA

    Like

  13. RL Crabb Avatar

    It’s just my natural skepticism, George. I’m not condemning the Tea Party, just asking what it is they stand for and what they hope to accomplish if elected. Is it freedom and opportunity for all, or just those who think the right way? It’s easy to say that we’ll balance the budget and adhere to the Constitution, but what does that mean? I’ve already heard that some of the group believes that we shouldn’t elect Senators, which would require tinkering with the Constitution. What other amendments do they have in mind? You’re the one who always brings up “the man on the white horse” who will save us from ourselves. Is it so hard to imagine such a savior could emerge from your side of the fence?

    Like

  14. Steven Frisch Avatar
    Steven Frisch

    Well–This has about played itself out.
    I owned and operated my own business for 10 years and made a payroll for 32 employees. During the 5 years before that I managed the budget for 2 other hospitality industry operations, each with a combined budget in the mid $3-$7 ml per year range. Both of them had staffs in the 60-80 person range. Before I moved to Truckee I was the executive chef for a hospitality organization that opened 8 restaurants in the San Diego area over 7 years, where I acted as the opening manager on the management team for 4 of them. I risked 10% of the capital in two of the operations, for which I recieved about a 25% ROI in 3 years. I thought it was a pretty good deal.
    By the way isn’t the TPP organization creating itself as a non-profit? I read that in The Union last week. How about the non-profit CABPRO, that claims it acts like a non-profit, but does not file as one so it does not have to disclose its finances? Is the issue that non-profits are un American? Aren’t churches non-profits? Funny I always thought the the ability of Americans to freely associate was a constitutionally guaranteed right. Seems like the SCOTUS agrees with me on this, since they have decided on it on several occasions.
    Do I really need to justify accepting grants? which comprise only a small portion of my budget. Russ is salivating over getting a couple of million for rural broadband, are you beating him up over it? If people want to donate money is that not their right? You guys are supporters of other non-profits, like the non-profit Heritage Foundation, the American Enterprise Institute, the Reason Foundation. You guys are giddy over the idea that corporations are now considered the same as people. Why? So they can donate money! So why would you beat me up over being associated with a non-profit?
    The problem is your case just does not hold water. so you attack, attack, attack. It has always been the same here.
    I think I will go off to work a long productive week now, and you retirees can sit back and pick your navels while you collect social security!

    Like

  15. Steve Enos Avatar
    Steve Enos

    Barry Pruett asks… “Mr. Enos: Please inform me…what do we agree on?”
    Start with gun rights. I have posted time and time again on this subject.
    There are many other examples. Maybe you should read the posts and get informed.

    Like

  16. Greg Goodknight Avatar
    Greg Goodknight

    RL, the Libertarian Party was essentially an outgrowth of the Peace & Freedom Party, and back when the Gulf War was started (that was under Bush I) those two parties were the only ones I can remember demonstrating against it.
    While “small l” libertarians are the source of most of the good ideas adopted by the Right, the idea that the Libertarian Party are Republicans on steroids just doesn’t fit my experience, especially when I think of the California LP inner circle I met at Timothy Leary’s house when Dr. Leary hosted a reception for Ron Paul, the LP presidential nominee that year. Somehow, I just can’t see any of those folks as über-conservatives.
    When I think of Republicans on steroids, only the Governator comes to mind.

    Like

  17. Mikey McD Avatar

    Goodnight- I wholeheartedly agree with your assessment.

    Like

  18. George Rebane Avatar
    George Rebane

    GG is correct to point out that libertarians and the Libertarian Party are not the same – one is an ideology for governance and the other is a political party that adopts some libertarian principles. On these pages I believe we have been talking only about the libertarian ideology.
    SteveF, thank you for the summary of your business experience. You commit your usual error as you go past that and start putting and attacking words never uttered. No one said they were against non-profits per se. Every one that Jo Ann and I belong to is a recipient of our charitable gifts. To these we give of our time, talents, and treasure; we take not a penny in return. I admit that I and many others look with gimlet eye on people taking money from non-profits. The history of fraud there is ample, and it is always proper to ask what is the nature of the social good that such non-profits claim in return for the people they employ.
    This concludes nothing about you or your non-profit beyond what I have stated above. But if running a non-profit is your prime source of income, a natural question about the benefits the non-profit provides is in order. And that especially since ‘Business’ is your middle name. That you have formerly met payroll is laudable.

    Like

  19. Michael R. Kesti Avatar
    Michael R. Kesti

    “I’m not condemning the Tea Party, just asking what it is they stand for and what they hope to accomplish if elected.”
    The Tea Party Patriots (TPP), despite the word “Party” in their organization’s name, is not a political party such as are The Republican Party and The Democratic Party. The TPP therefore offer no candidates and will not be elected.

    Like

  20. George Rebane Avatar
    George Rebane

    Bob, my responses to your reply are in the initialed square brackets.
    “It’s just my natural skepticism, George. I’m not condemning the Tea Party, just asking what it is they stand for and what they hope to accomplish if elected. [gjr – first, there can be no one elected from the Tea Party Patriots. We don’t endorse candidates, and when asked we tell them and in turn request that they endorse us. The TPP is a movement of more-or-less like minded people from all kinds of political affiliation. Most TPP members are disaffected Republicans and Independents.]
    Is it freedom and opportunity for all, or just those who think the right way? [gjr – I’m not sure how to take that question Bob. You’re not given to snide remarks, and as a professional observer of the political scene, I thought that you knew more about the TPP and the Tea Party movement, so let me just take it at face value. Diverting the country to provide freedom and opportunity for only right thinking people will require changing the Constitution beyond its current built-in capacity (it was not designed to found and underpin an autocracy) and turning the country into more of a police state than even Obama has planned. I witness that TPP members adhere to the Bastiat Triangle and the already noted core principles.]
    It’s easy to say that we’ll balance the budget and adhere to the Constitution, but what does that mean? [gir – Not sure what part of ‘balance the budget’ is confusing so I am at a loss. Consistently coherent volumes have been written about adhering to the Constitution in the strict sense, and modifying it only according to the protocols provided in the document. The prime thrust here is to counter 1) judicial end-runs of the Constitution, and 2) blatant congressional abrogation of the Constitution.]
    I’ve already heard that some of the group believes that we shouldn’t elect Senators, which would require tinkering with the Constitution. [gjr – Indeed, many of us believe that we should go back to the benefits that the original constitutional provision for the election of senators provided. The direct election of senators was made possible by the 17th amendment adopted in 1913 as part of the early 20th century progressive politics most fervently promoted and practiced by President Wilson. To constitutionally redact that amendment would require the passage of another amendment similar to how Prohibition was repealed. Your use of “tinkering” seems to imply something that no TPP member would condone.]
    What other amendments do they have in mind? [gjr – the only ones I’ve heard of from the TPP people I talk to is a ‘balanced budget’ amendment, and an amendment requiring members of Congress to be subject to the same dispensations and obligations as regular citizens – i.e. that they cannot vote themselves largesse not available to the rest of us.]
    You’re the one who always brings up “the man on the white horse” who will save us from ourselves. Is it so hard to imagine such a savior could emerge from your side of the fence? [gjr – no trampled segment of society is immune from welcoming a ‘man on a white horse’ who promises a better tomorrow. Although history does show that it is the collectivists who have more often succumbed to such solutions. Looking at the Obama acceptance speech videos and the follow-on adulations, many on the left believe that Obama may well become their solace and salvation, and in the course invite/demand that he mounts that steed.]”

    Like

  21. Steven Frisch Avatar
    Steven Frisch

    Todd’s comment was that “if they receive their money from grants, or are an employee of a non-profit, …… they cannot be taken seriously as to free markets…” –in which case no one should take the AEI, Reason Foundation, Cato Institute, Heartland Institute, Heritage Foundation, Freedomworks, Pacific Legal Foundation, or any of the myriad of other non-profit think tanks or 501c3 organizations that pontificate about the fantasies of Adam Smith or Frederic Bastiat, seriously. See the double standard here?
    You are free to associate as you wish, it is a freedom we both share…if there is any question about my non-profits ethical standing my funders can take it up with me. After all they get an audited financial statement conducted by an independent third party auditor on an annual basis, along with my budget. The federal government is free to take it up with me as well, they get a 990 form and audited statements. The state can take it up with me, they get my audited statement, my 990, my bylaws, conflict of interest statements, and a list of our assets, in addition to my annual return.
    There is fraud in every industry—I could point out a few cases in American business in the last year–and a few bad apples should not be allowed to be used as a proxy for every member of an industry. My guess is the cost of the aggregate level of fraud in the non-profit sector in the last 200 years is dwarfed by the cost of the aggregate level of fraud perpetrated on the American people by the financial services industry, the auto industry, the defense industry and the oil industry in the last 3 years. By the way if you look with gimlet eye on an employee of a non-profit making wages, I would ask, do you look with gimlet eye on your pastor, priest or minister making wages?
    And I have not ‘formerly met payroll’….you are discounting my current experience…..I am currently making payroll directly for 18 people. Every two weeks.
    Enjoy that social security–

    Like

  22. George Rebane Avatar

    SteveF, I had no idea that you were also running a for-profit business.  Thanks for the clarification; that is most admirable.
     
    Re my gimlet eye – indeed I and my fellow congregants all keep such eyes on our ministers and staff.  I will have more to say in that regard on what my church is going through at this time.

    Like

  23. George Rebane Avatar
    George Rebane

    SteveF, I had no idea that you were also running a for-profit business. Thanks for the clarification; that is most admirable.
    Re my gimlet eye – indeed I and my fellow congregants all keep such eyes on our ministers and staff. I will have more to say in that regard on what my church is going through at this time.

    Like

  24. RL Crabb Avatar

    The Tea Party may not directly endorse candidates, but it’s obvious to most that they are rallying to those who mirror their own thoughts, such as Rand Paul and Mrs. Angle. Why is it that these candidates are being urged to keep their mouths shut? Oh, I know, it’s the pesky mainstream press.
    I’m glad to hear we’ll all be on the level playing field of opportunity, but history has shown that you don’t need to gut the Constitution to favor one side over the other. I assume that tax breaks for anything that smacks of “progressive” will find their playing field in the wilderness.
    What exactly is your problem with the direct election of Senators, anyway?
    The balanced budget amendment and shackling the excesses of congress is okay by me. (Told you I agreed with some of these ideas.)
    Finally, I’m not any more biased against the Tea Party than any other movement, party, club, gang, etc. But I like to know where people stand. At the beginning of Tea movement I distinctly remember it being said that they would avoid certain hot-button issues (like abortion, gay rights, healthcare and others) to focus on economic and constitutional issues. Fine. But those things are still out there and will come up after November.
    My position pretty much mirrors the words of Pete Townsend of The Who, one of “my” generation’s finest songwriters, when he said back in 1970…
    I’ll tip my hat to the new constitution
    Take a bow for the new revolution
    Smile and gleam at the change all around
    Pick up my guitar and play
    Just like yesterday
    Then I’ll get on my knees and pray
    We won’t get fooled again

    Like

  25. George Rebane Avatar
    George Rebane

    Bob, had no idea that Rand Paul and Angle are told to keep their mouths shut. If so, they certainly have not been doing it. Their revelations and forthrightness of their political philosophy and legislative history has gotten them excoriated on the liberal media. I don’t see any of that changing any time soon.
    “gut the Constitution to favor one side over the other” Wow! I’m glad to hear that I’m not the only one who thinks that way. The only gutting of the Constitution that has been going on in the last hundred years has been toward the left, as is readily admitted and celebrated by the progressive intellectuals of that persuasion. All TPP members, me included, promote changes to the Constitution only through its built-in provisions. We consider the extra-Constitutional methods that continue to be applied as ‘gutting the Constitution’ – do you also?
    Not aware that progressives are much for ‘tax breaks’ – if so, I welcome them. Progressives are historically for the forced redistribution of wealth through punitive taxes on ‘the wealthy’ (which always turns out to be the statistical middle class because that’s where the money is), and byzantine tax laws and US codes that mangle markets and favor the their social engineering agendas.
    “What exactly is your problem with the direct election of Senators, anyway?” The 17th amendment did much to gut the intent and function of the 10th amendment which relegated all rights and powers not EXPLICITLY called out for the federal government to be retained by the several states. The Founders correctly saw that if members of the senior house of Congress were appointed by the state legislatures, they would assure that such senators would vote to maintain a maximum of states rights. The collectivists and progressives of the latter half of the 19th century correctly saw that this constitutional provision stood squarely in the way of a strong, pervasive, and growing central government. The easiest way to castrate the 10th amendment was to have senators also be elected by popular vote, a vote that could be directly controlled by promises of federal largesse in one form or another to the usually selectively informed, short-sighted, and therefore compliant voters.
    The 17th amendment passed, and the subsequent growth of central government and the shriveling of states’ rights is history. The Founders saw each individual state as a crucible of innovation and experiment in governance, making mistakes along the way and finding good solutions to be copied as local governments, responsive to local needs, attempted to better the lives of their citizens. This aspect of America’s heritage was directly counter to the Marxist ideal which served as the philosophical basis of most progressive thought in that era.

    Like

  26. Todd Juvinall Avatar
    Todd Juvinall

    It is different when it is your money making the payroll. I guess I didn’t make that clear enough for the slow. I appear to have struck a nerve which has taken a long long response here. If someone claims some expertise at talking the government out of tax payers money, then I suppose that might count for some expertise. When someone defends themselves as vociferously as some have, I would be suspicious.

    Like

  27. RL Crabb Avatar

    Your argument for the selection of Senators sounds good on paper, but given the make-up of today’s legislatures I don’t see where you would get a different result. As I’ve said here before, I don’t think you’ll get much traction on that number.
    Maybe I misspoke about the tax breaks for progressives. You’ll have to forgive me as I am working in a sweatshop with one dinky fan for relief. I meant grants, which I assume will disappear under the new regime. I am wholeheartedly behind any attempt to undo the tangle of rules and restrictions for small businesses. It’s amazing to me that the Dems are so blind they can not see why no one is hiring. Who the hell knows what new tax or regulation will come down the pike tomorrow?
    There is a good deal of blubber in the heads of government these days. Mine too, and it’s melting out my ears. Think I’ll quit here and go take a cold shower.

    Like

  28. Todd Juvinall Avatar
    Todd Juvinall

    RL, I wish you would check out the new governor of New Jersey, Christie. I think you would be impressed.

    Like

  29. Greg Goodknight Avatar
    Greg Goodknight

    GR…. my favorite cartoonist was specifically talking about political parties when Libertarians were described as Republicans on steroids. Perhaps he can describe why.
    I suspect resurrecting Whig as a party name would have been better than trying to use a label that sounds more like libertine (though that fits the “Let’s Party” wing of the LP) and various ne’er do wells have described themselves as ‘libertarian’ to give themselves license to be real SOB’s. Unfortunately, the national LP has been a real amateur hour since the Paul and maybe Marrou candidacies, and the Nevada County LP has has some real nutcases running the show in the past.
    The locals, unlike the state LP officers I’ve met in the past, have fallen into the usual trap of arguing the minutia of what pure of heart Libertarians should believe rather than erecting a big tent that many moderate Republicans and Democrats could also embrace. I.e. be the anti-Federalist party that the Democrats used to be.

    Like

  30. Steven Frisch Avatar
    Steven Frisch

    OK so now its different if its your money making a payroll. Well it was for years. About 20 years.
    But how is it different to use corporate assets to make a payroll as a for profit corporation versus a non-profit organization? It is exactly the same thing. Both are using corporate assets, not their own. By your logic every manager who manages money who is employed by a corporation is not credible. What illogical nonsense.
    Now, if someone defends themselves, they are protesting too much.
    So lets turn around a bit.
    Since we are into transparency and accountability here–Todd you are a founding board member of CABPRO, the California Association of Business Property and Resource Owners, if I remember correctly. An organization, as George would say, with “Business’ as their middle name. Russ Steele is on the board of CABPRO right now, in charge of ‘science’ and perspectives.
    I notice that on the CABPRO membership application they state: “While CABPRO is a not for profit organization, we have deliberately declined the 501c3 status for two reasons. The private corporation designation allows us to keep our membership confidential, and it frees us from unnecessary outside controls”.
    Well, I have news for you boys, if you do not have the 501c3 status you can not claim to be a “not for profit organization”. The reason is that you do not have the accountability required to qualify as one. Second, the statement that being a private corporation allows you to keep your membership confidential is a half truth at best, because according to the US Supreme Court ALL corporations, non profit and for profit, are allowed to keep their membership confidential. It is covered under the first amendment and has been consistently upheld.
    And why is it that CABPRO is not registered as a non-profit? They do take donations don’t they? They have membership dues? Paid advertising in their newsletter?
    The reason is that if they are chartered as a private corporation they never need to disclose any of their financial information. That also means that members never know how their money is being spent. When is the last time CABPRO shared an audited financial statement with their members?
    Why is it that I am willing to hold my organization to the highest standards of financial review, audits, share my data with every funder, file required federal income tax forms, file my bylaws with the California Secretary of State, file conflict of interest statements, and provide audited data to my board to review my performance on annual basis; and CABPRO, an organization you have long been associated with, and Russ serves on the board of, does not do any of that?
    Who is accountable?

    Like

  31. RL Crabb Avatar

    When I think of Libertarians, I think of people who want to take freedom quite literally. I did a cartoon on political parties a few years back and I described them as Republicans on acid. (It’s included in my soon to be released book.) Maybe that’s a better description. Sounds like Greg has had similar experiences.
    Mikey McD…I expect you to take issue with me on that, since you claim to be libertarian. (Big L or small?)

    Like

  32. Steven Frisch Avatar
    Steven Frisch

    A libertarian is a guy who rails against government and taxes but bitches if his house is on fire and the fire department is not there in 60 seconds.

    Like

  33. Jeff Pellne Avatar
    Jeff Pellne

    Steve nailed it! You see it all the time.

    Like

  34. George Rebane Avatar
    George Rebane

    SteveF, unfortunately the logic you are guided by in your ‘make payroll’ and ‘house on fire’ comments is unique to the mindset you subscribe to (and it may even have an axiomatic basis since there exist multiple logics). But what points to the schism or chasm between our points of view is that you don’t recognize the difference between enterprises that generate wealth from which all social goods derive, and enterprises that consume that very same wealth in carrying out their activities. No, I don’t see them, or the industry of their managers in bringing (especially government) grants to pay their staffs, as being equivalent.
    Re your second piece of logic – principled “railing against government” is a right and perhaps an obligation of all free peoples who see government as their servant. Demanding a certain level of performance from government services as a law abiding taxpayer is an independent consideration. The simplistic characterization of equating them will not get you far with most people not of the left, they will know that you are either ignorant of the difference, or that you are attempting to pander them. Of course, there is always the third class in the rooting section that thinks you have cleverly nailed the argument, but we don’t need to go down that road too far.
    Please don’t confuse libertarian principles and ideology with that of anarchists. The Cato Institute has done a wonderful job educating people on the difference.

    Like

  35. Todd Juvinall Avatar
    Todd Juvinall

    You need to talk to Martin Light since I haven’t been in CABPRO for many years. Martin is a very bright, intelligent gent and you might learn something good from him. I appreciate your self defense since many not for profits and NGO’s are abused by their managers. They seem to be in the paper every day, someone swiping the money, taking trips to Hawaii and buying very expensive suites in some of the finest hotels. You probably are one of the rare ones from the environmental non profits that don’t practice that, right? Most eco non profits use lies and deception to raise money from people, sort of like Bernie Madoff’s strategy. My guess is you are probably straight and would never fib to raise a buck. As far as CABPRO is concerned, you need to have a bit more history here and maybe you would understand why it exists. But, hey, I am just a regular joe, kinda funny, and the bain f liberals and phony non profits.

    Like

  36. Todd Juvinall Avatar
    Todd Juvinall

    My last comment was for Frish. BTW, I thought he was a libertarian.

    Like

  37. Jeff Pellne Avatar
    Jeff Pellne

    I wonder if George cashed his “stimulus check” from Obama, tore it up or donated it to his favorite charity.

    Like

  38. Todd Juvinall Avatar
    Todd Juvinall

    What did you do with yours? A new subscription to Sunset Magazine perhaps?

    Like

  39. Steven Frisch Avatar
    Steven Frisch

    Todd I was here in long before 1993 and know exactly when and why and how CABPRO was formed. I noticed that you did not actually answer the question. You were a founder, participated in making that decision, and there is no accountability….period. I also noticed that you did not respond about your buddy Russ’s current role either.
    You guys are idiots..plain and simple.

    Like

  40. Todd Juvinall Avatar
    Todd Juvinall

    Ah, the over educated name caller. What a revealing look into your non intellect. Go back to your dolls.

    Like

  41. Jeff Pellne Avatar
    Jeff Pellne

    Wow. As a native Californian, I have to pinch myself that this county is still in my home state. Now I know what it must have been like to stumble on the Rancho La Brea Tar Pits in the 1700s – “a land that time forgot.” Don’t tell the real estate agents or the job seekers.

    Like

  42. Russ Steele Avatar

    Steven you wrote:
    “Russ Steele is on the board of CABPRO right now, in charge of ‘science’ and perspectives.” I am not a Board Member. I am freelance writer that has a gig to write for the CANPRO Report. I was asked to consult on AB32 issues given my long term relationship with environmental issues, and I have given some pro-bono advise on the subject. I am not a Board member, not do I plan to be a Board member.

    Like

  43. Jeff Pellne Avatar
    Jeff Pellne

    Are you paid?

    Like

  44. Jeff Pellne Avatar
    Jeff Pellne

    Russ,
    Are you paid?

    Like

  45. Barry Pruett Avatar

    95 comments?! George…you hit a nerve I think. LOL

    Like

  46. Steven Frisch Avatar
    Steven Frisch

    Russ –do you have any responsibility for the practices of the “not for profit” that you write for?
    What do you think of an organization that accepts donations and does not protect its donors by agreeing to the legal standards and transparency required of a nonprofit?
    You might want to look at the CABPRO web site. They have you listed as a board member.

    Like

  47. Jeff Pellne Avatar
    Jeff Pellne

    No Barry, George didn’t hit a nerve. If he had, people would be commenting on your blog too. But nobody is. LOL cubed.

    Like

  48. Barry Pruett Avatar

    Maybe I’ll start having Gloria Zane comment…LOL.

    Like

  49. Jeff Pellne Avatar
    Jeff Pellne

    Barry,
    You lost the clerk recorder race in EVERY precinct, and distanced yourself from the Tea Party. Now you’re a “spokesperson.” Can you explain how you’re going to “rise like a phoenix” politically?

    Like

  50. Todd Juvinall Avatar
    Todd Juvinall

    My my my, Pelline and Frish, now there is a pair. Pelline has never run for anything as far as I know and Frish has never met a payroll with his own money. Yet they seem to think they know something. I just hake my head in amazement at their ignorance. Barry, did you loan them money or something? I haven’t seen such childish rants from the left since….yesterday. This Frish character is quite a story teller too. Russ, when the liberal can’t defeat the facts, the attack the messenger. I consider them gnats.

    Like

Leave a comment